Sanctification

Santification is,

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    6
Foghorn said:
Do we work with God in our salvation?
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Your question contains vagueness. “Salvation” is a general term that in simple terms is comprised of regeneration, sanctification, and glorification. Folk in your (and Ransoms) camp generally agree that humans don’t “work with” God in those aspects of salvation relating to regeneration and glorification, but there is varying degrees of hair-splitting on the mode of synergy in sanctification. Many monergistic theologians do fall into the synergistic form of sanctification camp however.
 
Ransom said:
OK, so now answer my question. Do we agree that we are not passive in our sanctification, as we are passive in our regeneration?
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Salvation is of the Lord. In which way do you work with God to save you?
 
Foghorn said:
Salvation is of the Lord. In which way do you work with God to save you?
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You mean sanctify you. When you switch terminology back and forth like this, it makes you look dishonest.

And you keep dodging my question. Do we agree that we are not passive in our sanctification, as we are passive in our regeneration?

Note how I used specific words. Go and do thou likewise.
 
Ransom said:
You mean sanctify you. When you switch terminology back and forth like this, it makes you look dishonest.

And you keep dodging my question. Do we agree that we are not passive in our sanctification, as we are passive in our regeneration?

Note how I used specific words. Go and do thou likewise.
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Not trying to sound too condescending, but Foghorn would do well to take your post deeply into consideration. The article I linked by reformed authors pretty much says the same thing, just with a bunch of 2-dollar words.
 
ALAYMAN said:
Not trying to sound too condescending, but Foghorn would do well to take your post deeply into consideration. The article I linked by reformed authors pretty much says the same thing, just with a bunch of 2-dollar words.
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"we are on dangerous ground if we imply that we are passive in sanctification in the same way we are passive in regeneration."

It's been some time, but that article may very well be where I picked up that particular phraseology.
 
Foghorn said:
Wow, I guess I'm alone in believing Sanctification is monergistic. :giggle:
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If I was all alone in my position, I would seriously evaluate my stand. I would also closely evaluate the company I was keeping.

I am sure I would be the only one who believed salvation was all of grace without works if I were on a Catholic forum.

I would probably be the only one who believed that God is sovereign in whom he saves on an Arminian forum.

I would probably be the only one who believed that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of the Living God on a Jehovah Witness forum

I would probably be the only one who believed that God is eternal and immutable, and that Jesus Christ is eternally existent with the Father on a LDS (Mormon) forum.

And so it goes. I believe we have some good thinkers here on this forum and a healthy diversity of beliefs where you can examine your position over that which others believe. Based upon the responses I have seen, you have received this and seem quite gracious regarding the feedback. Good to have you here!
 
Foghorn said:
Well, you would be doing them of your own free will, because you desire to. The more you are sanctified, mortify the flesh, and become more Christlike, the more your desire is to do good.
IMO, if you believe you must do good, working with God, for sanctification and conforming yourself to his image, then all of salvation is not of God, you play a small part.
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I look at it from this perspective. Prior to our salvation, we are dead in trespasses and sins. Therefore to do anything else other than to "Stink," God must bring forth his work and grant us repentance and faith in order to believe. Faith cometh by hearing, hearing by the word of God, Etc. You are born again by incorruptible seed, the Word of God through the foolishness of preaching by the POWER OF GOD!

Our salvation is therefore monergistic. I think we both agree here.

Those who are in Christ are no longer "Dead in Sin," but they are "Dead to sin" in that it no longer brings about condemnation. We also have the "New Man" who desires new things the "Old Man" never before desired! We further understand that these two natures are "Warring" against each other (flesh lusteth against the spirit and the spirit against the flesh...) that Paul speaks of in Rom 7 and tells us in no uncertain terms that he continues to war even as he speaks! The bottom line is that we consciously and actively choose to "Yield" ourselves to Christ as instruments of righteousness.

Our salvation is therefore synergistic in this sense but monergistic in that God performs it and we can take no glory or credit of our selves.

The culmination of our sanctification will be the Judgment Seat of Christ but even then we will ultimately cast our crowns at Jesus feet understanding that without him, we could truly do nothing!
 
Baptist Renegade said:
If I was all alone in my position, I would seriously evaluate my stand. I would also closely evaluate the company I was keeping.
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I think he meant alone here. :p But he's not.


Baptist Renegade said:
Our salvation is therefore synergistic in this sense but monergistic in that God performs it and we can take no glory or credit of our selves.

The culmination of our sanctification will be the Judgment Seat of Christ but even then we will ultimately cast our crowns at Jesus feet understanding that without him, we could truly do nothing!
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There's no question our conversion felt synergistic, but it wasn't in truth.

I think the argument for synergy (is that a word?) in sanctification is made on the same basis. It feels that way. But if one concedes that it is God by His grace working in us to do His will, doesn't that negate synergy?

Is the suckling babe cooperating with its nurse? Is its nourishment and growth a result of its volition, or the life that is in it?
 
Ekklesian said:
There's no question our conversion felt synergistic, but it wasn't in truth.
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I think I made a typo in this line you are responding to. What I meant to say is:

Our sanctification is therefore synergistic in this sense but monergistic in that God performs it and we can take no glory or credit of our selves.

While it is true that it seems we are making the "best decision of our life" when we are trusting Christ," we understand later as we read and study the scriptures that the only reason we come to Christ is because we have been chosen and drawn to Christ by the Father. Without God's intervention, we would still be headed to Hell and rightfully so.

That we even have a desire to be like Christ is because of the work God has performed in us. It is certainly not of ourselves.

Where our SANCTIFICATION is synergistic lies in the reality that we still have our old nature that can stand in the way, impede, grieve, and quench the work of the Holy Spirit in our lives. The part required of us in our sanctification is therefore to yield ourselves to God.
 
Foghorn said:
I think Sproul agrees with Calvin that it is Monergistic. But I could be wrong.



The Institutes Book 3 Chapter 4 9-11.

(Those who are regenerated, justified by faith alone, 9-11)
9. Also, True believers do no good works of themselves

Now let's examine what righteousness is possessed by those whom we have placed in the fourth class. We confess that while through the intersession of Christ's righteousness, God reconciles us to Himself, and by free remission of sins accounts us righteous, his beneficence is at the same time joined with such a mercy that through his Holy Spirit he dwells in us and by his power the lusts of our flesh are each day more and more mortified; we are indeed sanctified, that is, consecrated to the Lord in true purity of life, with our hearts formed to obedience to the law. The end is that our special will may be to serve his will and by every means to advance his glory alone.

But even while by the leading of the Holy Spirit we walk in the ways of the Lord, to keep us from forgetting ourselves and becoming puffed up, traces of our imperfection remain to give us occasion for humility. Scripture says: There is no righteous man, no man who will do good and not sin [Eccl. 7:21, Vg.; cf 1 kings 8:46]. What sort of righteousness will they obtain, then, from their works? First, I say that the best work that can be brought forward from them is still always spotted and corrupted with some impurity of the flesh, and has, so to speak, some dregs mixed with it. Let a holy servant of God, I say, choose from the whole course of his life what of an especially noteworthy character he thinks he has done. Let him well turn over in his mind its several parts. Undoubtedly he will somewhere perceive that it savors of rottenness of the flesh since our eagerness for well-doing is never what it ought to be but our great weakness slows down our running in the race. Although we see that the stains that bespatter the works of the saints are plainly visible, though we admit that they are only the slightest spots, they will not offend God's
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Foghorn said:
eyes, before which not even the stars are pure [Job 25:5]?
We have not a single work going forth from the saints that if it be judged in itself deserves not shame as its just reward.
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You are correct. R.C. Sproul is one of my favorite theologians. Our farm was only a few miles from RC's place in Ligonier, Pa
 
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