Divorce: The Sin Preachers Nod & Wink At

DoctorDuck

DoctorDuck

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It’s been recommended that I start this thread because Tarheel is jealous of Jimmy Carter.

So…since the Bible is clear in Matthew that a man who marries a divorced woman is guilty of adultery, why are pastors turning a blind eye to marriages that are sinful and not valid? They’ll loudly condemn gay marriage while promoting adulterous men to leadership positions within the church. No wonder the Catholics laugh at us. Shameful.
 
Ekklesian said:
Maybe you could try just answering the question?
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I’m not sure what passivity vs retaliation has to do with this. It seems like you’re attempting to excuse the divorce of someone. Again, the “divorce clause” only appears in the book of Matthew and it only pertains to adultery. Any manmade excuse beyond adultery is just that: excuses to make yourself feel better.
 
DoctorDuck said:
It’s been recommended that I start this thread because Tarheel is jealous of Jimmy Carter.

So…since the Bible is clear in Matthew that a man who marries a divorced woman is guilty of adultery, why are pastors turning a blind eye to marriages that are sinful and not valid? They’ll loudly condemn gay marriage while promoting adulterous men to leadership positions within the church. No wonder the Catholics laugh at us. Shameful.
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Correct. Even if they have repented their marriage is still not valid in the eyes of God. Just like gay marriage.

If a Pastor is going to condemn from the pulpit gay marriage he should be consistent and condemn remarriage. And tell the people, your marriage is false.
 
DoctorDuck said:
I’m not sure what passivity vs retaliation has to do with this.
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It's not about retaliation...it's about how you're reading Christ's teaching here.

Are you allowed to resist evil in the defense of your life? Are you allowed to resist evil in the defense of your neighbor? Taking Christ's words here as you're taking His words just a few verses earlier in the same segment of teaching, one would have to say no.

Is that what you would say?

DoctorDuck said:
It seems like you’re attempting to excuse the divorce of someone.
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:rolleyes:

DoctorDuck said:
Again, the “divorce clause” only appears in the book of Matthew and it only pertains to adultery. Any manmade excuse beyond adultery is just that: excuses to make yourself feel better.
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And in Christ's commentary on the Law, the letter of which killeth.
 
From @ALAYMAN - Dr Duck is mistaken, and apparently you continue to misunderstand the nature of remarriage too (“living in sin”, as you put it), so read this for a better understanding of the error of believing remarriage is perpetual adultery.
 
The problem with the logic @ALAYMAN is using is that he views marriage as a creation of man, when in fact it’s a contract before God. Marriage is an indissoluble covenant that cannot be dissolved by a civil divorce or by human authority. The Bible makes this clear, including the words quoted by Jesus in Matthew, which only gives an “exception clause” wiggle room.

Do two wrongs make a right? No. The remarried couple must divorce and return to their original marriage. Only then can the sacred contract be renewed.
 
Ekklesian said:
It's not about retaliation...it's about how you're reading Christ's teaching here.

Are you allowed to resist evil in the defense of your life? Are you allowed to resist evil in the defense of your neighbor? Taking Christ's words here as you're taking His words just a few verses earlier in the same segment of teaching, one would have to say no.

Is that what you would say?


:rolleyes:


And in Christ's commentary on the Law, the letter of which killeth.
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I guess I’m not sure what this has to do with the price of tea in China.
 
DoctorDuck said:
The problem with the logic @ALAYMAN is using is that he views marriage as a creation of man, when in fact it’s a contract before God. Marriage is an indissoluble covenant that cannot be dissolved by a civil divorce or by human authority. The Bible makes this clear, including the words quoted by Jesus in Matthew, which only gives an “exception clause” wiggle room.

Do two wrongs make a right? No. The remarried couple must divorce and return to their original marriage. Only then can the sacred contract be renewed.
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Deut 24:4 then her former husband, who sent her away, may not take her again to be his wife, after she has been defiled, for that is an abomination before the LORD. And you shall not bring sin upon the land that the LORD your God is giving you for an inheritance.

Quit twisting Jesus’ words.
 
biscuit1953 said:
Deut 24:4 then her former husband, who sent her away, may not take her again to be his wife, after she has been defiled, for that is an abomination before the LORD. And you shall not bring sin upon the land that the LORD your God is giving you for an inheritance.

Quit twisting Jesus’ words.
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2+2 still equals 4.


Matthew 5:32​


ESVBut I say to you that everyone who divorces his wife, except on the ground of sexual immorality, makes her commit adultery, and whoever marries a divorced woman commits adultery.
NIVBut I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for sexual immorality, makes her the victim of adultery, and anyone who marries a divorced woman commits adultery.
NASBbut I say to you that everyone who divorces his wife, except for the reason of sexual immorality, makes her commit adultery; and whoever marries a divorced woman commits adultery.
CSBBut I tell you, everyone who divorces his wife, except in a case of sexual immorality, causes her to commit adultery. And whoever marries a divorced woman commits adultery.
NLTBut I say that a man who divorces his wife, unless she has been unfaithful, causes her to commit adultery. And anyone who marries a divorced woman also commits adultery.
KJVBut I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery: and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery.
NKJVBut I say to you that whoever divorces his wife for any reason except sexual immorality causes her to commit adultery; and whoever marries a woman who is divorced commits adultery.
 
DoctorDuck said:
It’s been recommended that I start this thread because Tarheel is jealous of Jimmy Carter.

So…since the Bible is clear in Matthew that a man who marries a divorced woman is guilty of adultery, why are pastors turning a blind eye to marriages that are sinful and not valid? They’ll loudly condemn gay marriage while promoting adulterous men to leadership positions within the church. No wonder the Catholics laugh at us. Shameful.
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Jealous of Jimmy Carter?!

You are a fanboy of Carter who was a horrible President by the way…and a proponent of immorality…gay marriage.
 
(Reposted from the Carter thread to the correct thread now):

What I’m asking is, why do you (and so many other Christians) have a double standard when it comes to the topic of homosexual marriage, but not divorce (and remarriage) by heterosexuals?

According to the Bible, including Jesus’ own words on the subject (reposted via Got Questions, which many of you like referring to), the grounds for divorce are quite clear:

The Bible gives two clear grounds for divorce: (1) sexual immorality (Matthew 5:32; 19:9) and (2) abandonment by an unbeliever (1 Corinthians 7:15). Even in these two instances, though, divorce is not required or even encouraged. The most that can be said is that sexual immorality and abandonment are grounds (an allowance) for divorce. Confession, forgiveness, reconciliation, and restoration should always be the first steps. Divorce should almost always be viewed as the last resort.

Are there any grounds for divorce beyond what the Bible explicitly says? Perhaps, but it is always dangerous to presume upon the Word of God (1 Corinthians 4:6). The most frequent additional grounds for divorce that people inquire about are spousal abuse (emotional or physical), child abuse, addiction to pornography, drug / alcohol use, crime / imprisonment, and mismanagement of finances (such as through a gambling addiction). None of these can be claimed to be explicitly biblical grounds for a divorce.

Furthermore, if a man marries a woman who is divorced (and presumably vice versa) for unbiblical purposes, he lives in a constant state of adultery (Matthew 5:32): https://www.gotquestions.org/whoever-marries-a-divorced-woman-commits-adultery.html

So, perhaps all of the judgmental handwringing by Christians who are openly living in sin needs to be addressed before attacking two men or women who are married. Perhaps this should be left for God to judge. Maybe that’s why President Carter adopted this attitude late in life.

And to answer your question, yes, the Bible makes it quite clear that gay marriage is a sin. Now I have a question for you: are a divorced and remarried Christian couple openly living in permanent adultery if their original marriages were not linked to the “divorce exception clauses” in the Bible? And as a man who occasionally takes the pulpit, have you ever had the backbone to tackle this subject? (I bet you have for the gay marriage topic.)
 
Tarheel Baptist said:
Jealous of Jimmy Carter?!

You are a fanboy of Carter who was a horrible President by the way…and a proponent of immorality…gay marriage.
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I was just joking with you about Carter, but there’s nothing funny about Christian pastors bastardizing Scripture because it’s not politically correct in the 21st century.
 
Let me make this long story short: Christian pastors love to poke fun of gay marriage in a friendly church environment. It’s a slow, softball pitch with a guaranteed home run with a friendly audience. Show me a pastor who has the guts to stand in the pulpit and publicly preach on the topic of Matthew 5:32, knowing he’s going to offend half his audience and possibly lose 50% of his tithes. I bet the old-time religion preachers weren’t worried about making you cry, making you feel guilty.
 
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DoctorDuck said:
The problem with the logic @ALAYMAN is using is that he views marriage as a creation of man, when in fact it’s a contract before God. Marriage is an indissoluble covenant that cannot be dissolved by a civil divorce or by human authority. The Bible makes this clear, including the words quoted by Jesus in Matthew, which only gives an “exception clause” wiggle room.

Do two wrongs make a right? No. The remarried couple must divorce and return to their original marriage. Only then can the sacred contract be renewed.
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Your demand for pastors to capitulate to you (wrong) Scriptural interpretation is duly noted. Hopefully you read what I gave you for reference in the other thread. If not, here’s some more info from none other than Phil Armenik (a former FFF poster.
 
I have a question. In Matthew 19:6, Jesus said, "what God hath joined together, let no man put asunder." What if two people, completely against God's will, go to the courthouse and get married? Did God have anything to do with it? Does God decree something based on fleshly acts of people living in sin?
 
Ekklesian said:
Again, Maybe you could just answer the question, and it might become clearer to you.
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You are allowed to defend yourself, biblically and legally speaking. And I know where you’re going with this now and the solution is, you may divorce but not get remarried. That’s the key: no remarriage is permissible unless it meets the “exclusion clause.”
 
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