I’d consider it a guide or roadmap for Christians given by God.
Catholic vs Calvinist (if you had to choose)
- Thread starter DrHuk&Duck
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You are right: it is guide - to bring us to Christ. After that, we are not under that guide:
So then, the law was our guardian until Christ came, in order that we might be justified by faith. But now that faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian, for in Christ Jesus you are all sons of God, through faith.
Galatians 3:24-26
The law ministers death:
Now if the ministry of death, carved in letters on stone, came with such glory that the Israelites could not gaze at Moses' face because of its glory, which was being brought to an end,
2 Corinthians 3:7
Coming to Christ releases you from the law:
But now we are released from the law, having died to that which held us captive, so that we serve in the new way of the Spirit and not in the old way of the written code.
Romans 7:6
The law was given so we would see our sin:
Now the law came in to increase the trespass, but where sin increased, grace abounded all the more,
Romans 5:20
Sin gets its power from the law:
The sting of death is sin, and the power of sin is the law.
1 Corinthians 15:56
The law is for the unrighteous.
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Rom 3:20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.
Rom 7:7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.
Rom 7:8 But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of evil desire. For without the law sin was dead.
Rom 8:3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
Rom 8:4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
Jesus came to fulfill the law which is something no human can do because of our sinful nature. If it was possible for us to keep the law then there was no reason for Christ to have come and died for our sins.
“The law is like a moral mirror. It shuts our mouths and opens our eyes. It condemns but does not convert. It challenges but does not change. It points the finger but can’t give mercy. It drives us to Jesus, who has the answer we are looking for.” Greg Laurie
Assurance of salvation, the reasoning for following the law, confession to man, clerical celibacy, etc., are all items that I’d be uncomfortable with at this point in time. Obviously, it’s also a different culture from the Southern-style Baptist churches I’ve attended my entire life. There are several aspects of the Catholic Church that I also find appealing, but that’s a different topic for a different day.
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Y'all need to get some new lines. That "you don't understand" crap is for the birds.
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I agree!
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They teach a work based, idolatry laden type of gospel, but NOT the GOSPEL of JESUS CHRIST.
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Joe obviously you just don’t understand this issue.Y'all need to get some new lines. That "you don't understand" crap is for the birds.
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Calvinist doctrine can be illustrated and defended by scripture.
Much of Catholic doctrine is unbiblical.
Much of Catholic doctrine is unbiblical.
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Someone who dies desiring baptism but unable to receive it due to death or martyrdom accounts for 1% of deaths. What about the other 99%?
When they say they know of no way other than baptism to "assure entry into eternal beatitude," that's not slippery at all.
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From the Sixth session of the Council of Trent:
Canon 15: If anyone says that a man who is born again and justified is bound ex fide [from faith] to believe that he is certainly in the number of the predestined, let him be anathema.
Canon 16: If anyone says that he will for certain, with an absolute and infallible certainty, have that great gift of perseverance even to the end, unless he shall have learned this by a special revelation, let him be anathema.
It seems the Counter-Reformation Council of Trent declares belief in perseverance worthy of anathema, while the Bible declares it a fact (1 John 5:13).
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Nobody here (not even the new forum member by that name) is saying that it is not obligatory for a Protestant or Catholic to keep the Ten Commandments. You are dodging the real issue. The real issue is, should we agree with the Catechism of the Catholic Church that "observance of the Ten Commandments" is a part of the gospel, and that "all men may attain salvation through faith, Baptism and the observance of the Commandments?”
"But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness." - Romans 4:5
"And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then is it no more grace: otherwise work is no more work." - Romans 11:6
The Catholic Church talks about salvation by grace, but they will not affirm salvation by grace alone.
"The official teaching of Roman Catholicism is that salvation is not by faith alone, through grace alone, in Christ alone. The Roman Catholic Church teaches that one must have good works and observe the rituals of Roman Catholicism in order to be saved. . . .
"Here is a summary of the official Roman Catholic teaching on salvation: to be saved, a person must receive Christ as Savior by faith, be baptized in the Trinitarian formula, be infused with additional grace by observing the Catholic sacraments, especially the Eucharist, and then die without any unconfessed mortal sins."
Are Catholics saved? | GotQuestions.org
Are Catholics saved? Do Catholics go to heaven? If a person adheres to Roman Catholic beliefs and practices, is he/she saved?
www.gotquestions.org
My advice to anyone who believes in salvation by keeping the Ten Commandments is, Make sure you keep them all perfectly - otherwise you are going to be in big trouble: "For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all." - James 2:10
Excellent article from a trustworthy source.Are Catholics saved? | GotQuestions.org
Are Catholics saved? Do Catholics go to heaven? If a person adheres to Roman Catholic beliefs and practices, is he/she saved?www.gotquestions.org
I understand the verses the Protestants use as a means for interpretation and justification. I also understand the context is interpreted differently by the Catholics. I’m certainly not going to settle this conflict any more than I can settle the question of Calvinism. But I do think about the fact that Martin Luther, who initiated the Protestant Reformation, and prior to his Ninety-Five Theses, was in fact a Catholic priest. Don’t we all agree that our ancestry is Catholic?
Nope. Catholicism is a corruption of the Faith. Always has been. Claims that Peter was the first Pope don't hold any truth. If you read how Peter, Paul, James and Jude confronted false teachings in each of their epistles, you'll see there is no way they would have been Catholic. I don't know how the faithful remnant resisted Catholic dogma but I believe if God can tell Elijah that He had preserved for Himself 7,000 in Israel who had not bowed the knee to baal, I believe He was perfectly capable of preserving a faithful remnant who stood up to the Catholic Church during the time that history tells us Catholicism was the only "Christian" church.
Are you suggesting that the garden variety of Protestant denominations did not come from the Catholic Church? Martin Luther was excommunicated and began Lutheranism in the 1500s. The other denominations spun off from there.
I am suggesting that there has always been a remnant. The faithful did not cease to exist after the Catholic Church came into being then came back into play with the Protestant Reformation.
Yes, I forgot about the Eastern Orthodox Church, and it is pre-Luther. But I still read it split from the Catholic Church in the Great Schism of 1054.
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So whose interpretation is the correct one, and how do you know this?
Or do you just adopt the defeatist attitude of giving up any hope of knowing because people disagree?
You appear to be ignoring that Luther left, and he had reasons. At that point, the fact he was formerly a member of a false religion is far less relevant.
I'm not talking about denominations of any kind. The faithful remnant have been around through the centuries. Some may have gravitated to the groups that split from the RCC but the splinter groups don't necessarily account for all of the remnant believers. Again, I don't know how the remnant faithful stood up to Catholic dogma but they've been around since the first false teachings.