So, what do you do when your church changes?

bruinboy

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This should be a lot of fun. :) Just trying to help you guys that still reside in X-dumb.


What to do when your church changes
Posted on September 15, 2014 by Joe McKeever

These days in my retirement ministry, most of the churches where I’m invited to preach have these things in common….

–Almost no man wears a necktie or suit.

–On the platform you find all kinds of musical instruments.

–Huge screens are mounted on the front walls, where the words of songs and scripture are projected.

–Many people in the congregation read Scripture from their phones.

–Worship leaders are often wearing jeans and sneakers.

–In the announcements, you hear of mission trips to foreign countries, regardless of the size of the church.

–Fewer and fewer hymns are being sung, and when the old ones are brought out, they’re given new treatments. Mostly, though, what’s being sung in worship was written in the past 10 or 12 years.

–Churches announce on their outside signs “blended” services, “contemporary” services, and/or “traditional” services.

The times, they are a-changing, friend.  (And they are not through changing either. So you youngsters should not get too attached to the present innovations.)

If you cannot adapt, you may find yourself living in the 1950s.

The other weekend I worshiped with an interesting church in Jacksonville, Florida.  I have not known that church previously, but had learned a little of their story before arriving.

As the neighborhood changed around them, most of their members had moved away. Since the church failed to make the necessary adjustments to reach new residents of their community, it was slowly dying. So, not long ago, the remaining membership–mostly senior adults–asked a larger (and healthy, thriving) church in the area to take them over.  They would be willing to make whatever changes were necessary to turn this around.

That takes great courage, let me say.

Most “older” churches cannot do this. The members are so wed to the ways of yesterday and the methods of the past that they prefer to let the church die rather than change.

Six months after they called a young pastor from New Orleans to shepherd this transitioning congregation, I showed up for three days of ministry.  As always, before and after preaching, I sat at a table drawing people. I was pleasantly surprised by the large number of children and teens and young families throughout the buildings.  Already, the church is flourishing.

The longtime members of that little church are having to get used to a lot of change.  The pastor does not wear a suit or tie or even a sport coat. Music is provided by a group composed of piano, several guitars, and a drum set.  Four or five young adults were the praise ensemble.

It was a blessed service. The singing was great, the people were happy and friendly, and the fellowship was sweet.  They’re getting this right.

Being with such a happy group of God’s people was such a joy.

What would happen, I wondered, if a member who moved back to town after a year’s absence walked into the service.  A large screen flashes the words to hymns and choruses.  The platform is covered by musical instruments, and an air of informality pervades.

Whoever heard of a church changing?  (Smiley-face here)

Churches are always changing. Only the dead ones don’t.

May I repeat that? Churches are always changing–if they are alive.  I guarantee you that Saddleback Church (Rick Warren) in Orange County is always tweaking what they do. As does North Point (Andy Stanley) in Alpharetta, and Celebration Church (Dennis Watson) in Metairie.

But we see this same scenario playing out again and again.

You’ve belonged to that church for many years.  You were attracted to it because of location and ministry, because you liked the pastor and the people were friendly. You have served the Lord there in numerous capacities and your children grew up there. You have a history with that church. And now….

Now, it’s not the same church.

There’s a new pastor and new leadership. They are attracting a different group of people from the lovely group that drew you in.  You feel less and less a part of things.  You’re not at home with many of the innovations they’re doing now.

What should you do?

1) Recognize that churches are always in a state of change if they are alive.

Everytime someone joins your church or leaves it, the church changes. Everytime a member begins to get serious about reading the Word or witnessing or tithing or ministering, or when they backslide, the church changes.  It is never static, never a frozen entity.

2) You yourself are growing and changing if you are alive and obedient.  I grew up on a certain kind of church music, then grew past that.  Later, my tastes changed and to no one’s surprise, have changed again.

3) Your needs and requirements change.

My tastes change.  It’s called “life.”  After radiation treatment of the head and neck a full decade ago, many things no longer have a taste at all, while others are as wonderful as ever.  I  can handle spicy food better than before since I have fewer functioning taste buds.  Life is like that.

4) Perhaps you are dragging your feet and resisting something new the Holy Spirit is trying to do in your life.

You are if you insist that the Lord do something again in the same way He did it before.  You are dragging your feet and resisting Him if you reject the new things He sends because they are outside your comfort zone. Do you suppose Jonah felt comfortable going to Nineveh?  Don’t you know it was way, way outside his comfort zone?

5) Perhaps the Lord has something new for you in the community and you should be in another church.  This may be His way of cutting you loose from those ties that have bound you so you can move forward.

6) Are you open to new things?  New ways?

If you are not, you’re going to have trouble with the Lord Jesus.

“Behold,” the Lord said, “I make all things new” (Revelation 21:5).  He wasn’t just talking about Heaven, friend.

He’s making me ever-new right now. Yep, I said that.  Psalm 92:12-15 promises that. “The righteous will flourish…. They will still bear fruit in old age. They will be full of sap and very green….”

So, what do you do when your church changes?  Grow with it.
 
aleshanee said:
so how about when that "change" involves embracing and implementing a new practice that the Bible calls an abomination?...... and just for the sake of argument lets say the state even passes a law mandating churches either go along with this new practice or cease certain rights and observances that have been a christian church tradition since the very beginning............ do you give in and "grow with it"?.....  or do you move your membership to another church that continues to stand against those things you believe the Bible calls abomination?..... even though the advocates for such abominations use all the same talking points in your op to try and prove their formerly reprehensible practices are ok now...........

are you going to exclaim "spot on!" as you sit in your sanctuary and watch 2 men standing at the altar turn to face each other and begin french kissing as your pastor pronounces them husband and husband?........  ???

Of course not...his post had nothing whatsoever to do with moving in that direction...nor changing doctrinal truth...nor embracing that which is contrary to God.  Where did you read that in his post?
 
T-Bone said:
aleshanee said:
so how about when that "change" involves embracing and implementing a new practice that the Bible calls an abomination?...... and just for the sake of argument lets say the state even passes a law mandating churches either go along with this new practice or cease certain rights and observances that have been a christian church tradition since the very beginning............ do you give in and "grow with it"?.....  or do you move your membership to another church that continues to stand against those things you believe the Bible calls abomination?..... even though the advocates for such abominations use all the same talking points in your op to try and prove their formerly reprehensible practices are ok now...........

are you going to exclaim "spot on!" as you sit in your sanctuary and watch 2 men standing at the altar turn to face each other and begin french kissing as your pastor pronounces them husband and husband?........  ???

Of course not...his post had nothing whatsoever to do with moving in that direction...nor changing doctrinal truth...nor embracing that which is contrary to God.  Where did you read that in his post?

Yep, don't remember condoning changing any doctrinal truths, just addressing cultural change, that's all.  Let's not get off track and change the subject.  :)
 
aleshanee said:
..... and the only problem is that it;s simply a similar sales pitch being used......

You wrote the exact thought I had when I read BB's words. 
 
He did use among others Rick Warren and Saddleback as a model. Isn't Warren having interfaith dialogue with Muslims highlighting what he calls the common ground between Isalm and Christianity, arent some accusing him of promoting Chrislam?

Thats doctrinal change.
 
ItinerantPreacher said:
He did use among others Rick Warren and Saddleback as a model. Isn't Warren having interfaith dialogue with Muslims highlighting what he calls the common ground between Isalm and Christianity, arent some accusing him of promoting Chrislam?

Thats doctrinal change.

Yes, some are accusing Warren of promoting "Chrislam".  Some of the same people who say he "promotes not having crosses in your churches or speaking about sin". They don't know what they are talking about.  LOL

And does having a relaxed dress atmosphere or use of instruments that have been around for years but not always used in churches automatically or even partially even suggest that you might change your theology? Silliness. What caused so many fundamentalists in the 80's adopt the craziness of KJVO when they hadn't been before....excessive use of the organ or the then popularity of the three-piece suit instead of the less formal two-piece suits?? 
 
Whether I happily go along with changes depends on what the changes are.
Some changes are good, some otherwise.
The "new" style described in the OP is what I was used to anyway.
I like some of it more traditional now, in an Anglican/Lutheran liturgical kind of way.
Certainly I'll take changes in doctrine more seriously than changes in style.
Because like changes in style, some are good, some otherwise.
 
bruinboy said:
So, what do you do when your church changes?  Grow with it.

Yep. Because all change is good, and the presence of young people means a church is flourishing.

<facepalm>
 
ItinerantPreacher said:
He did use among others Rick Warren and Saddleback as a model. Isn't Warren having interfaith dialogue with Muslims highlighting what he calls the common ground between Isalm and Christianity, arent some accusing him of promoting Chrislam?

Thats doctrinal change.

And if some accused you of ... take your pick of falsehoods?

Your post is nothing but;

DOEG!!!!
 
There are times when change is totally good. Like, when I'm broke, but find I have enough change for a worthwhile visit to the Coinstar machine.  ;)

Seriously, I kind of agree with Tom. Not all change is good, and that's true enough to be facepalm worthy. But though the presence of youth doesn't mean a church is flourishing, their absence means it's in the process of dying off.
 
Tom Brennan said:
bruinboy said:
So, what do you do when your church changes?  Grow with it.

Yep. Because all change is good, and the presence of young people means a church is flourishing.

<facepalm>

And their absence means?
 
Well, there is change, and there is change. An egg going rotten is change; so is a tree flourishing and growing.

Technology changes; it is not wrong to use new technology; the Bible doesn't speak to this.  Opposing technology just because it is new is merely foolish.

But at the same time, the trend to throw out all the old, beautiful hymns for modern music that is fluff and bubbles but little substance, and no staying power is not a good change.

Usually, it starts with contemporary music, and then the church doctrines begin to change.

 
In fundamentalism, change right now involves taking off the tie for the Sunday Evening service. So... do it and don't feel guilty!!! ;)
 
subllibrm said:
ItinerantPreacher said:
He did use among others Rick Warren and Saddleback as a model. Isn't Warren having interfaith dialogue with Muslims highlighting what he calls the common ground between Isalm and Christianity, arent some accusing him of promoting Chrislam?

Thats doctrinal change.

And if some accused you of ... take your pick of falsehoods?

Your post is nothing but;

DOEG!!!!
So, you used the word falsehoods. Are you saying it is a falsehood that Warren is having interfaith dialogue with Islamics?
 
[quote author=ItinerantPreacher]Are you saying...that Warren is having interfaith dialogue with Islamics?[/quote]

See also: the apostle Paul.
 
rsc2a said:
[quote author=ItinerantPreacher]Are you saying...that Warren is having interfaith dialogue with Islamics?

See also: the apostle Paul.
[/quote]

Paul said many things. Honesty demands you narrow it down a little.
 
ItinerantPreacher said:
subllibrm said:
ItinerantPreacher said:
He did use among others Rick Warren and Saddleback as a model. Isn't Warren having interfaith dialogue with Muslims highlighting what he calls the common ground between Isalm and Christianity, arent some accusing him of promoting Chrislam?

Thats doctrinal change.

And if some accused you of ... take your pick of falsehoods?

Your post is nothing but;

DOEG!!!!
So, you used the word falsehoods. Are you saying it is a falsehood that Warren is having interfaith dialogue with Islamics?

I have no idea and don't really care. I was referencing your "aren't some accusing him ...?". Who are "some"? Are you one of them? If so make the accusation and back it up.

Otherwise you are just poisoning the well by making an allegation of accusations.
 
subllibrm said:
ItinerantPreacher said:
subllibrm said:
ItinerantPreacher said:
He did use among others Rick Warren and Saddleback as a model. Isn't Warren having interfaith dialogue with Muslims highlighting what he calls the common ground between Isalm and Christianity, arent some accusing him of promoting Chrislam?

Thats doctrinal change.

And if some accused you of ... take your pick of falsehoods?

Your post is nothing but;

DOEG!!!!
So, you used the word falsehoods. Are you saying it is a falsehood that Warren is having interfaith dialogue with Islamics?

I have no idea and don't really care. I was referencing your "aren't some accusing him ...?". Who are "some"? Are you one of them? If so make the accusation and back it up.

Otherwise you are just poisoning the well by making an allegation of accusations.
I stated it the way I did not because I was unsure, but because I presumed it was reasonably common knowledge. My thought was "if it is common knowledge, and you agree with the article, you must agree with Warren". You may think the thoughts are unconnected, but I see them as tied together. If you are using Warren as an example of positive change in a church, you should be aware of what that means when you say it.

Unpoisoning the well

http://www.ocregister.com/articles/muslims-341669-warren-saddleback.html

http://www.christianpost.com/news/exclusive-rick-warren-flat-out-wrong-that-muslims-christians-view-god-the-same-70767/

http://www.wnd.com/2012/02/rick-warrens-bridge-to-islam/

http://standupforthetruth.com/2012/03/finally-a-look-at-the-kings-way-document-that-sparked-the-chrislam-questions/
 
aleshanee said:
so how about when that "change" involves embracing and implementing a new practice that the Bible calls an abomination?...... and just for the sake of argument lets say the state even passes a law mandating churches either go along with this "new" practice.. and "new way" ..or cease performing certain rites and observances that have been a christian church tradition since the very beginning............ do you give in and "grow with it"?.....  or do you move your membership to another church that continues to stand against those things you believe the Bible calls abomination?..... even though the advocates for such abominations use all the same talking points in your op to try and prove their formerly reprehensible practices are ok now...........

are you going to exclaim "spot on!" as you sit in your sanctuary and watch 2 men standing at the altar turn to face each other and begin french kissing as your pastor pronounces them husband and husband?........  ???


You stay with it no matter what unles you're an Xer. Then you leave and be ridiculed by the by wonder
 
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