Prayer and stopping the bullets

[Smellin Coffee]

God is not fixing things? God fixes things by inspiring us to act. Don't blame God, instead blame us for not listening to Him.

Neither prayer alone (many Conservatives) nor the bashing of prayer (many Liberals) is the resolution.

 

[praise_yeshua]

God is not fixing things? God fixes things by inspiring us to act. Don't blame God, instead blame us for not listening to Him.

Neither prayer alone (many Conservatives) nor the bashing of prayer (many Liberals) is the resolution.

Agreed!!

 

[Binaca Chugger]

Like the President, this author seems to want to outlaw guns as a solution.  I believe France has banned guns.  The law didn't prevent the massacre.  France has banned God from any governmental relationship.  That didn't stop the bullets either.

I don't believe the weapon commits the attack.  The attack is carried out by a person.  The person is not motivated by the weapon.  The person is motivated by an ideology.  Why not ban the ideology?

 

[The Rogue Tomato]

Like the President, this author seems to want to outlaw guns as a solution.  I believe France has banned guns.  The law didn't prevent the massacre.  France has banned God from any governmental relationship.  That didn't stop the bullets either.

I don't believe the weapon commits the attack.  The attack is carried out by a person.  The person is not motivated by the weapon.  The person is motivated by an ideology.  Why not ban the ideology?

California also has some of the strictest gun laws on the books.  Didn't seem to help much.

 

[praise_yeshua]

Like the President, this author seems to want to outlaw guns as a solution.  I believe France has banned guns.  The law didn't prevent the massacre.  France has banned God from any governmental relationship.  That didn't stop the bullets either.

I don't believe the weapon commits the attack.  The attack is carried out by a person.  The person is not motivated by the weapon.  The person is motivated by an ideology.  Why not ban the ideology?

California had banned the guns used in this crime. It didn't stop them from getting them.

They have an agenda. They want to ultimately confiscate all guns. That's the end game.

 

[Smellin Coffee]

Like the President, this author seems to want to outlaw guns as a solution.  I believe France has banned guns.  The law didn't prevent the massacre.  France has banned God from any governmental relationship.  That didn't stop the bullets either.

I don't believe the weapon commits the attack.  The attack is carried out by a person.  The person is not motivated by the weapon.  The person is motivated by an ideology.  Why not ban the ideology?

California also has some of the strictest gun laws on the books.  Didn't seem to help much.

Until every state gets on the same page with the same gun laws, without state border patrols (of which I am opposed, by the way), there is no empirical evidence to either blame or credit gun laws/restrictions.

 

[The Rogue Tomato]

Like the President, this author seems to want to outlaw guns as a solution.  I believe France has banned guns.  The law didn't prevent the massacre.  France has banned God from any governmental relationship.  That didn't stop the bullets either.

I don't believe the weapon commits the attack.  The attack is carried out by a person.  The person is not motivated by the weapon.  The person is motivated by an ideology.  Why not ban the ideology?

California also has some of the strictest gun laws on the books.  Didn't seem to help much.

Until every state gets on the same page with the same gun laws, without state border patrols (of which I am opposed, by the way), there is no empirical evidence to either blame or credit gun laws/restrictions.

There is no evidence that gun laws help, since criminals and jihadis can get guns even in countries like Australia where guns are illegal. 

There is ample evidence that armed citizens help. 

 

[Smellin Coffee]

I don't believe the weapon commits the attack.  The attack is carried out by a person.  The person is not motivated by the weapon.  The person is motivated by an ideology.  Why not ban the ideology?

No argument from me but how many of those people in CA would have died yesterday in a knife attack instead of one with military-grade weaponry? Granted, people can still pull a McVeigh and create their own car bombs but there is a whole heck of a lot of effort, energy, supplies, etc. to carry it off. Hardly the ease of a "ticked-off" postal employee who goes to his glove box, grabs a weapon and starts shooting.

 

[praise_yeshua]

Like the President, this author seems to want to outlaw guns as a solution.  I believe France has banned guns.  The law didn't prevent the massacre.  France has banned God from any governmental relationship.  That didn't stop the bullets either.

I don't believe the weapon commits the attack.  The attack is carried out by a person.  The person is not motivated by the weapon.  The person is motivated by an ideology.  Why not ban the ideology?

California also has some of the strictest gun laws on the books.  Didn't seem to help much.

Until every state gets on the same page with the same gun laws, without state border patrols (of which I am opposed, by the way), there is no empirical evidence to either blame or credit gun laws/restrictions.

There is no way to practically "DO AWAY" with certain types of weapons without gun confiscation. It doesn't matter what the law says. No law bans the possession of certain guns. They only ban the sale of these guns. There are hundreds of thousands of them already in society. People can get them if they want them.

Questions....

Do you own guns and if you do, would you fight to keep them?

 

[Smellin Coffee]

Like the President, this author seems to want to outlaw guns as a solution.  I believe France has banned guns.  The law didn't prevent the massacre.  France has banned God from any governmental relationship.  That didn't stop the bullets either.

I don't believe the weapon commits the attack.  The attack is carried out by a person.  The person is not motivated by the weapon.  The person is motivated by an ideology.  Why not ban the ideology?

California also has some of the strictest gun laws on the books.  Didn't seem to help much.

Until every state gets on the same page with the same gun laws, without state border patrols (of which I am opposed, by the way), there is no empirical evidence to either blame or credit gun laws/restrictions.

There is no way to practically "DO AWAY" with certain types of weapons without gun confiscation. It doesn't matter what the law says. No law bans the possession of certain guns. They only ban the sale of these guns. There are hundreds of thousands of them already in society. People can get them if they want them.

Questions....

Do you own guns and if you do, would you fight to keep them?

I won't answer that on a public forum. But I will publicly say that I am NOT opposed to owning weapons, even guns.

And I agree there is a practicality problem in their removal. What I am stating is that neither side of the gun control debate can give accurate statistics about guns in our country unless every state enacted and enforced the exact same laws.

 

[Binaca Chugger]

It is not the gun laws that is the problem.  It is not the gun that is the problem.  The ideology is the problem. 

This was premeditated murder on a grand scale.  If we are to believe the family (Keep in mind that deceiving "infidels" for the promotion of islam is promoted by this religion), the shooters carefully planned this event.  Coolly lying to the family about the care for the child and their plans for the afternoon along with the numerous IEDs and gear acquired is signs of calm, calculated, premeditated murder.

What else are we to believe is the motive?  Recent trips to Syria...Devout muslim...Christmas party...Wife acquired in Syria part of the massacre...

 

[The Rogue Tomato]

It is not the gun laws that is the problem.  It is not the gun that is the problem.  The ideology is the problem. 

And since we can't force people to have a better ideology, or force people to be sane, then the best solution is for good people to be armed.

It's like global treaties on nuclear arms.  Sure, it's nice to have the treaties, but we know that there will always be bad countries with nukes.  The best way to prevent them from using the nukes is for us to have nukes, too. 

That's why the places with the fewest gun-related murders are places where the good people have guns.  If everyone at that gathering was armed, I bet those jihadis would have thought twice before picking them as their target. 

 

[Bruh]

Obama tried to spin SanBernardino Muslim Killers as workplace violence but police found an IED factory, pipe bombs, thousands of rounds.

 

[The Rogue Tomato]

Obama tried to spin SanBernardino Muslim Killers as workplace violence but police found an IED factory, pipe bombs, thousands of rounds.

But... if they had an IED factory, a factory is a workplace, right? 

 

[Smellin Coffee]

It is not the gun laws that is the problem.  It is not the gun that is the problem.  The ideology is the problem. 

And since we can't force people to have a better ideology, or force people to be sane, then the best solution is for good people to be armed.

IOW, we need the freedom to arm ourselves to the teeth to protect ourselves from those who arm themselves to the teeth. And the NRA eats it up when these things happen. They preach to become more armed, ammo manufacturers get more business and the threat of violence becomes more pervasive in our society.

I don't have an answer to the problem but neither does either side.

 

[The Rogue Tomato]

IOW, we need the freedom to arm ourselves to the teeth to protect ourselves from those who arm themselves to the teeth. And the NRA eats it up when these things happen. They preach to become more armed, ammo manufacturers get more business and the threat of violence becomes more pervasive in our society.

I don't have an answer to the problem but neither does either side.

I think the "arm yourself" solution is a good answer.  Like I said, the places where gun crimes are least frequent are places where people are most likely to be armed.  That pretty much tells you it's an answer.  Since gun laws don't seem to have any affect on gun crime (except, arguably, to make it worse), than I think that's clearly not the answer. 

Generally, when liberals say, "neither side has a solution", what they really mean is, "my preferred solution doesn't work, and I don't like the obvious solution from the other side". 

 

[Binaca Chugger]

I don't have an answer to the problem but neither does either side.

The answer is Christ and Him crucified.

 

[Smellin Coffee]

IOW, we need the freedom to arm ourselves to the teeth to protect ourselves from those who arm themselves to the teeth. And the NRA eats it up when these things happen. They preach to become more armed, ammo manufacturers get more business and the threat of violence becomes more pervasive in our society.

I don't have an answer to the problem but neither does either side.

I think the "arm yourself" solution is a good answer.  Like I said, the places where gun crimes are least frequent are places where people are most likely to be armed.  That pretty much tells you it's an answer.  Since gun laws don't seem to have any affect on gun crime (except, arguably, to make it worse), than I think that's clearly not the answer. 

Generally, when liberals say, "neither side has a solution", what they really mean is, "my preferred solution doesn't work, and I don't like the obvious solution from the other side".

I can't speak for the liberal side because I don't know their intent in why they say what they do. Seems to me that the more people are armed, the bigger the threat and more opportunity for mass destruction. The reason the gun laws don't work is because they can't work. Why? Because it is nothing to run arms across state lines like people do with fireworks. It doesn't seem logical to me that one can put out a fire by stocking more gasoline around it.

 

[Binaca Chugger]

IOW, we need the freedom to arm ourselves to the teeth to protect ourselves from those who arm themselves to the teeth. And the NRA eats it up when these things happen. They preach to become more armed, ammo manufacturers get more business and the threat of violence becomes more pervasive in our society.

In actuality, it is the fear of restricting firearm and ammunition sales that drives the consumer to the market.  This President has done more to sell the private sector firearms and munitions than any person in the history of the world.  This is fact as personally spoken to me by VP's of many firearm manufacturers.

 

[Smellin Coffee]

IOW, we need the freedom to arm ourselves to the teeth to protect ourselves from those who arm themselves to the teeth. And the NRA eats it up when these things happen. They preach to become more armed, ammo manufacturers get more business and the threat of violence becomes more pervasive in our society.

In actuality, it is the fear of restricting firearm and ammunition sales that drives the consumer to the market.  This President has done more to sell the private sector firearms and munitions than any person in the history of the world.  This is fact as personally spoken to me by VP's of many firearm manufacturers.

I have no doubt that is true. But why? Because people are motivated by fear. When there is a mention of gun control, people then go into hoard mode which increases gun sales. Remember how Twinkies went crazy when Hostess first announced they were closing shop? So as long as there is no restriction as to how many and what kind of arms are allowable by law nationwide, gun hoarding will always happen at the mention of restriction. So gun control rhetoric with no action increases gun and ammo sales. So does gun control in a state that is not universally enforced equally in every state.