My Purpose

voicecrying said:
You can word it any way you want. It still was a change.
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i didn;t say it wasn;t..... i did say that one result of trumps presidency by way of his appointment of conservative judges was a change...... .... a definite change - back towards an understanding of the constitution that should have never been changed away from...... .. if that makes any sense........i actually said it in these words quoted below.....

aleshanee: ...that is one way trump brought about change
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maybe i should have said that was the only way he brought about change.... ... but that one thing is what making liberals so angry right now..... they no longer have the unrestricted right to kill their children still in the womb or immediately after they are born in any state or city they want to....... ...so yes that was a change.... and it;s one that has a lasting effect......

what i said about the other things trump did is that biden reversed them with an executive order immediately after taking office.... ..so they were not a change that lasted more than the term of one presidency.... just temporary pause in the obamaesque liberal onslaught to draconian socialism....
 
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BTW Tears for Fears was my #1 guilty pleasure during my anti-rock'n roll phase.
 
and ... i never said anybody had to vote for trump... ... in this country we are free to vote for whoever we want ... or to not vote at all if we choose.... ... but freedom comes with responsibilities.... ...and exercising freedom the wrong way comes with a price... unfortunately with regards to elections it;s a price we all pay no matter how we voted - if enough people in the country vote the wrong way.......

that might sound like a harsh thing to say.... ..but in my opinion if i have to endure being called a trump worshipper.. an accomplice to his immoral and bad behavior... .. and hear all the other demeaning put downs and labels the trump haters like to slap us with - then i should be free to make that kind of statement in reply....... ..besides... i have very personal reasons for being against abortion... .. and i mean against it in all cases other than saving the life of the mother when there is no other option.......

that doesn;t mean i would not vote for a candidate that wanted to legalize abortion if both candidates wanted it legal.... and there was no viable candidate that was against it.... i can and i have before..... . .i look at all parts of a candidates platform and vote for the one who would have the best overall effect on the country... ..and in regards to abortion which one would restrict abortion the most and actually has a chance to be elected........ ... ..i see throwing my vote away on a 3rd party loser as doing nothing more than causing the better viable candidate to lose.... and the absolute worse candidate to be elected.....
 
voicecrying said:
Isn't that (change the world) the main argument, though, why people say we have to vote for Trump?
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The main argument I've heard about voting for Trump, especially during this Biden dystopia, is to save America. Basically to resist the leftist oppression being imposed by Democrats, who basically just need to change their name to the Nazi party now.

"Change the world" is a mantra I've heard for decades primarily from secular university students and graduates and leftist activists, who've picked it up in their indoctrination.

I also hear it in the high school settings. They are the generation to "change the world."

It's akin to their lesser known mantra "Unlearn," which means to cleanse one's mind of the foundations of Western thought, which they're told is the root of all the injustice in the world.

Unfortunately that thought has crept into Christian thinking, because "Go ye into all the world and preach the Gospel to every creature" sounds to many like "change the world." But it isn't 'change the world' any more than 'every creature' encompasses dandelions and stray dogs.
 
voicecrying said:
Isn't that (change the world) the main argument, though, why people say we have to vote for Trump?
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I don’t know the many people you reference, but as for me…it’s politics and you vote for who ever tells you they believe what you believe…or as close to what you believe as possible. And not every politician can bring change…we have, after all, a system containing checks and balances.
 
voicecrying said:
Isn't that (change the world) the main argument, though, why people say we have to vote for Trump?
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If we are keeping the discussion "in-house" (evangelical and fundamentalist voters) then I think that what Macarthur writes here about the false charge of Christian Nationalism has great merit. Essentially, he is saying that we should participate in both realms (political AND eccelesiastical), but not to mistake the purpose of the two, which is what I (and I think others here on the FFF) have argued. If, on the other hand you are including the secular and cultural Christian voters in your "we have to vote for Trump" statement, then I think you actually do get people that want to participate in the political process with a wrong-headed theological approach (to "change the world").
 
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It is to the point now that I can't see voting for a democrat for Dog Catcher. The idology of the party itself is so far from good governance I can't support anyone who would carry the brand of Democrat. I know many democrat voters who are sensable and moderate and relate to the conservative blue dog democrats of the distance past. They do not support the policies of the modern democrat platform yet they vote blue each and every time.

Bill Clinton and JFK could never get elected in a democratic primary today. I know they were not true conservatives but they were both to the right of their party on many issues at the time and would be unelectable as democrats today.

Concerning Democrat policies:

Open borders
Trangender issues inclusing sports
Expanding social programs
Government control
Higher taxes on working class and the rich
Larger government
More Regulation
Anti Voter ID policies
Teaching Critical Race Theory in schools
Legalizing drugs
Expanded EPA and Climate change policy
Criminal justace reform
Soft on crime and no bail policies.
Early parole policies.
Student loan forgiviness
BLM
LGBTQ agenda
Expanding abortion rights
Banning firearm ownership
Social equality agenda
pro global agenda
Socialist agenda
Anti energy independence.

For those of you who are on the fence, which of these policies do you relate to. Which of these policies do you support.

Feel free to post any I may have missed, I'm sure there are a bunch.
 
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sword said:
It is to the point now that I can't see voting for a democrat for Dog Catcher. The idology of the party itself is so far from good governance I can't support anyone who would carry the brand of Democrat. I know many democrat voters who are sensable and moderate and relate to the conservative blue dog democrats of the distance past. They do not support the policies of the modern democrat platform yet they vote blue each and every time.

Bill Clinton and JFK could never get elected in a democratic primary today. I know they were not true conservatives but they were both to the right of their party on many issues at the time and would be unelectable as democrats today.

Concerning Democrat policies:

Open borders
Trangender issues inclusing sports
Expanding social programs
Government control
Higher taxes on working class and the rich
Larger government
More Regulation
Anti Voter ID policies
Teaching Critical Race Theory in schools
Legalizing drugs
Expanded EPA and Climate change policy
Criminal justace reform
Soft on crime and no bail policies.
Early parole policies.
Student loan forgiviness
BLM
LGBTQ agenda
Expanding abortion rights
Banning firearm ownership
Social equality agenda
pro global agenda
Socialist agenda
Anti energy independence.

For those of you who are on the fence, which of these policies do you relate to. Which of these policies do you support.
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You forgot to list war.
 
Ekklesian said:
You forgot to list war.
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Both parties seem to get us involved in conflicts around the world, justified or not.

Republicans tend to be much stronger on national defense and Hawks when it comes to using troops around the world.
 
sword said:
Both parties seem to get us involved in conflicts around the world, justified or not.

Republicans tend to be much stronger on national defense and Hawks when it comes to using troops around the world.
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Allow me to clarify: prolonged and interminable wars.
 
Ekklesian said:
Allow me to clarify: prolonged and interminable wars.
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The Iraq was and the war in Afganastn were 2 of the longest wars in US History.

Iraq war March 20, 2003 to December 18, 2011
War in Afganistan October 7, 2001 to August 30, 2021

Both wars were initiated by George W. Bush, the 43rd president and a Republican.

We technacally had troops deployed to Vietnam from November 1, 1955 to the fall of Siagon on April 30, 1975

The original troops were sent as the Military Assistance Advisory Group by President Eisenhower a Republican.
 
Major operations were ended in May of 2003 in the Iraqi War. But a military presence was necessary for stability in the region and the security of the U.S. That war was actually part of the response for the 9-11 attacks. So, no. The war in Iraq did not last 8 years. And not in reality initiated by the U.S.

Same with Afghanistan. That was not a twenty year conflict, and Obama increased the U.S. involvement there. Again, military presence is not the same thing.

But I would just draw your attention to the Ukraine.
 
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