Rabbi: Anti-Zionism is not Anti-Semitism
- Thread starter Ekklesian
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You don't respect the opinions of Jews™. Why should we pay any attention to the opinions of your pet Jews™?
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A
‘Thieves, Child Killers, Sexual Abusers, Thugs, Criminals’: Syracuse University Scholar, a Pulitzer Prize Winner, Goes on Tirade Against Israeli People
A Syracuse University visiting scholar and the 2025 Pulitzer Prize winner for commentary described Israelis as "thieves," "child killers," "sexual abusers," "thugs," and "criminals" at a conference in Detroit over the weekend.
freebeacon.com
It's not my fault that the primary presuppositions of your pet doctrine are evaporating. Is it possible that you don't have all the facts?
Interesting use of the trade mark there. Are you indicating those who say they are Jews, and are not?
Here's a couple Premillennialists. This is how the pre-Zionism Premillennialists you've cited, i.e., Calvin and Spurgeon, would speak of Israel™.ASyracuse UniversityFighting Fundamental Forumvisiting scholarwould be scholar and the 2025Pulitzer Prizemost posts winner for commentary described Israelis as "thieves," "child killers," "sexual abusers," "thugs," and "criminals"at a conference in Detroitin a new thread over the weekend.
‘Thieves, Child Killers, Sexual Abusers, Thugs, Criminals’: Syracuse University Scholar, a Pulitzer Prize Winner, Goes on Tirade Against Israeli People
A Syracuse University visiting scholar and the 2025 Pulitzer Prize winner for commentary described Israelis as "thieves," "child killers," "sexual abusers," "thugs," and "criminals" at a conference in Detroit over the weekend.
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And what do you suppose my "pet poctrine" is? Cite examples, please.
You know what they say about people who assUme.
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Seems it's actually Zionism that is revealing itself to be anti-Jew.
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I see you're incapable of just giving a straight answer when asked a simple question, and prefer to talk in riddles. OK, that's fine. You're useless, and so are your opinions.
He would have made one heck of an attorney. I would have hated to go up against him in mock trial.
LOL. Maybe I should have used the word maxim instead of doctrine? I don't know what your confusion is. I gave a pretty straight and simple answer. You like to dismiss any criticism of IsraelTM or its lobby as scapegoating, because "Anti-Zionism = Anti-Jew" to you.
It's a lot easier than thinking. I'll give you that. And virtue signals at the same time.
Rabbi Haim Sofer...certified Jewish enough to 'scapegoat' the Zionists?
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Really. I asked you what my "pet doctrine" was, and at no time after that did you name a pet doctrine that I supposedly hold to.
If by "straight answer" you meant "no answer at all," then congratulations, you nail it, every time.
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Another one of your approved Jews™?
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I am Reformed in my soteriology (doctrine of salvation) and I think the Reformers that left the Roman Catholic Church are to be commended for purging the false doctrines that have damned so many souls. Salvation is by grace alone through faith alone in Christ alone with no need to go though confession to a human priest to receive forgiveness from God and while I agree with that it doesn’t mean I have to believe everything the Reformers taught including every detail of what they believed about eschatology.
Charles Spurgeon, a Reformed Baptist without question believed the Jews would be restored to their homeland at some future point and that Messiah would reign as a prince of the house of David. He believed the prophecy concerning Jerusalem being rebuilt in more than her former splendor was not to be spiritualized to mean the Church and that the nations of the earth would one day be a suburban population around the city of Jerusalem. John MacArthur went even further teaching a form of Dispensationalism that also included not only a Pre-Millennial belief but also a Pre-Rapture of the Church before the 7 years of Tribulation as described in the book of Daniel and Revelation. R.C. Sproul also believed God was not through with ethnic Israel along with many other Reformed leaders. They got these teachings from verses like Jeremiah 31:3 that talks about the everlasting love God has for the Jewish people and later on in the chapter where God says He set the ordinances of the moon and stars and the waves of the sea and “If this fixed order departs from before me, declares the LORD, then shall the offspring of Israel cease from being a nation before me forever” (Jeremiah 31:35-36). The apostle Paul also distinguished between the nation of Israel and the Church where he said the nation of Israel would not only be cut off, but also “grafted in again” and “being saved” (Romans 11:23, 26) which is yet future.
I don’t believe most Reformed Christians are anti-Semitic but the Jewish tropes and vile hatred by some is troubling. If John MacArthur could have such a close friendship with R.C. Sproul and Ray Comfort can fellowship with Vodie Baucham and other Reformed leaders there is no reason differences in eschatology should divide the body of Christ to the point that we are all enemies. I totally reject the hatred Ekk spues out of his mouth.
Charles Spurgeon, a Reformed Baptist without question believed the Jews would be restored to their homeland at some future point and that Messiah would reign as a prince of the house of David. He believed the prophecy concerning Jerusalem being rebuilt in more than her former splendor was not to be spiritualized to mean the Church and that the nations of the earth would one day be a suburban population around the city of Jerusalem. John MacArthur went even further teaching a form of Dispensationalism that also included not only a Pre-Millennial belief but also a Pre-Rapture of the Church before the 7 years of Tribulation as described in the book of Daniel and Revelation. R.C. Sproul also believed God was not through with ethnic Israel along with many other Reformed leaders. They got these teachings from verses like Jeremiah 31:3 that talks about the everlasting love God has for the Jewish people and later on in the chapter where God says He set the ordinances of the moon and stars and the waves of the sea and “If this fixed order departs from before me, declares the LORD, then shall the offspring of Israel cease from being a nation before me forever” (Jeremiah 31:35-36). The apostle Paul also distinguished between the nation of Israel and the Church where he said the nation of Israel would not only be cut off, but also “grafted in again” and “being saved” (Romans 11:23, 26) which is yet future.
I don’t believe most Reformed Christians are anti-Semitic but the Jewish tropes and vile hatred by some is troubling. If John MacArthur could have such a close friendship with R.C. Sproul and Ray Comfort can fellowship with Vodie Baucham and other Reformed leaders there is no reason differences in eschatology should divide the body of Christ to the point that we are all enemies. I totally reject the hatred Ekk spues out of his mouth.
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I came close to joining a Reformed Baptist congregation when I first moved back to Houston in 2006. I really liked the pastor and their Bible-based expository teaching. Didn't mind their Preterist views too much but their hostility towards modern-day Israel was too much for me. I do not know how the end-times will play out but I am convinced that according to Romans 11 which you have cited, God will visit the Jewish people once more prior to our Lord's return. It seems that most good Reformed folk agree with this to some point.
I don't have too much animosity towards the "Chart Drawing," Dispy, Zionist crowd but I would like to make an appeal to them that their blind loyalty towards the modern state of Israel causes us to turn a blind eye towards certain mission fields and unreached people that perhaps we should better focus our attention? There are some among the "Palestinians" who are genuine followers of Christ who are caught up in the middle of the present conflict and overlooked by the Church! There is also a huge, growing Christian community in Iran. We need to remember and pray for them (Heb 13:3) as we pray for the peace of Jerusalem!
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And all God's children said, "AMEN!"
Just a little tweak here to your revision of what Paul actually said...
And they, if they do not go on without faith, will be united to the tree again, because God is able to put them in again. - Romans 11:23 BBE
This is not a promise of the restoral of Israel as you are thinking of Israel and restoration. He simply said, that if they, that is, the branches, the individuals that were cut off, will repent and believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, they will be reunited to the tree, that is to Israel, the Holy Nation, the Church, just as the Gentiles have been.
Paul was one that was cut off because of unbelief. But when he came to faith, he was reunited. He received what Israel had been looking for, that is, the fulfillment of the promises, as the elect of God. (Romans 11:7).
The grafting back in has been happening since the Gospel was first preached.
John the Baptist said God was able of "these stones" to raise up children unto Abraham. That is not a future promise to make believers of rocks. He was checking the pride of the Jews.
In the same way, Paul checked the pride of the believing Gentiles from being tempted into the same condemnation by saying God is able to graft back in the branches that were cut off, because they weren't cut off to make room for the Gentiles, they were cut off because of unbelief.
That's all that's being said. One only needs to look at Paul to realize the future is now.
Now a word about blindness...the blindness is partial, not temporary. The fulness of the Gentiles is what completes Israel. Once the last of the elect has been saved, whether Jew or Gentile, then "all Israel" will have been saved.
That is the restoral of Israel.
"All Israel" is not some group outside the Church waiting for the fictitious end of the 'church age' to be saved.
That's about as simple as it gets. None of this has anything to do with the Zionist aberration called Israel.
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You're making false accusations. I don't hate the Jews. I just don't love them more than I love the Muslims. And neither does God love them more than He loves the Muslims, and neither is their worship any more acceptable than the worship of the Muslims. In addition I reject the idolatry and jew-worship of Dispensationalism, and that's what you're calling hate.
Fortunately the Lord has brought some Jews to my attention to vindicate me against your railing false accustions. They say some of the same things I say, and much worse, about Zionism and the Zionist state of Israel™. They equate Israel™ with Nazi Germany. They aren't bashful at all calling Netanyahu and his government:
traitorous jews, opponents of our people, haters of our religion, and deniers of our history...replacing our religion with their ideology...
...
The Minister of Security of Israel™ [Ben Gvir] is currently dirtying this beautiful country [America] with his presence. Ben Gvir regularly tramples upon the holiness of the Temple Mount, violating its sanctity, violating Jewish law, and compromising the safety and security of Jewish people.
...
Minister of Security, all you've secured, Mr. Ben, by your behavior is a designated place in the lowest pits of hell waiting for you. ... I have something to tell you, Mr. Ben. If you want to be a Zionist, Ben Gvir, take off your yarmulke, stop keeping shabbas, eat some pork, and leave Judaism alone! [LOL, basically "Go to hell!" 
]
]
Sounds like Shapiro is somewhat echoing our Luther with something that might be called 'Those Jews and Their Lies.' Do you consider what Shapiro said about the officials and ideologues of your favorite apartheid state somewhat vile? Well, it's nothing compared to what is said about Jesus in the Talmud, but that's for another time, except to ask what makes you more sick? The things said of Netanyahu and Gvir? Or the things said of Christ?
According to this rabbi, you're the Nazi-loving Jew-hater.
Now what do you think about that?
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Still waiting.