Does God ever hear the prayers of the lost?

[prophet]

Why would anyone think that Balaam was a false prophet?



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"For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.........Woe unto them! for they have gone in the way of Cain, and ran greedily after the error of Balaam for reward, and perished in the gainsaying of Core"

"But there were false prophets also among the people........................Which have forsaken the right way, and are gone astray, following the way of Balaam the son of Bosor, who loved the wages of unrighteousness;"



And this does not deal with the "Doctrine of Balaam". This is good enough for me. But again, that's just me.

The "error of Balaam" is spelled out.
He wanted Moabite money....

He was still God's prophet.

That's why he is the go-to example.

He would only be a false prophet, if God didnt talk to him.
It is obvious from Numbers that God did, and that it was a regular occurrence with him.

Why do you think the Moabites came to him?

He was the prophet in that area.

Of course he was a believer.
Read every QUOTE of Balaam, and tell me he wasn't a believer.



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[ALAYMAN]

Why do you think the Moabites came to him?

He was the prophet in that area.

They came to him because he was a known diviner, not because he was a prophet of Yahweh.

 

[Bob H]

Why do you think the Moabites came to him?

He was the prophet in that area.

They came to him because he was a known diviner, not because he was a prophet of Yahweh.

"And when Balaam saw that it pleased the Lord to bless Israel, he went not, as at other times, to seek for ""enchantments""

"Balaam also the son of Beor, the soothsayer,"

 

[prophet]

Num 22:8 ? Num 22:13
And he said unto them, Lodge here this night, and I will bring you word again, as the Lord shall speak unto me: and the princes of Moab abode with Balaam.
And God came unto Balaam, and said, What men are these with thee?
And Balaam said unto God, Balak the son of Zippor, king of Moab, hath sent unto me, saying, Behold, there is a people come out of Egypt, which covereth the face of the earth: come now, curse me them; peradventure I shall be able to overcome them, and drive them out.
And God said unto Balaam, Thou shalt not go with them; thou shalt not curse the people: for they are blessed.
And Balaam rose up in the morning, and said unto the princes of Balak, Get you into your land: for the Lord refuseth to give me leave to go with you.

This isn't God and His prophet carrying on their regular business?

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[Bob H]

Why would anyone think that Balaam was a false prophet?



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"For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.........Woe unto them! for they have gone in the way of Cain, and ran greedily after the error of Balaam for reward, and perished in the gainsaying of Core"

"But there were false prophets also among the people........................Which have forsaken the right way, and are gone astray, following the way of Balaam the son of Bosor, who loved the wages of unrighteousness;"



And this does not deal with the "Doctrine of Balaam". This is good enough for me. But again, that's just me.

The "error of Balaam" is spelled out.
He wanted Moabite money....

He was still God's prophet.

That's why he is the go-to example.

He would only be a false prophet, if God didnt talk to him.
It is obvious from Numbers that God did, and that it was a regular occurrence with him.

Why do you think the Moabites came to him?

He was the prophet in that area.

Of course he was a believer.
Read every QUOTE of Balaam, and tell me he wasn't a believer.



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The "Way of Balaam"----->He knew God's way but forsook it for riches and honor {Forsaking God's way for riches and honor}

The "Error of Balaam"----> Deviating from & opposing God's truth

The "Doctrine of Balaam"---->To get God's people to forsake their Godly separation and their pilgrim charactor for worldly conformity {To corrupt a people that could not be cursed--to defile that which he could not destroy}.....


Doesn't sound like a believer to me. BTW, this was "disCUSSED"  here some yrs back  and opinions differed.

 

[prophet]

Why would anyone think that Balaam was a false prophet?



Sent from my LGL43AL using Tapatalk

"For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.........Woe unto them! for they have gone in the way of Cain, and ran greedily after the error of Balaam for reward, and perished in the gainsaying of Core"

"But there were false prophets also among the people........................Which have forsaken the right way, and are gone astray, following the way of Balaam the son of Bosor, who loved the wages of unrighteousness;"



And this does not deal with the "Doctrine of Balaam". This is good enough for me. But again, that's just me.

The "error of Balaam" is spelled out.
He wanted Moabite money....

He was still God's prophet.

That's why he is the go-to example.

He would only be a false prophet, if God didnt talk to him.
It is obvious from Numbers that God did, and that it was a regular occurrence with him.

Why do you think the Moabites came to him?

He was the prophet in that area.

Of course he was a believer.
Read every QUOTE of Balaam, and tell me he wasn't a believer.



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The "Way of Balaam"----->He knew God's way but forsook it for riches and honor {Forsaking God's way for riches and honor}

The "Error of Balaam"----> Deviating from & opposing God's truth

The "Doctrine of Balaam"---->To get God's people to forsake their Godly separation and their pilgrim charactor for worldly conformity {To corrupt a people that could not be cursed--to defile that which he could not destroy}.....


Doesn't sound like a believer to me. BTW, this was "disCUSSED"  here some yrs back  and opinions differed.

To me, you have to read the stories as that, a story, first.

Anyway, this horse is dead.

Interesting discussion.


earnestly contend

 

[Jim Jones]

Balaam is known for one animal.

 

[ALAYMAN]

To me, you have to read the stories as that, a story, first.

How does "reading this as a story" negate Bob's Scriptural observations?

Balaam is known for one animal.

Enough riddles already.

oh.....





GET OUT!!!!!!!

 

[Walt]

Why would anyone think that Balaam was a false prophet?



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Why would any rational human being believe God could choose a false apostle who preached the gospel and performed miracles and every other function that validated an apostle but not a false prophet?

You've confused "Apostle"  with "Disciple".

Judas never saw the Resurrection, wasn't around when the Apostles were followed by "signs and wonders".

The only account we have of him, in the ministry,  is his complaint about expensive ointment being wasted.

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Discussion about Judas not relevant to the OP, but... Judas was certainly part of the group that Jesus sent out two-by-two who cast out devils, healed the sick, and preached about the Kingdom.

None of the disciples knew Judas was unregenerate; he worked along with the others, and had every appearance of being a true disciple.

 

[prophet]

Why would anyone think that Balaam was a false prophet?



Sent from my LGL43AL using Tapatalk

Why would any rational human being believe God could choose a false apostle who preached the gospel and performed miracles and every other function that validated an apostle but not a false prophet?

You've confused "Apostle"  with "Disciple".

Judas never saw the Resurrection, wasn't around when the Apostles were followed by "signs and wonders".

The only account we have of him, in the ministry,  is his complaint about expensive ointment being wasted.

Sent from my LGL43AL using Tapatalk

Discussion about Judas not relevant to the OP, but... Judas was certainly part of the group that Jesus sent out two-by-two who cast out devils, healed the sick, and preached about the Kingdom.

None of the disciples knew Judas was unregenerate; he worked along with the others, and had every appearance of being a true disciple.

This is all assumption.

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[Walt]

Why would anyone think that Balaam was a false prophet?



Sent from my LGL43AL using Tapatalk

Why would any rational human being believe God could choose a false apostle who preached the gospel and performed miracles and every other function that validated an apostle but not a false prophet?

You've confused "Apostle"  with "Disciple".

Judas never saw the Resurrection, wasn't around when the Apostles were followed by "signs and wonders".

The only account we have of him, in the ministry,  is his complaint about expensive ointment being wasted.

Sent from my LGL43AL using Tapatalk

Discussion about Judas not relevant to the OP, but... Judas was certainly part of the group that Jesus sent out two-by-two who cast out devils, healed the sick, and preached about the Kingdom.

None of the disciples knew Judas was unregenerate; he worked along with the others, and had every appearance of being a true disciple.

This is all assumption.

Well... I think it a very reasonable assumption:

Jesus DID sent the disciples out, given them power to heal the sick and cast out devils. They DID come back, rejoicing that they had been able to do miracles. No where in the narrative does the Scripture say "except Judas", so it seems to me plausible that Judas was doing what everyone else had been doing.

At the last supper, when Jesus said that one of His disciples would betray Him, they didn't all turn as one and look at Judas.  From the question "Is it I?", it seems that they believed that someone would accidentally betray Him. The disciples apparently never thought that any one of them would deliberately betray Jesus. Once again, it seems an entirely reasonable assumption based upon the Scripture.

The Bible doesn't tell us Judas' thoughts -- it is possible that he fiercely anti-Roman, and by betraying Jesus, he would force Jesus to use His power, and thus start a movement to drive out Rome. He may have been using Jesus as an means to his own personal ends, instead of allowing Jesus to be his end.  Yes, this is more speculation; I just believe it is possible.  We have a tendency to polarize Bible characters as "good" or "evil" -  and we see the "good" as nearly perfect, and the "evil" as totally bad. In reality, they were just humans, with both good and bad. King Saul is an illustration of this - most preachers have nothing but bad to say about Saul, but he started out as a good, humble king. It was only after he became proud that he did so much bad.

 

[Bob H]

Jn 9:31 Now we know that God heareth not sinners: but if any man be a worshipper of God, and doeth his will, him he heareth.

Does God EVER hear the prayer(s) of a lost person (for anything other than a prayer of repentance unto salvation)?

I Kings 21:
25-26: But there was none like unto Ahab, which did sell himself to work wickedness in the sight of the Lord, whom Jezebel his wife stirred up. And he did very abominably in following idols, according to all things as did the Amorites, whom the Lord cast out before the children of Israel.


Sounds lost to me, but that's just me


27-29 And it came to pass, when Ahab heard those words, that he rent his clothes, and put sackcloth upon his flesh, and fasted, and lay in sackcloth, and went softly.  And the word of the Lord came to Elijah the Tishbite, saying,Seest thou how Ahab humbleth himself before me? because he humbleth himself before me, I will not bring the evil in his days: but in his son's days will I bring the evil upon his house.



Also Luke 7:1-10--->???  The Centurion?        What thinkest thou?

 

[prophet]

Why would anyone think that Balaam was a false prophet?



Sent from my LGL43AL using Tapatalk

Why would any rational human being believe God could choose a false apostle who preached the gospel and performed miracles and every other function that validated an apostle but not a false prophet?

You've confused "Apostle"  with "Disciple".

Judas never saw the Resurrection, wasn't around when the Apostles were followed by "signs and wonders".

The only account we have of him, in the ministry,  is his complaint about expensive ointment being wasted.

Sent from my LGL43AL using Tapatalk

Discussion about Judas not relevant to the OP, but... Judas was certainly part of the group that Jesus sent out two-by-two who cast out devils, healed the sick, and preached about the Kingdom.

None of the disciples knew Judas was unregenerate; he worked along with the others, and had every appearance of being a true disciple.

This is all assumption.

Well... I think it a very reasonable assumption:

Jesus DID sent the disciples out, given them power to heal the sick and cast out devils. They DID come back, rejoicing that they had been able to do miracles. No where in the narrative does the Scripture say "except Judas", so it seems to me plausible that Judas was doing what everyone else had been doing.

At the last supper, when Jesus said that one of His disciples would betray Him, they didn't all turn as one and look at Judas.  From the question "Is it I?", it seems that they believed that someone would accidentally betray Him. The disciples apparently never thought that any one of them would deliberately betray Jesus. Once again, it seems an entirely reasonable assumption based upon the Scripture.

The Bible doesn't tell us Judas' thoughts -- it is possible that he fiercely anti-Roman, and by betraying Jesus, he would force Jesus to use His power, and thus start a movement to drive out Rome. He may have been using Jesus as an means to his own personal ends, instead of allowing Jesus to be his end.  Yes, this is more speculation; I just believe it is possible.  We have a tendency to polarize Bible characters as "good" or "evil" -  and we see the "good" as nearly perfect, and the "evil" as totally bad. In reality, they were just humans, with both good and bad. King Saul is an illustration of this - most preachers have nothing but bad to say about Saul, but he started out as a good, humble king. It was only after he became proud that he did so much bad.

At least you can admit it is speculation.

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[ALAYMAN]

Also Luke 7:1-10--->???  The Centurion?        What thinkest thou?

I think that you are on the same track of conclusion that I came to, which is that God gives common grace to whom He chooses, and that can be on a lost man's prayers if He chooses to do so.