Just a reminder to us on the FFF who the real liberals are...

[ALAYMAN]

Ransom said something on another thread that prompted this one. He said, in effect, "I'm fine with having arguments", which I thought, as usual for his thoughts, was a eloquent and succinct way of saying that there's nothing wrong with having differing opinions and trying to point out the logical differences in those opinions. That's what we do here on the FFF, or at least that is the theoretical goal, but usually just breaks out in a food-fight . Anyhoo, I was reading some stuff that amounted to a different perspective than us "bible-believers", and came across the following...

Since examining church websites, I’ve noticed some pretty strange beliefs out there. Many churches have a list of beliefs that are important to them. What is the first belief on many church websites? The Bible.
One church begins its list of beliefs like this:

1. The Authority of Scripture
2. The Nature of God
3. Jesus, God’s Son
4. The Holy Spirit
5. Salvation
6. Nature of Man (Sorry, women. You apparently don’t have nature … but if you read the description, you might decide that’s a good thing.)
7. The Role of the Church

Now, those are all important aspects of Christianity, and I don’t mean to pick on fellow Christians, but the order tells us what’s wrong with American Christianity. We have elevated the Bible above God. It’s time we stop that form of idolatry. Bibliolatry has no place in Christianity. But, unfortunately, the Bible has become another god, above the Trinity, above Jesus, above the Holy Spirit. I appreciate the passion that many “Bible believing” churches have. That passion is a good thing, but it’s misdirected. Christians shouldn’t “believe” in the Bible. We are not Biblians. We are Christians. Don’t get me wrong. I love the Bible. It’s an important book. But it’s not a member of the Trinity. It deserves to be respected, but it shouldn’t be elevated above God. “Bible believing churches” tend to think that “the Bible is the very Word of God – supernaturally inspired in every word and absolutely free from error in the original documents. God’s word is the final authority in all that it says. Therefore, it must be believed in all that it teaches, obeyed in all that it requires, and trusted in all that it promises.” Link

Just thought it would be a nice reminder as we go at each other's throats over issues of Bible versions, standards, contemporary music, etc, that we re-focus and realize what real heresy and liberalism looks like disguised as spirituality and "real Christianity".

 

[AverageJoe]

Ransom said something on another thread that prompted this one. He said, in effect, "I'm fine with having arguments", which I thought, as usual for his thoughts, was a eloquent and succinct way of saying that there's nothing wrong with having differing opinions and trying to point out the logical differences in those opinions. That's what we do here on the FFF, or at least that is the theoretical goal, but usually just breaks out in a food-fight . Anyhoo, I was reading some stuff that amounted to a different perspective than us "bible-believers", and came across the following...

Just thought it would be a nice reminder as we go at each other's throats over issues of Bible versions, standards, contemporary music, etc, that we re-focus and realize what real heresy and liberalism looks like disguised as spirituality and "real Christianity".

It's hard to discuss ANYTHING with ANY DEGREE OF SERIOUSNESS with all these trolls around....sorry, but I just don't believe it can be done in this type of format. It's not like the old FFF where things had a nice, regular flow, and many of the trolls were fun.

 

[ALAYMAN]

It's hard to discuss ANYTHING with ANY DEGREE OF SERIOUSNESS with all these trolls around....sorry, but I just don't believe it can be done in this type of format. It's not like the old FFF where things had a nice, regular flow, and many of the trolls were fun.

We probably have differing definitions of what constitutes a troll, but I agree with you that the substantive conversation of those years gone by is hard to come by these days. We'll just have to try to create good mojo ourselves.

 

[voicecrying]

sanderson would tell you that the Bible is Jesus.

 

[ALAYMAN]

sanderson would tell you that the Bible is Jesus.

Now that was a quality blast from the past post!

 

[aleshanee]

sanderson would tell you that the Bible is Jesus.

Now that was a quality blast from the past post!

isn;t sanderson the one who posted a selfie video of himself getting tased by border patrol?.......
......that;s a blast from the past alright..... i wonder what he thinks of border patrol now......

 

[ALAYMAN]

isn;t sanderson the one who posted a selfie video of himself getting tased by border patrol?.......
......that;s a blast from the past alright..... i wonder what he thinks of border patrol now......

Steven Anderson, yep, of Don't taze me bro fame!

 

[voicecrying]

isn;t sanderson the one who posted a selfie video of himself getting tased by border patrol?.......
......that;s a blast from the past alright..... i wonder what he thinks of border patrol now......

I don't think that slowed him down any. He now has also been banned from traveling to multiple countries because of what he spews about LGBTQ+.

 

[Ransom]

isn;t sanderson the one who posted a selfie video of himself getting tased by border patrol?.......
......that;s a blast from the past alright..... i wonder what he thinks of border patrol now......

That's the guy!

I never miss an excuse to post his taser video. Unfortunately, it looks like he's made it private since the last time. Spamderson has largely made himself scarce since he became persona non grata on social media (to say nothing of most of the free world!) a few years ago.

 

[ALAYMAN]

That's the guy!

I never miss an excuse to post his taser video. Unfortunately, it looks like he's made it private since the last time. Spamderson has largely made himself scarce since he became persona non grata on social media (to say nothing of most of the free world!) a few years ago.

I don't remember if I ever watched the original footage(s) of him being tased so I don't know if there are multiple tasing events, but the CNN video I linked to has a tasing description of him at the 3:40 mark of the video.

 

[Ransom]

I don't remember if I ever watched the original footage(s) of him being tased so I don't know if there are multiple tasing events, but the CNN video I linked to has a tasing description of him at the 3:40 mark of the video.

Oooh! I didn't find that video.

Yeah, that's the stuff. Zot!

 

[illinoisguy]

I never heard of Adam Ericksen, author of the article "Why You Should Run From 'Bible-Believing Churches'" cited in post #1 (click on Link), so I did some research to try to see where he is coming from. Ericksen is identified as a United Church of Christ preacher (a liberal denomination) and a graduate of Garrett Theological Seminary (a liberal United Methodist seminary). He is director of the Raven Foundation - their web site states that they are "Guided by the mimetic insights of René Girard,"

I never heard of Rene Girard, so I checked Wikipedia. Here's what they say about him: "For Girard, religion and mythology were therefore necessary steps in human evolution to control the violence that arises from mimetic rivalry and unequal distribution of desirable things. Religion directed the scapegoat impulse on imaginary concepts, such as Satan or demons, the absence of which would see an increase in human conflict, according to Girard. . . .In Things Hidden Since the Foundation of the World, Girard discusses for the first time Christianity and the Bible. The Gospels ostensibly present themselves as a typical mythical account, with a victim-God lynched by a unanimous crowd, an event that is then commemorated by Christians through ritual sacrifice — a material re-presentation in this case — in the Eucharist. . . .Girard notes, for example, that the disciples actively turn against Jesus. Since Peter warms himself by a fire, and fires always create community, and communities breed mimetic desire, this means that Peter becomes actively hostile to Jesus, seeking his death. According to Pommier, Girard claims that the Gospels present the Crucifixion as a purely human affair, with no indication of Christ dying for the sins of mankind, a claim contradicted by Mark 10:45 and Matthew 20:28."

I think that Alayman's description of this Raven and "mimetic" stuff as "real liberalism and heresy, disguised as spirituality" is quite accurate. Unfortunately, our "food fights" over such things as "Bible versions, standards, contemporary music, etc." are sometimes not much of an improvement.

 

[ALAYMAN]

Unfortunately, our "food fights" over such things as "Bible versions, standards, contemporary music, etc." are sometimes not much of an improvement.

Sad, but true. I have no problems with people's having their own scruples and convictions, I am Baptist after all. The problem comes when those who hold to the issues you mentioned practice their scruples so militantly separatistic that they view everybody who is not in their own "camp" in the same light as the real liberals cited in this OP.