Faith Under Siege

[ALAYMAN]

I just finished watching this documentary, Faith Under Siege

I would love to hear your feedback if you have time to watch. It tells the story of the conflict in Ukraine, but from an Evangelical perspective relating to religious persecution of "Protestant" churches by the Russian and Ukrainian Orthodox churches. I was torn as I watched, because I was leery it might be a progressive hit-piece that (surreptitiously )decried Evangelical support as being a form of White Christian Nationalism.

It never ultimately showed that sort of bias, though a brief snippet does declare Tucker Carlson as being an agent of misinformation and extension of Russian propaganda, but portrayed sincere Evangelical American missionaries (and Ukrainian Evangelicals) who wanted to make a humanitarian and missional difference in the horrific war-torn region.

Tell me what ya think.

 

[Baptist Renegade]

I just finished watching this documentary, Faith Under Siege

I would love to hear your feedback if you have time to watch. It tells the story of the conflict in Ukraine, but from an Evangelical perspective relating to religious persecution of "Protestant" churches by the Russian and Ukrainian Orthodox churches. I was torn as I watched, because I was leery it might be a progressive hit-piece that (surreptitiously )decried Evangelical support as being a form of White Christian Nationalism.

It never ultimately showed that sort of bias, though a brief snippet does declare Tucker Carlson as being an agent of misinformation and extension of Russian propaganda, but portrayed sincere Evangelical American missionaries (and Ukrainian Evangelicals) who wanted to make a humanitarian and missional difference in the horrific war-torn region.

Tell me what ya think.

I have a friend of mine (an old Navy buddy) who has spent several years as a missionary to the Ukraine and is still quite connected. He and I went back and forth some regarding Zelenskyy and his precarious relationship with President Trump. While we do not see completely eye-to-eye, what I do understand is that there are likely Christians caught on both sides of a conflict. Such is the case with Russia and the Ukraine as well as Israel and Hamas/Iran.

I really wish that our administration would focus more upon standing against religious persecution but political alliances do not always align with this.

 

[DrHuk&Duck]

I have a friend of mine (an old Navy buddy) who has spent several years as a missionary to the Ukraine and is still quite connected. He and I went back and forth some regarding Zelenskyy and his precarious relationship with President Trump. While we do not see completely eye-to-eye, what I do understand is that there are likely Christians caught on both sides of a conflict. Such is the case with Russia and the Ukraine as well as Israel and Hamas/Iran.

I really wish that our administration would focus more upon standing against religious persecution but political alliances do not always align with this.

It’s not always a black and white issue. I have a nearby neighbor who is originally from Ukraine and moved to the United States to teach at a university in New York, followed by California and ultimately landed in Florida. I learned through some embarrassment that, despite the fact that he is from Ukraine, he identifies as Russian. He is from eastern Ukraine and he said most people from his region speak Russian and identify as such. He’s never come out and openly said whether he supports Putin or Zelensky, but I get the feeling he’s in favor of Putin.

 

[Baptist Renegade]

It’s not always a black and white issue. I have a nearby neighbor who is originally from Ukraine and moved to the United States to teach at a university in New York, followed by California and ultimately landed in Florida. I learned through some embarrassment that, despite the fact that he is from Ukraine, he identifies as Russian. He is from eastern Ukraine and he said most people from his region speak Russian and identify as such. He’s never come out and openly said whether he supports Putin or Zelensky, but I get the feeling he’s in favor of Putin.

Understood. I work with Texas Port Ministry visiting many of the ships coming into Freeport and there are many ships that have crews of both Russian and Ukranian nationality. I am not sure how all this works but they seem to get along well enough.

 

[ALAYMAN]

I have a friend of mine (an old Navy buddy) who has spent several years as a missionary to the Ukraine and is still quite connected. He and I went back and forth some regarding Zelenskyy and his precarious relationship with President Trump. While we do not see completely eye-to-eye, what I do understand is that there are likely Christians caught on both sides of a conflict. Such is the case with Russia and the Ukraine as well as Israel and Hamas/Iran.

I really wish that our administration would focus more upon standing against religious persecution but political alliances do not always align with this.

The real problem with the idea that Christians are caught on both sides of the conflict is that those who are labeled as "Christians" of the Russian Orthodox persuasion are really only nominally Christian. Those who are properly identified as Evangelical know that Putin is merely using religion as a tool and arm of the state.

 

[ALAYMAN]

It’s not always a black and white issue. I have a nearby neighbor who is originally from Ukraine and moved to the United States to teach at a university in New York, followed by California and ultimately landed in Florida. I learned through some embarrassment that, despite the fact that he is from Ukraine, he identifies as Russian. He is from eastern Ukraine and he said most people from his region speak Russian and identify as such. He’s never come out and openly said whether he supports Putin or Zelensky, but I get the feeling he’s in favor of Putin.

This problem is certainly part of the Quagmire of the long-standing dispute between the two borders of Ukraine and Russia. However, I don't think that those lines are as blurry when it comes to the Christian aspect, as those who are entrenched in the Russian cultural aspect of Russia's long-standing relationship with the Orthodox Church are really more political than <properly> religiou/Christian. And that is similar to the parallel in my opening post where I was pointing to the idea of the similarity to many of those in our country that call themselves "conservatives" and loudly proclaim their Christian heritage yet really are aptly described as white Christian nationalists.

 

[Baptist Renegade]

The real problem with the idea that Christians are caught on both sides of the conflict is that those who are labeled as "Christians" of the Russian Orthodox persuasion are really only nominally Christian. Those who are properly identified as Evangelical know that Putin is merely using religion as a tool and arm of the state.

Understood. I am not speaking of the "nominal Christianity" of which Putin identifies and is using as an "arm of the state" which is most likely the Russian Orthodox Church who has convinced the Russian government that anyone aside from Russian Orthodox is a "Cult" which has significantly curtailed (if not eliminated) missionary activity, and has led to persecution of evangelical believers. This is what I am speaking of regarding Christians getting "caught in the middle" of these conflicts! If Russia seems intent on persecuting Ukranian believers, you had better bet that he is equally hostile towards believers within his own ranks!

This is where we need to dispense with so-called "Christian Nationalism" and "Remember those who are in bonds as being bound with them (Heb 13:3). There are genuine believers among those in the Palestinian population that Christians in the United States are enthusiastic about Israel bombing! Same goes with the Christians in Iran that is among the fastest growing group of believers in the world right now! I wish I knew of a better political situation but I believe that President Trump has the right attitude that the killing needs to stop!

 

[subllibrm]

<snip>
And that is similar to the parallel in my opening post where I was pointing to the idea of the similarity to many of those in our country that call themselves "conservatives" and loudly proclaim their Christian heritage yet really are aptly described as white Christian nationalists.

A former pastor refers to this as "cultural Christianity".

I know that it is off topic but I am of the opinion that much (most?) of the MAGA movement is populated by people of this persuasion.

 

[Baptist Renegade]

A former pastor refers to this as "cultural Christianity".

I know that it is off topic but I am of the opinion that much (most?) of the MAGA movement is populated by people of this persuasion.

I would concur with this but I am quite happy that the current administration is pro-Christianity! There is no telling how long this will last. What we experienced under the Biden administration is likely what lies ahead if the Republicans fail to retain the White House in 2028!

And yes, you could get completely different "flavor" of Republicans arising who may be politically conservative but very much secularist in their views! Worse yet, they could be overtaken by the "wack job" Christianity who will wage war on the genuine Christians who believe and follow the Bible!

 

[AverageJoe]

I have a friend of mine (an old Navy buddy) who has spent several years as a missionary to the Ukraine and is still quite connected. He and I went back and forth some regarding Zelenskyy and his precarious relationship with President Trump. While we do not see completely eye-to-eye, what I do understand is that there are likely Christians caught on both sides of a conflict. Such is the case with Russia and the Ukraine as well as Israel and Hamas/Iran.

I really wish that our administration would focus more upon standing against religious persecution but political alliances do not always align with this.

Having friends who are missionaries to Ukraine, and having been encouraged to temporarily come back to the United States, I can see where Christians in both Ukraine and Russia, as well as in Israel and Gaza are being affected. Your last paragraph in the above has been discussed several times in my family with deep divisions on the subject.

 

[ALAYMAN]

A former pastor refers to this as "cultural Christianity".

I know that it is off topic but I am of the opinion that much (most?) of the MAGA movement is populated by people of this persuasion.

Yes, I think "cultural Christianity" is an apt term. Albert Mohler used to use it all the time to speak about people who thought that a Christian was something that was given by virtue of being born in America.

 

[subllibrm]

Yes, I think "cultural Christianity" is an apt term. Albert Mohler used to use it all the time to speak about people who thought that a Christian was something that was given by virtue of being born in America.

I suspect that they are well represented in the Christian nationalist movement as well.

 

[Tarheel Baptist]

I suspect that they are well represented in the Christian nationalist movement as well.

You really need to teach your pony another trick.

 

[AverageJoe]

I suspect that they are well represented in the Christian nationalist movement as well.

You really live in your own little world, don't you?