Christians and Politics

[biscuit1953]

Jack Hibbs says he will leave California and encourage his congregation to do so also if this bill passes. A random person can walk into your child’s school and take him. This is the bill proposed in California for the purpose of protecting children from ICE and Trump. Should Jack Hibbs be forced to resign because he is involved in politics? Is he corrupting the gospel for opposing Gavin Newsome and calling out the Democrats?

 

[Tarheel Baptist]

Jack Hibbs says he will leave California and encourage his congregation to do so also if this bill passes. A random person can walk into your child’s school and take him. This is the bill proposed in California for the purpose of protecting children from ICE and Trump. Should Jack Hibbs be forced to resign because he is involved in politics? Is he corrupting the gospel for opposing Gavin Newsome and calling out the Democrats?

Some here believe voting Republican and publicly standing against gay and trans rights makes you a Christian Nationalist.

 

[abcaines]

Jack Hibbs says he will leave California and encourage his congregation to do so also if this bill passes. A random person can walk into your child’s school and take him. This is the bill proposed in California for the purpose of protecting children from ICE and Trump. Should Jack Hibbs be forced to resign because he is involved in politics? Is he corrupting the gospel for opposing Gavin Newsome and calling out the Democrats?

Should the pastors who preached against slavery during the 19th century have stepped down because they were corrupting the Gospel with politics?

How about preaching against abortion today?

 

[Ransom]

Should the pastors who preached against slavery during the 19th century have stepped down because they were corrupting the Gospel with politics?

It happened. Entebellum Secretary of State and Senator from Kentucky, Henry Clay, believed that the controversy in the churches over slavery was needlessly divisive and a threat to national unity.

Clay himself was opposed to slavery, although he personally owned slaves and was in favour of a moderate approach to abolition. Needless to say, his position was conflicted and inconsistent.

How about preaching against abortion today?

No shortage of ministers who won't bring up abortion in the pulpits because it's too political or divisive.

I imagine most of them genuinely believe abortion is murder, but that just makes their position as inconsistent as Clay's. So you oppose murder, but won't preach against it in church because it's too divisive a topic? Pfft. Grow a pair.

 

[Ransom]

The church has a God-mandated responsibility to oppose what God opposes and to command what he commands. Sometimes, this has a political dimension: witness the ongoing discourse over abortion or sexuality, or historically the aforementioned abolition of slavery.

Where the moral is political, it is the church's business. Where she has no business is partisan politics. The Scriptures, not the Republican or Democratic party, decides what is right or wrong.

So the question is: Is the issue in the OP (which I infer to mean ICE coming into schools and arresting the children of illegal immigrants) biblical, or partisan?

 

[abcaines]

The church has a God-mandated responsibility to oppose what God opposes and to command what he commands. Sometimes, this has a political dimension: witness the ongoing discourse over abortion or sexuality, or historically the aforementioned abolition of slavery.

Where the moral is political, it is the church's business. Where she has no business is partisan politics. The Scriptures, not the Republican or Democratic party, decides what is right or wrong.

So the question is: Is the issue in the OP (which I infer to mean ICE coming into schools and arresting the children of illegal immigrants) biblical, or partisan?

The issue isn't "protecting illegal immigrants from ICE" but exposing all children, whether immigrants or citizens, to nefarious abduction.

 

[Ransom]

The issue isn't "protecting illegal immigrants from ICE" but exposing all children, whether immigrants or citizens, to nefarious abduction.

Is ICE in the habit of going into schools and abducting the children of citizens and legal immigrants?

 

[abcaines]

Is ICE in the habit of going into schools and abducting the children of citizens and legal immigrants?

To hear it from California Democrats, yes.

 

[Ransom]

To hear it from California Democrats, yes.

Of course, California Democrats are stupid, so that shouldn't come as a surprise.

My reaction is the same as the host's in that video: So you're saying some random person can go to the school with this piece of paper and just take my child? And that summary--which Hibbs agrees with--is wildly implausible even for California Democrats.

As far as I can tell from my rather limited research outside this video, AB 495 allows parents to designate relatives or close family friends to care for their children temporarily in the event of a family separation due to immigration enforcement. Which would mean it's not a "random person" who takes the piece of paper to the school, it's the persons designated in the affidavit who do so.

On the other hand, it's fair to ask, who is Jack Hibbs, and what makes him credible on this topic?

It's fair to say that California Democrats are deranged and a bill like this is probably legitimately full of overreactions to the policies, yea, the very existence, of ICE or Donald Trump. But adding one's own overreactions to those doesn't help matters. It only distracts from the real issues by obscuring them with woo-woo.

 

[abcaines]

On the other hand, it's fair to ask, who is Jack Hibbs, and what makes him credible on this topic?

It's fair to say that California Democrats are deranged and a bill like this is probably legitimately full of overreactions to the policies, yea, the very existence, of ICE or Donald Trump. But adding one's own overreactions to those doesn't help matters. It only distracts from the real issues by obscuring them with woo-woo.

I agree to a point. Jack Hibbs is a CC guy... Probably the hottest name in the movement right now. Anything he says, his disciples/fans are going to take hook, line and sinker, even folks at our little CC in podunk Idaho.

On the other hand, as you astutely pointed out, California Democrats are a slimy pit of vipers willing to overreact to anything that smacks of Trump and ICE. Hibbs does seem to be in the same panic mode over Newsome and his minions that they are over Trump. However, I'll give more deference to Hibbs' position. I just hope Hibbs can make his point with empirical proof instead of zeal.

 

[subllibrm]

To hear it from California Democrats, yes.

So to counter ICE employing nefarious abductions, they are proposing to allow some other entity to abduct children nefariously. That makes sense.

BTW who is it chomping at the bit to nefariously abduct children? It seems like the person bent nefarious child abduction would pursue their goals elsewhere.

BTW II if child abduction from schools is legalized does it remain nefarious?