Is the IFB movement fatally flawed? If so is it redeemable? If yes, then how?

pastorryanhayden

pastorryanhayden

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Just trying to get something started here with some questions:
1) Is the IFB movement (I'm thinking Hyles, Sword of the Lord, West Coast, Crown, etc.) fatally flawed?
2) If you do believe it is fatally flawed, then how?
3) If you do believe it is fatally flawed, is it redeemable?
4) If you think it's flawed and redeemable, how do you see that happening?

I'll look forward to your posts - I'd really like to see Frag, Pappabear, Prophet, etc. chime in on this.
 
Any aspect of a movement that is of God, for God, about God, with God, through God is alive.  Any part of a movement that is not of, for, about, with or through God is fatally flawed. 

if I must have a description, write down IFB and slap that label on me. 
 
It's my label too JrChurch. 
But there are parts of the movement that aren't of God, there are parts that are more about men and man made rules than God, there are parts relying more on themselves than with God or through God.
I believe with all my heart there are many of IFB churches that are faithful to God and His Word, but I also know there is a lot of messed up stuff that goes on in the name of the "movement" of fundamentalism.
 
pastorryanhayden said:
It's my label too JrChurch. 
But there are parts of the movement that aren't of God, there are parts that are more about men and man made rules than God, there are parts relying more on themselves than with God or through God.
I believe with all my heart there are many of IFB churches that are faithful to God and His Word, but I also know there is a lot of messed up stuff that goes on in the name of the "movement" of fundamentalism.
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And the useless stuff will die off.
 
IFB is not my label; I'm Episcopalutheran, not a Baptist at all. But IFB is a label I very much respect when it's the kind JrChurch is talking about.
 
pastorryanhayden said:
Just trying to get something started here with some questions:
1) Is the IFB movement (I'm thinking Hyles, Sword of the Lord, West Coast, Crown, etc.) fatally flawed?
2) If you do believe it is fatally flawed, then how?
3) If you do believe it is fatally flawed, is it redeemable?
4) If you think it's flawed and redeemable, how do you see that happening?

I'll look forward to your posts - I'd really like to see Frag, Pappabear, Prophet, etc. chime in on this.
Click to expand...

I do not follow the "movement" as focused as I used to. Most of what I know nowadays I see from here, occasional looks at the SOTL site, SFL, reading multiple Christian sites and blogs for and against and working in a business which Christian churches and ministry clients.

All of that being said, what I see as "the face" of the IFB movement is seriously flawed because among other things, much of it is built on lies and exaggeration. (It's important here of course to draw a difference between the caricature of of IFB that dominates the "movement" and some churches that don't reflect them). I do not see the IFB movement largely as a doctrinal movement as they would have you believe but that of a personal/tribal feudalism of preferential separation.

The lies and falsification? IFB tribe elevate preferences as scriptural pronouncements.  They exaggerates and/or lie about the other to gain a following, stature or students and then most of all the tribes together exaggerate or lie about many non-IFB Christians, social ills, "the  world" and any number of things, sometimes for effect, other times because they are so shut off from the world they are just not aware.

Fatally flawed as a movement? Guess it depends on what is meant by that. No one is beyond redemption individually of course. As a movement I think it will stick around though it will continue like a flesh-eating virus. Thus is the nature of hyper-separation.

IMO of course.
 
Another thing occurs to me....

Just as many in the black community do not like the Jessee Jackson's and Al Sharpton's being self-apointed and press-anointed as "black leaders" I'm sure many in the IFB movement do not like to be tied to Hyles, Bob Jones, SOTL or any so-called "leader" you want to choose.

But it's easier to change your name than your skin color.
 
Thanks Just John,
That is exactly what I was looking for.  I am in total agreement with you that much of the "face" of the "movement" is predicated on lies and exaggerations and that there are many who are just scratching each other's back and vieing for popularity and pull within "the movement."

Personally, one of the most liberating days of my life was when I realized that "the movement" was and is nothing and that I don't answer to them.  I am an independent Baptist, and I'm pretty independent of all of the leaders.

As to the "leaders," several of the current leaders are men worthy of respect.  I respect Paul Chappell and Clarence Sexton.  I want nothing to do with the "I spent five minutes more with Jack Hyles than you did" crowd or "the I'm more fundamental than you" crowd.
 
pastorryanhayden said:
Thanks Just John,
That is exactly what I was looking for.  I am in total agreement with you that much of the "face" of the "movement" is predicated on lies and exaggerations and that there are many who are just scratching each other's back and vieing for popularity and pull within "the movement."

Personally, one of the most liberating days of my life was when I realized that "the movement" was and is nothing and that I don't answer to them.  I am an independent Baptist, and I'm pretty independent of all of the leaders.

As to the "leaders," several of the current leaders are men worthy of respect.  I respect Paul Chappell and Clarence Sexton.  I want nothing to do with the "I spent five minutes more with Jack Hyles than you did" crowd or "the I'm more fundamental than you" crowd.
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Which is why you have my respect. I know we would disagree on some things but also know we would have a wonderful meal and time of fellowship together despite those differences.
 
[quote author=Just John]Which is why you have my respect. I know we would disagree on some things but also know we would have a wonderful meal and time of fellowship together despite those differences.[/quote]

Seconded.
 
Man is flawed, as well as their rules. I don't follow man I follow the Lord. I proudly wear the IFB label.
 
kaba said:
Man is flawed, as well as their rules. I don't follow man I follow the Lord. I proudly wear the IFB label.
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Labels are important things to many people. I have zero issue with your choice above. Nor with Southern Baptists or "non-denominational evangelicals", also independents, claiming the same. (I don't believe from your posts here that you have such issues either). Yet many in the IFB movement, holding steadfast to their "label" despite their "many flaws" chastise other independent believers for any wrong done under their "label" and can only be "right" if they change their label...to IFB

 
pastorryanhayden said:
Just trying to get something started here with some questions:
1) Is the IFB movement (I'm thinking Hyles, Sword of the Lord, West Coast, Crown, etc.) fatally flawed?
2) If you do believe it is fatally flawed, then how?
3) If you do believe it is fatally flawed, is it redeemable?
4) If you think it's flawed and redeemable, how do you see that happening?

I'll look forward to your posts - I'd really like to see Frag, Pappabear, Prophet, etc. chime in on this.
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1) no...ergo by your set up I don't need to answer any more questions. =)
 
pastorryanhayden said:
Just trying to get something started here with some questions:
1) Is the IFB movement (I'm thinking Hyles, Sword of the Lord, West Coast, Crown, etc.) fatally flawed?
Click to expand...


When I think of fundamentalism I don't think of that crowd. A lot of "IBF" problems/complaints mentioned here are "Baptist" problems.................not fundamentalisms.





 
rsc2a said:
[quote author=Just John]Which is why you have my respect. I know we would disagree on some things but also know we would have a wonderful meal and time of fellowship together despite those differences.
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Seconded.
[/quote]

Thirded?
 
subllibrm said:
rsc2a said:
[quote author=Just John]Which is why you have my respect. I know we would disagree on some things but also know we would have a wonderful meal and time of fellowship together despite those differences.
Click to expand...

Seconded.
Click to expand...

Thirded?
[/quote]

I'll third it, or fourth it, as the case may be. 8)
 
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