"God loves you" (R.C. Sproul)

[Smellin Coffee]

A classic example of why I avoid calvinism like the plague... It is a plague.

You mean HAC ers avoid Romans 9?

Is "Romans 9" the name of a movie theater?

;D

 

[The Rogue Tomato]

No matter on what side you fall on this issue, you have to admit, there's no proof-text for "God loves you (meaning each and every person who lives, lived, or will live)".  You can infer it indirectly from other texts like "God is love".  But there are more direct verses about who God hates to counter that. 

Then you have people who say "hates" really means "loves less" (in other words, God loves everyone, but he has favorites).  Those are usually free willers (the same who hate the idea that election means God has favorites), and that combination cracks me up, since it leads to the question, "Did someone not choose Christ of his own free will simply because God didn't love him enough?  He loved him less than someone who DID choose Christ, and that is what dashed his chances?" 

 

[rsc2a]

John 3:16 is a pretty strong proof text.

As far as the "God hates..." verses, I try to understand them in light of His perfect representation in Jesus and, therefore, most often believe those verses to be either a) a person inaccurately describing God (a al Job's friends) or an anthropromorphism because Jesus seems to be focused on the whole "love each other" idea pretty strongly.

 

[praise_yeshua]

John 3:16 is a pretty strong proof text.

As far as the "God hates..." verses, I try to understand them in light of His perfect representation in Jesus and, therefore, most often believe those verses to be either a) a person inaccurately describing God (a al Job's friends) or an anthropromorphism because Jesus seems to be focused on the whole "love each other" idea pretty strongly.

Total nonsense.

So.... when Jesus bore the curse of mankind in His own body....... Jesus didn't really feel the anger of God toward humanity????

I imagine that Jesus didn't "really" suffer all that much did He?

"God is a righteous judge, and a God who feels indignation every day"

I'll let you figure out where the quote come from. Hint, it was someone exposing "anthropromorphism"!!!!

 

[rsc2a]

John 3:16 is a pretty strong proof text.

As far as the "God hates..." verses, I try to understand them in light of His perfect representation in Jesus and, therefore, most often believe those verses to be either a) a person inaccurately describing God (a al Job's friends) or an anthropromorphism because Jesus seems to be focused on the whole "love each other" idea pretty strongly.

Total nonsense.

So.... when Jesus bore the curse of mankind in His own body....... Jesus didn't really feel the anger of God toward humanity????

I imagine that Jesus didn't "really" suffer all that much did He?

Sure...if anger means "natural consequence resulting from a violation of the divine order laid out at the beginning of creation", a consequence of which suffering is part of.

If you mean "tantrum thrown by a deity because his subjects didn't follow some arbitrary rules", you might be better off looking into a Greek pantheon for your patron.

"God is a righteous judge, and a God who feels indignation every day"

I'll let you figure out where the quote come from. Hint, it was someone exposing "anthropromorphism"!!!!

The Psalmist. And, yes, Psalms are full of anthropromorphisms.

 

[praise_yeshua]

John 3:16 is a pretty strong proof text.

As far as the "God hates..." verses, I try to understand them in light of His perfect representation in Jesus and, therefore, most often believe those verses to be either a) a person inaccurately describing God (a al Job's friends) or an anthropromorphism because Jesus seems to be focused on the whole "love each other" idea pretty strongly.

Total nonsense.

So.... when Jesus bore the curse of mankind in His own body....... Jesus didn't really feel the anger of God toward humanity????

I imagine that Jesus didn't "really" suffer all that much did He?

Sure...if anger means "natural consequence resulting from a violation of the divine order laid out at the beginning of creation", a consequence of which suffering is part of.

If you mean "tantrum thrown by a deity because his subjects didn't follow some arbitrary rules", you might be better off looking into a Greek pantheon for your patron.

"God is a righteous judge, and a God who feels indignation every day"

I'll let you figure out where the quote come from. Hint, it was someone exposing "anthropromorphism"!!!!

The Psalmist. And, yes, Psalms are full of anthropromorphisms.

Geesh!!! Yes. There are times when God relates to us in human terms. NO. This isn't one of them. An example would be when a writer talks of being under the "shadow of His Wing". No. God doesn't have a "wing" like a bird.

If you're going to be honest in this.... by all means.... Prove this specific verse is anthropomorphic.

Isn't it ironic that you're talking about pantheon in Rome..... (well you didn't. You got mixed up)......when you didn't get this junk you're peddling from Jewish culture.

 

[Ransom]

No matter on what side you fall on this issue, you have to admit, there's no proof-text for "God loves you (meaning each and every person who lives, lived, or will live)".  You can infer it indirectly from other texts like "God is love".  But there are more direct verses about who God hates to counter that.

No, you're wrong. "God is love" means God is like the biggest radio station in the universe that constantly blasts "Kum Ba Ya," "All You Need Is Love," and the Barney theme song all the time and never has anything against anybody, ever.

 

[The Rogue Tomato]

John 3:16 is a pretty strong proof text.

Not really.  If "God so loved the world" meant "God loves everyone who lives, lived, and will live", that would be contradicted by many passages, including some things Jesus himself did and said. 

 

[The Rogue Tomato]

No matter on what side you fall on this issue, you have to admit, there's no proof-text for "God loves you (meaning each and every person who lives, lived, or will live)".  You can infer it indirectly from other texts like "God is love".  But there are more direct verses about who God hates to counter that.

No, you're wrong. "God is love" means God is like the biggest radio station in the universe that constantly blasts "Kum Ba Ya," "All You Need Is Love," and the Barney theme song all the time and never has anything against anybody, ever.

Dang, you're right.  I assume that also means God also has a skin condition.  So when the Bible says things like "The wrath of God is revealed" it really means "The rash of God is revealed..." 

 

[rsc2a]

[quote author=praise_yeshua]Geesh!!! Yes. There are times when God relates to us in human terms. NO. This isn't one of them. An example would be when a writer talks of being under the "shadow of His Wing". No. God doesn't have a "wing" like a bird.

If you're going to be honest in this.... by all means.... Prove this specific verse is anthropomorphic.[/quote]

ANY time you associate human emotions to God, you are being anthropomorphic.

[quote author=praise_yeshua]Isn't it ironic that you're talking about pantheon in Rome..... (well you didn't. You got mixed up)......when you didn't get this junk you're peddling from Jewish culture.
[/quote]

Isn't it ironic that you are talking about a Christian view of God when you reject that view? And, no...I specifically had Zeus in mind when I wrote that, but Jupiter works as well since they are functionally the same. If you want to talk about Jewish cultural expectations about Yahweh, we can start with God who would become man...

 

[rsc2a]

John 3:16 is a pretty strong proof text.

Not really.  If "God so loved the world" meant "God loves everyone who lives, lived, and will live", that would be contradicted by many passages, including some things Jesus himself did and said.

Since God so loved the world that whoever believes, I'll take it to mean whoever...not a super duper special group of insiders. As far as things that Jesus did, I'd say dying on the cross, "and not just for your sins but the sins of the whole world" seems to be a pretty clear action.

 

[Fresh Air]

You mean HAC ers avoid Romans 9?

Not at all. We just interpret it correctly.

 

[Fresh Air]

No matter on what side you fall on this issue, you have to admit, there's no proof-text for "God loves you (meaning each and every person who lives, lived, or will live)". 

A plague. I rest my case on the most famous verse in the entire Bible.

 

[praise_yeshua]

[quote author=praise_yeshua]Geesh!!! Yes. There are times when God relates to us in human terms. NO. This isn't one of them. An example would be when a writer talks of being under the "shadow of His Wing". No. God doesn't have a "wing" like a bird.

If you're going to be honest in this.... by all means.... Prove this specific verse is anthropomorphic.

ANY time you associate human emotions to God, you are being anthropomorphic.

[quote author=praise_yeshua]Isn't it ironic that you're talking about pantheon in Rome..... (well you didn't. You got mixed up)......when you didn't get this junk you're peddling from Jewish culture.
[/quote]

Isn't it ironic that you are talking about a Christian view of God when you reject that view? And, no...I specifically had Zeus in mind when I wrote that, but Jupiter works as well since they are functionally the same. If you want to talk about Jewish cultural expectations about Yahweh, we can start with God who would become man...
[/quote]

Indignation isn't anymore a human emotion than Love is exclusively a human emotion. Are really that lost in this?

You told me to go to a Greek pantheon. I can't. I know where a Roman pantheon still stands. I can't read your mind. I don't want to get anywhere near it..... your mind that is....

 

[rsc2a]

Do you even know what a pantheon is?

 

[Recovering IFB]

No matter on what side you fall on this issue, you have to admit, there's no proof-text for "God loves you (meaning each and every person who lives, lived, or will live)". 

A plague. I rest my case on the most famous verse in the entire Bible.

I kinda to take you seriously when you believe that you "chose God" when Romans 9 talks about showing His mercy to his chosen vessels.

 

[praise_yeshua]

Do you even know what a pantheon is?

Sure I do. You don't know how to properly qualify much of anything.

 

[rsc2a]

Do you even know what a pantheon is?

Sure I do. You don't know how to properly qualify much of anything.

What in the world are you talking about?

 

[subllibrm]

Do you even know what a pantheon is?

Sure I do. You don't know how to properly qualify much of anything.

What in the world are you talking about?

Pantheons. Great big snakes that squeeze their prey to death as apposed to biting them.  8)

 

[Smellin Coffee]

A classic example of why I avoid calvinism like the plague... It is a plague.

You mean HAC ers avoid Romans 9?

Is "Romans 9" the name of a movie theater?

No, Romans 9 was a group of gladiators in the same vein as the Magnificent 7.

Oh, got it. Kinda like Moses and the 10 Commandos.