Jack Hyles died 25 years ago, today.

[sawthruglassclearly]

I realize that there are many opinions about Jack Hyles put forth on this board. Today marks the 25th anniversary of his death. He left an indelible mark on my life. I mean, I'm talking about him today, 45 years after I left the place. So, there's that.

I wish I hadn't gone to HAC. I likely could have spent those years better elsewhere. But those were necessary years for me. They hardened me for what was to come in my life. I came to HAC as a very immature kid of eighteen. I had no idea what I wanted to do with my life. The HAC years, in retrospect, paved a path for me to grow up that would lead away from there to many different places. I have been blessed to have been given the life I have lived since leaving there.

Looking back, it pains me to say that I believe that much of what I heard from the pulpit at FBC and HAC was lies. I really don't believe all of those stories where Jack Hyles always emerged the hero. I think he grew up a very insecure boy and spent his life trying to live up to the idolized person that his secret self craved. I would call it a "Walter Mitty Complex."

That said, he was charismatic. He made people want to follow him. And as a kid from the south in the 1970's, I followed him. I believed in him. In my own way, I loved him. Amid the insanity that was my life for several years, I also witnessed him do some very good things. He could be a man who sometimes shared a lot of simple, good wisdom, such as the productivity of living by a schedule, a principle that has served me well to this day.

But now he is gone from us a quarter century. His legacy in the form of his church, college and even his family, did not take very long to dissolve. In many ways his story is a tragedy, albeit one that he mostly penned. I think he made a lot of mistakes and was a man who rarely, if ever admitted such.

I remember during my time there (76-81) I would hear him tell stories of people like Bob Jones or J. Frank Norris and frankly, they were people that I knew nothing about. They were mere historic figures to me and mostly, when I tried to read their sermons of years gone by, I was unenthused. Now, when I look at photos of today's Hyles Anderson students, I realize that they were largely not yet born on this day in 2001 and I wonder if when they hear about the man whose name their college still bears, do they think of him as I thought of Bob Jones in the seventies... just some man that I am supposed to admire and respect, but actually know little about.

And so the time has passed quickly and I wonder if there will still be any remnant of this man that I once held so respectfully in another 25 years and I think, whatever it may be, it will be unrecognizable to anyone who knew him when he was alive. And those circles of life close each day.

It has been my experience that those who were either ruined by or observed the extensive ruination and saw a path out of that place don’t think about him all the time, but cannot help but be reminded.
I come to this space from both. I attended his schools from the mid ‘70’s to the early ‘80’s, though I was in the church throughout my formative years.
I don’t believe Jack was saved and too many of his claimed converts were not because of quick prayerism and Hyles’ maniacal need for numbers! I believe most of his illustrations were lies. I believe he did not report most of the money he made through ventures he developed or heard about from friends. (I am not speaking about the legal way churches are able to skirt taxes.) He abandoned his wife and family and just about anything else he started for his family and then he ghosted those after they aged out of the program. He made people who worked for him remain in his cult by owning their homes, cars, etc. They couldn’t get regular jobs. The schools were unaccredited so no job in public school systems. That man played checkers with his and other church’s pedophiles and idiots. Had it not been for my mother, who could spot BS from states away, I would never have seen, back then, what that place really was, nor survived what happened to me there.
I went to secular college (pause for collective inhale!) and was asked by many of those people where Secular College was!
Jack was evil and perverted in his own right, from the time he showed up in Hammond in 1959 until his death. I suspicion that the church fire was a planned disaster. I suppose that if you tell me something that you believe was good about him, I will give you an opposing opinion that you probably won’t listen to because “it’s gossip”!
This message is not aimed at Justice 1976, but it is an after school special and public service announcement all in one! I tried for years to help folks get out of there but very few listened.

 

[Sherryh]

It has been my experience that those who were either ruined by or observed the extensive ruination and saw a path out of that place don’t think about him all the time, but cannot help but be reminded.
I come to this space from both. I attended his schools from the mid ‘70’s to the early ‘80’s, though I was in the church throughout my formative years.
I don’t believe Jack was saved and too many of his claimed converts were not because of quick prayerism and Hyles’ maniacal need for numbers! I believe most of his illustrations were lies. I believe he did not report most of the money he made through ventures he developed or heard about from friends. (I am not speaking about the legal way churches are able to skirt taxes.) He abandoned his wife and family and just about anything else he started for his family and then he ghosted those after they aged out of the program. He made people who worked for him remain in his cult by owning their homes, cars, etc. They couldn’t get regular jobs. The schools were unaccredited so no job in public school systems. That man played checkers with his and other church’s pedophiles and idiots. Had it not been for my mother, who could spot BS from states away, I would never have seen, back then, what that place really was, nor survived what happened to me there.
I went to secular college (pause for collective inhale!) and was asked by many of those people where Secular College was!
Jack was evil and perverted in his own right, from the time he showed up in Hammond in 1959 until his death. I suspicion that the church fire was a planned disaster. I suppose that if you tell me something that you believe was good about him, I will give you an opposing opinion that you probably won’t listen to because “it’s gossip”!
This message is not aimed at Justice 1976, but it is an after school special and public service announcement all in one! I tried for years to help folks get out of there but very few listened

 

[Sherryh]

I have no doubt everything you said is true. I hope youre doing well.

 

[sawthruglassclearly]

I have no doubt everything you said is true. I hope youre doing well.

You’re always a delight to encounter here! I’m doing well and always hope that the best things are happening for you!

 

[DrHuk&Duck]

Probably not, for a host of reasons. But, in a certain context of respect and honor I still might. Kinda like that great philosopher Ja’Marr Chase once said, Just the memories I get to have.

Many years ago I got an autograph from Dr. Charles Stanley, though it wasn’t a Bible. He was doing autographs at a local bookstore in Charleston for a book he’d gotten published. I’d never read anything by him, but his messages were a great comfort to me on the radio for a job I had which sometimes had me working late night shifts during my college years. I learned some time later that he was a bit on the controversial side due to his divorce from his wife of 44 years, who apparently had major mental health issues (however she requested it). Regardless of the politics of his pastoral position, I just enjoyed his sermons.

 

[Justice1976]

Many years ago I got an autograph from Dr. Charles Stanley, though it wasn’t a Bible. He was doing autographs at a local bookstore in Charleston for a book he’d gotten published. I’d never read anything by him, but his messages were a great comfort to me on the radio for a job I had which sometimes had me working late night shifts during my college years. I learned some time later that he was a bit on the controversial side due to his divorce from his wife of 44 years, who apparently had major mental health issues (however she requested it). Regardless of the politics of his pastoral position, I just enjoyed his sermons.

I guess he did encounter some controversy late in his ministry over the divorce. It was my understanding that his wife did initiate it and he never remarried, which prevented that line of contention some assert. His almost as famous son, Andy, has been (I think, purposely) vague about his parents' split. I believe he attempted to stay meaningfully connected to both and I can understand that. They are both now deceased.

I think Charles Stanley tried to stay true to the Bible and I appreciated that. In my opinion, his outreach for Christ far exceeded that of Jack Hyles.

 

[JesusFan]

Many years ago I got an autograph from Dr. Charles Stanley, though it wasn’t a Bible. He was doing autographs at a local bookstore in Charleston for a book he’d gotten published. I’d never read anything by him, but his messages were a great comfort to me on the radio for a job I had which sometimes had me working late night shifts during my college years. I learned some time later that he was a bit on the controversial side due to his divorce from his wife of 44 years, who apparently had major mental health issues (however she requested it). Regardless of the politics of his pastoral position, I just enjoyed his sermons.

As far as I know, he remained faithful to his wife, as while she divorced him, he in a sense never agreed with it, and continued to see her as his wife

 

[JesusFan]

I guess he did encounter some controversy late in his ministry over the divorce. It was my understanding that his wife did initiate it and he never remarried, which prevented that line of contention some assert. His almost as famous son, Andy, has been (I think, purposely) vague about his parents' split. I believe he attempted to stay meaningfully connected to both and I can understand that. They are both now deceased.

I think Charles Stanley tried to stay true to the Bible and I appreciated that. In my opinion, his outreach for Christ far exceeded that of Jack Hyles.

His wife had agreed to come back to live with him again as husband and wife, but then decided to file for the divorce, but he never stopped seeing her as his wife. The big problem with Andy is that he seems to deny the inspiration of the Bible and its authority, as he seems to hold to NT bible only should be used, soft on lifestyle issues, while Dr Stanley biggest contersery was Millennial exclusion, where he taught that those who were luke warm and not really faithful would miss the rapture and millennium, and would just get resurrected at eternal state

 

[aleshanee]

I believe every word your dad said is truth. I hope he's doing well.

thank you... .. .

 

[Baptist Renegade]

His wife had agreed to come back to live with him again as husband and wife, but then decided to file for the divorce, but he never stopped seeing her as his wife. The big problem with Andy is that he seems to deny the inspiration of the Bible and its authority, as he seems to hold to NT bible only should be used, soft on lifestyle issues, while Dr Stanley biggest contersery was Millennial exclusion, where he taught that those who were luke warm and not really faithful would miss the rapture and millennium, and would just get resurrected at eternal state

Charles Stanley neglected his wife and his family for the ministry and such is far from anything I would consider virtuous and certainly not blameless! Too bad he was not accountable to elders who would have required him to step down and get his family life back in order. Such would've been a far better legacy than the one he had left us!

I do not mean to attack the man. He is certainly not around to defend himself anyway! What I am saying though is that he was NOT a good example in this area and those in the ministry today should acknowledge this and learn from his mistakes!

 

[Justice1976]

Charles Stanley neglected his wife and his family for the ministry and such is far from anything I would consider virtuous and certainly not blameless! Too bad he was not accountable to elders who would have required him to step down and get his family life back in order. Such would've been a far better legacy than the one he had left us!

I do not mean to attack the man. He is certainly not around to defend himself anyway! What I am saying though is that he was NOT a good example in this area and those in the ministry today should acknowledge this and learn from his mistakes!

"For all have sinned and come short of the glory of God."

May we all keep our sight on Him who is blameless!

 

[DrHuk&Duck]

Charles Stanley neglected his wife and his family for the ministry and such is far from anything I would consider virtuous and certainly not blameless! Too bad he was not accountable to elders who would have required him to step down and get his family life back in order. Such would've been a far better legacy than the one he had left us!

I do not mean to attack the man. He is certainly not around to defend himself anyway! What I am saying though is that he was NOT a good example in this area and those in the ministry today should acknowledge this and learn from his mistakes!

Fast forward to the 2-minute clip of this video in which Stanley discusses his divorce. In short, God told him to keep preaching

 

[Baptist Renegade]

Fast forward to the 2-minute clip of this video in which Stanley discusses his divorce. In short, God told him to keep preaching:

I stand by my words here. His statement was pragmatic and does not address what led to the divorce in the first place. Do you hear him taking any responsibility for his failures in the marriage? At this point it is over and done with so what can you do? We have discussed this before and you also know that I have been divorced. I do not believe that divorce permanently disqualifies you from ministry but when marital problems arise, you need to make that a priority and deal with that! What a legacy he would've left and what an example he would've been to other preachers had he put family first and sought restoration in his marriage long before it came to this? My understanding is that his wife was quite patient with him for many years! Too bad an older man didn't give a younger Charles Stanley some godly counsel when he was seriously messing up! This would be my counsel to young preachers today and I believe this to be right!

 

[DrHuk&Duck]

I stand by my words here. His statement was pragmatic and does not address what led to the divorce in the first place. Do you hear him taking any responsibility for his failures in the marriage? At this point it is over and done with so what can you do? We have discussed this before and you also know that I have been divorced.

I’m not defending Stanley, just was pointing out his explanation. TBH, I think he should have resigned from his position as head pastor. My personal opinion is someone who has been divorced should only be an assistant pastor in church, but not the head pastor. (I don’t have any Bible verses to back me up on that stance, it’s just my opinion.)

Anyway, as I said to @ALAYMAN, I wasn’t aware of the church politics with Stanley back then. I was occasionally working graveyard shifts while enrolled in college, and I was at a very low spiritual place in life, and I give credit to Stanley’s late night sermons on the radio that helped me crawl out of a dark hole and get me interested in the Bible and spiritual things again.

 

[Baptist Renegade]

My personal opinion is someone who has been divorced should only be an assistant pastor in church, but not the head pastor. (I don’t have any Bible verses to back me up on that stance, it’s just my opinion.)

I have heard such before and I believe it is an inconsistent approach to the qualifications set forth in 1 Tim 3. There is the "Office of a Bishop," not the office of an "Assistant Bishop" or whatever and even then, would the qualifications be any different for an "assistant?" The underlying issue was prior to and is what led up to the divorce and my argument is that he did not properly deal with it. We all have rough patches and I believe you need to give a lot of weight in regards to how you chose to deal with the matter along with what you have learned from it! I try to learn from my failures so I (first) do not repeat them and (second) hopefully, I have gained wisdom through everything I had gone through so perhaps I can help others not make the mistakes I have!

I have my personal reasons as to why I will not seek a position as a "Senior Pastor" or any other "Pastoral" position and much of this has to do with the stigma and how cruel many are in regards to those who are divorced and remarried! I am not about to put my wife or anyone else I care about into such a position. But with all that said, God often uses broken people and sometimes I believe he is able to use a broken person far more effectively than those who never had opportunity to make mistakes. I am a Bible teacher and preacher and hopefully I can continue to glorify God despite my failures! God has been quite good to me!

 

[Ekklesian]

In short, God told him to keep preaching

In my experience, anyone who says "God told me," is either lying or deluded. This goes for so-called Baptists, too.

Stanley's governing principle expressed in the video, which he got from his Pentecostal grandfather, is wholly unbiblical. If you are right with God in your heart, and you're doing what God called you to do, then you keep doing what He called you to do until He tells you to do something else.

Man, that sounds all good and holy, but he's not talking about the clear commands of Scripture. He's talking about what he and others imagine God is telling them to do.

What is it that we are called of God to do? We are called to follow Christ. We are all called to take His yoke upon us and to learn of Him. That means we are to obey His commandments as they were delivered to us by the Apostles. Not what we feel or imagine God may be saying. The Holy Spirit gets blamed for a lot He had nothing to do with.

And the gifts and calling of God are without repentance. Even through our periods of weakness and rebellion.

But no one is called to an office. What do the Scriptures say? If a man desire the office of a bishop, he desireth a good work. And he may serve in that capacity as long as he meets the qualifications.

I hate to burst the bubble of the men o' Gawd, but no one is called to the pastorate. That's something that you want to do, no doubt in good faith and from a pure heart. But it's still something you want to do, not what God has called you to do, and the moment you slip up and break faith, your term has ended, permanently.

In Stanley's case, it may be that since it was the wife that sought the divorce, that he is still technically qualified. And if he had argued that point from Scripture, his argument might have had some merit. But that's not the premise he argued from. He is saying that to step down from the pulpit would be disobedience to God, because God called him to preach, and hasn't told him to do anything else.

I think if he had argued from the Scriptures, that he is still technically qualified, his desire to remain in office would be revealed to be more self will than God's will. Who would advise someone to neglect his family for the sake of his "ministry"? His family is his ministry.

Legalism might say he's qualified, but the Spirit would have him look to his own house.

 

[Bob Jones VI]

I realize that there are many opinions about Jack Hyles put forth on this board. Today marks the 25th anniversary of his death. He left an indelible mark on my life. I mean, I'm talking about him today, 45 years after I left the place. So, there's that.

I wish I hadn't gone to HAC. I likely could have spent those years better elsewhere. But those were necessary years for me. They hardened me for what was to come in my life. I came to HAC as a very immature kid of eighteen. I had no idea what I wanted to do with my life. The HAC years, in retrospect, paved a path for me to grow up that would lead away from there to many different places. I have been blessed to have been given the life I have lived since leaving there.

Looking back, it pains me to say that I believe that much of what I heard from the pulpit at FBC and HAC was lies. I really don't believe all of those stories where Jack Hyles always emerged the hero. I think he grew up a very insecure boy and spent his life trying to live up to the idolized person that his secret self craved. I would call it a "Walter Mitty Complex."

That said, he was charismatic. He made people want to follow him. And as a kid from the south in the 1970's, I followed him. I believed in him. In my own way, I loved him. Amid the insanity that was my life for several years, I also witnessed him do some very good things. He could be a man who sometimes shared a lot of simple, good wisdom, such as the productivity of living by a schedule, a principle that has served me well to this day.

But now he is gone from us a quarter century. His legacy in the form of his church, college and even his family, did not take very long to dissolve. In many ways his story is a tragedy, albeit one that he mostly penned. I think he made a lot of mistakes and was a man who rarely, if ever admitted such.

I remember during my time there (76-81) I would hear him tell stories of people like Bob Jones or J. Frank Norris and frankly, they were people that I knew nothing about. They were mere historic figures to me and mostly, when I tried to read their sermons of years gone by, I was unenthused. Now, when I look at photos of today's Hyles Anderson students, I realize that they were largely not yet born on this day in 2001 and I wonder if when they hear about the man whose name their college still bears, do they think of him as I thought of Bob Jones in the seventies... just some man that I am supposed to admire and respect, but actually know little about.

And so the time has passed quickly and I wonder if there will still be any remnant of this man that I once held so respectfully in another 25 years and I think, whatever it may be, it will be unrecognizable to anyone who knew him when he was alive. And those circles of life close each day.

The indelible mark he left on my life was that he was a Pharisee. He ruined my young Christian life with his powerful communication style. I became a quick sycophant, but I knew all along he was a Pharisee. I do not doubt that the man was saved, but he added so much crap to the Bible, that what he preached in his later years was incoherent as far as the Bible goes. He said he believed the Bible but ADDED to it.

For example, that women who wear pants are in sin. That is NOT IN THE BIBLE.

Need I say more?

 

[DrHuk&Duck]

In my experience, anyone who says "God told me," is either lying or deluded. This goes for so-called Baptists, too.

Stanley's governing principle expressed in the video, which he got from his Pentecostal grandfather, is wholly unbiblical. If you are right with God in your heart, and you're doing what God called you to do, then you keep doing what He called you to do until He tells you to do something else.

Man, that sounds all good and holy, but he's not talking about the clear commands of Scripture. He's talking about what he and others imagine God is telling them to do.

What is it that we are called of God to do? We are called to follow Christ. We are all called to take His yoke upon us and to learn of Him. That means we are to obey His commandments as they were delivered to us by the Apostles. Not what we feel or imagine God may be saying. The Holy Spirit gets blamed for a lot He had nothing to do with.

And the gifts and calling of God are without repentance. Even through our periods of weakness and rebellion.

But no one is called to an office. What do the Scriptures say? If a man desire the office of a bishop, he desireth a good work. And he may serve in that capacity as long as he meets the qualifications.

I hate to burst the bubble of the men o' Gawd, but no one is called to the pastorate. That's something that you want to do, no doubt in good faith and from a pure heart. But it's still something you want to do, not what God has called you to do, and the moment you slip up and break faith, your term has ended, permanently.

In Stanley's case, it may be that since it was the wife that sought the divorce, that he is still technically qualified. And if he had argued that point from Scripture, his argument might have had some merit. But that's not the premise he argued from. He is saying that to step down from the pulpit would be disobedience to God, because God called him to preach, and hasn't told him to do anything else.

I think if he had argued from the Scriptures, that he is still technically qualified, his desire to remain in office would be revealed to be more self will than God's will. Who would advise someone to neglect his family for the sake of his "ministry"? His family is his ministry.

Legalism might say he's qualified, but the Spirit would have him look to his own house.

“God told him” just means God put the desire in his heart.

I think you’re correct about the fact that he should have argued his stance from a technical POV. He probably would have come ahead instead of arguing it was God’s will. Regardless, I think he should have stepped down from his ministry. The pastor’s first ministry should be his family. If that’s not right, he should step aside until it’s made whole.

 

[DrHuk&Duck]

I have heard such before and I believe it is an inconsistent approach to the qualifications set forth in 1 Tim 3. There is the "Office of a Bishop," not the office of an "Assistant Bishop" or whatever and even then, would the qualifications be any different for an "assistant?"

Perhaps I shouldn’t have used the word “pastor,” but rather “staff member.” I think there’s a place for ministry on staff for people who are divorced. I just don’t think it should be as head pastor. My current church uses the word “director” for many such positions.

 

[sword]

The indelible mark he left on my life was that he was a Pharisee. He ruined my young Christian life with his powerful communication style. I became a quick sycophant, but I knew all along he was a Pharisee. I do not doubt that the man was saved, but he added so much crap to the Bible, that what he preached in his later years was incoherent as far as the Bible goes. He said he believed the Bible but ADDED to it.

For example, that women who wear pants are in sin. That is NOT IN THE BIBLE.

Need I say more?

I'm not going to take a position, but there are many Godly preachers from the past (many who never heard of Jack Hyles) who stronly believed "The woman shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man, neither shall a man put on a woman's garment" means men should not were dresses or skirts* and women should not wear pants. Until 1930 it was very unusual for a woman to wear pants even among non-christians. Throughout history this was a societal norm.

* Kilts when in battle may be exempt.