Hillary, abortion and the vote.

[Smellin Coffee]

You really are clueless sometimes...or just desperate to defend the indefensible.

Innocent - not responsible for or directly involved in an event yet suffering its consequences. (i. e. "an innocent bystander")

Then leave your doctrine out of it and quit scapegoating Christians who believe politically different than you. Your high horse uses spirituality as the guide when in essence, it isn't your doctrine (that of "everyone is guilty") but rather your secularism which you view your politics.

There is nothing wrong with the separation of the two, but to attack those who follow Christ who believe differently, that is where you are being hypocritical.

I've admitted I do it too. I have stated over and over that I believe the act of homosexuality is a form of adultery, hence I believe it is sinful. That is spiritual in belief. But I believe also in the secular, that gay people should be allowed to be married so they can receive proper familial benefits. That is secular. But I am not scapegoating those who disagree with me, bashing them because they believe gays shouldn't marry.

So you claim to be "pro-life" based on biblical principle and beat on Christians who disagree, yet when the spiritual/biblical side of "innocence" is approached, you jump to your secular definition and application.

This isn't about my cluelessness (which I admit to sometimes) but about your hypocrisy and scapegoating; driving a political wedge among Jesus' followers. A political wedge spearheaded by corrupt, godless politicians who are driven to garner more fame, money and power and using Jesus' followers as mindless lemmings, to the destruction of the example Christ left us to follow.

 

[Smellin Coffee]

Just because you may disagree does not mean it's black and white. No one has a monopoly on Bible understanding.

Life before birth is either a human life or not. This is an either or. I will stick with the biblical, scientific, logical and the only sensible idea that a baby developing in the mother is still a human baby when it exits.

And I agree with you , but I wonder at people who get so astonished that someone else can have a different belief. I'm not so arrogant to assume that my understanding of the Bible is right. I've looked at the verses that the pro-choice crowd believes in and I can totally see their point of view.

I am astonished that anyone who could read scripture....determine that abortion is not killing a baby and that homosexuality is not sexual perversion...would have the mental capacity to dress themselves in the morning.

I'm astonished that killing one's own unborn baby via a medical procedure is wrong but bombing the crap out of villages, killing unborn babies of other "innocents" is fair game and acceptable. How "Christian" and "pro-life" of one to believe that.

 

[Ransom]

Many Christians don't think the Bible teaches life before birth. To some it's a gray area.

Whether a fetus is alive before birth, is settled by fact, not by the opinions of "many Christians."

(and many Christians think birth control is a form of abortion but you don't see them calling people names for disagreeing with their position - even though it is literally murder in their eyes)

Also inaccurate. Many people (not just Christians) believe some oral contraception acts as an abortifacient.  On the other hand, birth control methods that operate by preventing conception (condoms, spermicide, etc.) are by no definition "a form of abortion." Since no conception occurs, there is nothing to abort.

God had several chances to support the death penalty and never did it.

Well, except for murder, adultery, homosexuality, kidnapping, rape, disrespecting your parents, working on the Sabbath . . .

Many Christians would say that God is clearly against the death penalty.

Obviously, "many Christians" find themselves wrong about many things.

 

[Twisted]

I'm astonished that killing one's own unborn baby via a medical procedure is wrong but bombing the crap out of villages, killing unborn babies of other "innocents" is fair game and acceptable. How "Christian" and "pro-life" of one to believe that.

Correct.  Both are wrong.

Best thing Smellin has written in a decade.

 

[Tarheel Baptist]

You really are clueless sometimes...or just desperate to defend the indefensible.

Innocent - not responsible for or directly involved in an event yet suffering its consequences. (i. e. "an innocent bystander")

Then leave your doctrine out of it and quit scapegoating Christians who believe politically different than you. Your high horse uses spirituality as the guide when in essence, it isn't your doctrine (that of "everyone is guilty") but rather your secularism which you view your politics.

There is nothing wrong with the separation of the two, but to attack those who follow Christ who believe differently, that is where you are being hypocritical.

I've admitted I do it too. I have stated over and over that I believe the act of homosexuality is a form of adultery, hence I believe it is sinful. That is spiritual in belief. But I believe also in the secular, that gay people should be allowed to be married so they can receive proper familial benefits. That is secular. But I am not scapegoating those who disagree with me, bashing them because they believe gays shouldn't marry.

So you claim to be "pro-life" based on biblical principle and beat on Christians who disagree, yet when the spiritual/biblical side of "innocence" is approached, you jump to your secular definition and application.

This isn't about my cluelessness (which I admit to sometimes) but about your hypocrisy and scapegoating; driving a political wedge among Jesus' followers. A political wedge spearheaded by corrupt, godless politicians who are driven to garner more fame, money and power and using Jesus' followers as mindless lemmings, to the destruction of the example Christ left us to follow.

You are again low in information...facts.
Abortion is a front burner political issue...has been since the 60's.
It was a biblical moral issue for thousands of years before that.
I base my political position on the biblical position. Period.
You are, frankly, biblically ignorant.

You and socialist liberal democrats, who have it in their platform to openly use tax dollars to fund abortions are legalizing murder....murder of innocent, helpless babies. You can dodge, shuck, jive, deflect and dance the Polka....but that is THE truth around life.

And for you to compare government sanctioned capital punishment to abortion is so ludicrous as to be funny....if it were not so sad on its face. The same with war! Which is again more liberal shuck and jive.

You are what you are, and I'm sorry but you are well on your way to being a useful idiot! 

 

[sword]

Many Christians don't think the Bible teaches life before birth. To some it's a gray area.

Whether a fetus is alive before birth, is settled by fact, not by the opinions of "many Christians."

(and many Christians think birth control is a form of abortion but you don't see them calling people names for disagreeing with their position - even though it is literally murder in their eyes)

Also inaccurate. Many people (not just Christians) believe some oral contraception acts as an abortifacient.  On the other hand, birth control methods that operate by preventing conception (condoms, spermicide, etc.) are by no definition "a form of abortion." Since no conception occurs, there is nothing to abort.

God had several chances to support the death penalty and never did it.

Well, except for murder, adultery, homosexuality, kidnapping, rape, disrespecting your parents, working on the Sabbath . . .

Many Christians would say that God is clearly against the death penalty.

Obviously, "many Christians" find themselves wrong about many things.

Ransom, Please don't cloud this discussion with logic & facts. Doing so will leave one of the participants at a huge disadvantage. 

 

[Tarheel Baptist]

I'm astonished that killing one's own unborn baby via a medical procedure is wrong but bombing the crap out of villages, killing unborn babies of other "innocents" is fair game and acceptable. How "Christian" and "pro-life" of one to believe that.

Correct.  Both are wrong.

Best thing Smellin has written in a decade.

The difference is that no one here is encouraging the latter.
Do YOU believe war, capital punishment are the moral equivalent of killing babies in the womb??

And, taken to the extreme, Smellin a crock would be against a gubmit supporting a standing army of any kind. But , consistency isn't in the socialist liberal democrat dictionary.

 

[Tarheel Baptist]

Many Christians don't think the Bible teaches life before birth. To some it's a gray area.

Whether a fetus is alive before birth, is settled by fact, not by the opinions of "many Christians."

(and many Christians think birth control is a form of abortion but you don't see them calling people names for disagreeing with their position - even though it is literally murder in their eyes)

Also inaccurate. Many people (not just Christians) believe some oral contraception acts as an abortifacient.  On the other hand, birth control methods that operate by preventing conception (condoms, spermicide, etc.) are by no definition "a form of abortion." Since no conception occurs, there is nothing to abort.

God had several chances to support the death penalty and never did it.

Well, except for murder, adultery, homosexuality, kidnapping, rape, disrespecting your parents, working on the Sabbath . . .

Many Christians would say that God is clearly against the death penalty.

Obviously, "many Christians" find themselves wrong about many things.

Ransom, Please don't cloud this discussion with logic & facts. Doing so will leave one of the participants at a huge disadvantage.

Actually 2 of the participants....but who's counting? 

 

[Tarheel Baptist]

Pro choice* Christian!
Talk about your oxymorons....
Bwaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah!










* pro killing innocent, helpless babies in the womb.

 

[FSSL]

I'm astonished that killing one's own unborn baby via a medical procedure is wrong but bombing the crap out of villages, killing unborn babies of other "innocents" is fair game and acceptable. How "Christian" and "pro-life" of one to believe that.

First, killing infants and medical procedure do not belong in the same sentence.

Second, I also agree that the Palestinians and ISIS are murderous terrorists for killing innocents and children.

What Christian believes "bombing the crap out of villages" is acceptable? Your hyperbole is not engaging the argument.

 

[Tarheel Baptist]

Someone just sent me this link: Christian, there is no place for you in the democrat party. We can read it together and enter a civil discussion  about its content:

http://www.theblaze.com/contributions/wake-up-christians-there-is-no-place-for-you-in-the-democrat-party/

 

[subllibrm]

Hillary is a genocidal maniac!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b3w-AxfVlLI&feature=player_embedded

Then we are a genocidal society because she is right about what the law says.

 

[Tarheel Baptist]

Hillary is a genocidal maniac!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b3w-AxfVlLI&feature=player_embeddedu

Then we are a genocidal society because she is right about what the law says.

We certainly are, and proud of it! 

http://www.weeklystandard.com/dnc-speaker-shouts-her-abortion-and-the-crowd-cheers/article/2003531

 

[ALAYMAN]

Then we are a genocidal society because she is right about what the law says.

It isn't about her interpretion of abortion laws, but that she favors and stridently advocates the murderous laws.

 

[subllibrm]

Then we are a genocidal society because she is right about what the law says.

It isn't about her interpretion of abortion laws, but that she favors and stridently advocates the murderous laws.

As does a significant portion of our society.

 

[Ransom]

As does a significant portion of our society.

They're wrong and should be corrected.  And if they refuse to be corrected, they are evil and should be ostracized.

 

[Twisted]

As does a significant portion of our society.

They're wrong and should be corrected. 

As my mommy used to say, "Go cut me a switch!"

 

[Darkwing Duck]

Many Christians don't think the Bible teaches life before birth. To some it's a gray area.

Whether a fetus is alive before birth, is settled by fact, not by the opinions of "many Christians."

(and many Christians think birth control is a form of abortion but you don't see them calling people names for disagreeing with their position - even though it is literally murder in their eyes)

Also inaccurate. Many people (not just Christians) believe some oral contraception acts as an abortifacient.  On the other hand, birth control methods that operate by preventing conception (condoms, spermicide, etc.) are by no definition "a form of abortion." Since no conception occurs, there is nothing to abort.

God had several chances to support the death penalty and never did it.

Well, except for murder, adultery, homosexuality, kidnapping, rape, disrespecting your parents, working on the Sabbath . . .

Many Christians would say that God is clearly against the death penalty.

Obviously, "many Christians" find themselves wrong about many things.

Ransom, Please don't cloud this discussion with logic & facts. Doing so will leave one of the participants at a huge disadvantage.

? I thought that was the point of the discussion?

Anyway, I've had the discussion about the death penalty before. People see things differently. I'm glad that it is black and white for some of you but for other it is not. You talk about murders - God didn't kill Cain, you talk about adultery - God didn't kill David or Bathsheba, you talk about rape - God didn't kill Amnon, etc, etc.

God very often didn't follow the death penalty. That's an actual fact. See? I can have facts too. I'm not opposed to facts nor am I opposed to learning.

 

[Tarheel Baptist]

Many Christians don't think the Bible teaches life before birth. To some it's a gray area.

Whether a fetus is alive before birth, is settled by fact, not by the opinions of "many Christians."

(and many Christians think birth control is a form of abortion but you don't see them calling people names for disagreeing with their position - even though it is literally murder in their eyes)

Also inaccurate. Many people (not just Christians) believe some oral contraception acts as an abortifacient.  On the other hand, birth control methods that operate by preventing conception (condoms, spermicide, etc.) are by no definition "a form of abortion." Since no conception occurs, there is nothing to abort.

God had several chances to support the death penalty and never did it.

Well, except for murder, adultery, homosexuality, kidnapping, rape, disrespecting your parents, working on the Sabbath . . .

Many Christians would say that God is clearly against the death penalty.

Obviously, "many Christians" find themselves wrong about many things.

Ransom, Please don't cloud this discussion with logic & facts. Doing so will leave one of the participants at a huge disadvantage.

? I thought that was the point of the discussion?

Anyway, I've had the discussion about the death penalty before. People see things differently. I'm glad that it is black and white for some of you but for other it is not. You talk about murders - God didn't kill Cain, you talk about adultery - God didn't kill David or Bathsheba, you talk about rape - God didn't kill Amnon, etc, etc.

God very often didn't follow the death penalty. That's an actual fact. See? I can have facts too. I'm not opposed to facts nor am I opposed to learning.

Are you ok with your tax dollars paying for abortions?
Do you believe abortion kills a baby? Takes a life?
Are you opposed to a country having a standing army, considering that armies are trained specifically to kill people? Should our country attack ISIS where they live?
Do you believe that a government executing the death penalty on a convicted murderer is just another murder being committed?

 

[Walt]

Many Christians don't think the Bible teaches life before birth. To some it's a gray area.

Really?  I guess I have a limited set of Christian friends.  While there may be some disagreement about when life does begin, almost every Christian I know believes that an unborn child is alive.

It was, I think, on here that a lady gave what I thought was an excellent argument for when life began: that the Scripture tells us that "the life of the flesh is in the blood" - therefore, when the fertilized egg implants in the womb and begins exchanging blood with the mother, that is when life begins.

(and many Christians think birth control is a form of abortion but you don't see them calling people names for disagreeing with their position - even though it is literally murder in their eyes)

God had several chances to support the death penalty and never did it. Many Christians would say that God is clearly against the death penalty.

Eh? I thought God was the One who established the death penalty.

Just because you may disagree does not mean it's black and white. No one has a monopoly on Bible understanding.

Certainly true.