Souls Saved - Questions & Observations

[Tim]

Hi. First, let me stress that I believe GOD alone saves souls. All we do as men and women is share the gospel and let God take control.

That said.

I have noticed a lack of "adult" souls being saved at our Church and in the Churches around my area here in Maryland. Children make confessions and get baptized. But, for lack of better words, seems like "new blood" isn't added into the Church.

I noticed though a lack of interest and perhaps pressure to share the gospel. I believe that sharing the Gospel is part of the power of the gospel (or say processes). How can they know without a preacher? Back in my old IFB days there was great pressure to share the gospel - unfortunately it was accompanied by many false conversions and number counting. But, are Churches today ditching too much in an effort to remain "Biblically sound"?

I hear it at my local Church. Show Christ in our actions, let God be God ... etc ... seems like poor reformed theology frankly. So much trust in just letting God take control and no human effort to work as commanded in scripture.

Guess what I am asking and saying is this.

Are Churches moving too far away from the old ways of the faith?

Sure, the legalism and such is nice to see gone. The judging and such. I have come to really enjoy the environment at our SB Church.

BUT.

Only Children of those who have been attending for awhile are getting saved.

That seems off.

And I know it isn't just our Church.

 

[Twisted]

And without seeming harsh or critical, many of those children truly aren't saved.  (Yes, children CAN get saved at a young age but we all know of those who thought they were and realized they weren't when they got older)

The rest of your assessment is good.

 

[Tim]

And without seeming harsh or critical, many of those children truly aren't saved.  (Yes, children CAN get saved at a young age but we all know of those who thought they were and realized they weren't when they got older)

The rest of your assessment is good.

I don't think you are being harsh in your comment.

Many Church kids eventually leave when they graduate high school, or sooner, and never come back unless Easter or Christmas to make mom happy.

But, then again, there are some who grow up and stay and get married and as they have children the Church sees the only growth it has experienced in years!

 

[Walt]

And without seeming harsh or critical, many of those children truly aren't saved.  (Yes, children CAN get saved at a young age but we all know of those who thought they were and realized they weren't when they got older)

The rest of your assessment is good.

I don't think you are being harsh in your comment.

Many Church kids eventually leave when they graduate high school, or sooner, and never come back unless Easter or Christmas to make mom happy.

But, then again, there are some who grow up and stay and get married and as they have children the Church sees the only growth it has experienced in years!

Hard to disagree when you post many of the things I've observed for quite some time.

For far too long, something changed in the 1960s (?) - maybe 1950s - American churches, especially IFB church seem to have bought in to the American business "success-oriented" mentality.  Churches that had increasing membership were considered the "best" churches and were held up as "great" works.  As a result, churches began to "cheat" regarding membership rolls... in the first place, the idea of having some kind of classes before one was baptized was dropped, and anyone who was baptized was added to the membership.  At the same time, the practice of dropping people from the membership was stopped.  Now churches could boast of a "membership" of over 1,000 (even though only about 100-200 ever attended).

Somewhere around this time, the push to go out door-to-door soul-winning started. It may have even made sense for the time, when there were door-to-door salesman, and people were more disposed to talk with strangers.  But the push to go became a strong cry for every member. IFB churches developed their own "holy trinity" of attend church, pay tithes, and go soul-winning"; one was a good church member; yea, even spiritual if one did these three.  This was even true if the person was a fornicator; as long as he continued to do these three, he was honored as long as he wasn't caught.

In the push to get good numbers saved and baptized, the third part of the so-called Great Commission was ignored - teaching members about having fellowship with God.  This third part was merely changed to "attend church, tithe, and go soul-winning" -- with occasional lists of standards thrown in -- most famously, short hair on men and dresses on women.

Church members were not spiritual - they were just busy, but only knew the basics of their faith. Many of them were probably not saved at all, but they stuck around and were eventually put into leadership positions.  They had no spiritual discernment.

In the area of being a witness, the weekly soul-winning became another once-a-week duty and then forgotten; the more Biblical model seems to be that as Christians lived their lives, they could not help but speak of God and His goodness and what He was doing. The unsaved saw a difference, and those whom the Holy Spirit convicted often asked for more information.  This is a far cry from the "selling heaven" techniques that so many IFB churches use and/or still use.

 

[Twisted]

And without seeming harsh or critical, many of those children truly aren't saved.  (Yes, children CAN get saved at a young age but we all know of those who thought they were and realized they weren't when they got older)

The rest of your assessment is good.

I don't think you are being harsh in your comment.

Many Church kids eventually leave when they graduate high school, or sooner, and never come back unless Easter or Christmas to make mom happy.

But, then again, there are some who grow up and stay and get married and as they have children the Church sees the only growth it has experienced in years!

Hard to disagree when you post many of the things I've observed for quite some time.

For far too long, something changed in the 1960s (?) - maybe 1950s - American churches, especially IFB church seem to have bought in to the American business "success-oriented" mentality.  Churches that had increasing membership were considered the "best" churches and were held up as "great" works.  As a result, churches began to "cheat" regarding membership rolls... in the first place, the idea of having some kind of classes before one was baptized was dropped, and anyone who was baptized was added to the membership.  At the same time, the practice of dropping people from the membership was stopped.  Now churches could boast of a "membership" of over 1,000 (even though only about 100-200 ever attended).

Somewhere around this time, the push to go out door-to-door soul-winning started. It may have even made sense for the time, when there were door-to-door salesman, and people were more disposed to talk with strangers.  But the push to go became a strong cry for every member. IFB churches developed their own "holy trinity" of attend church, pay tithes, and go soul-winning"; one was a good church member; yea, even spiritual if one did these three.  This was even true if the person was a fornicator; as long as he continued to do these three, he was honored as long as he wasn't caught.

In the push to get good numbers saved and baptized, the third part of the so-called Great Commission was ignored - teaching members about having fellowship with God.  This third part was merely changed to "attend church, tithe, and go soul-winning" -- with occasional lists of standards thrown in -- most famously, short hair on men and dresses on women.

Church members were not spiritual - they were just busy, but only knew the basics of their faith. Many of them were probably not saved at all, but they stuck around and were eventually put into leadership positions.  They had no spiritual discernment.

In the area of being a witness, the weekly soul-winning became another once-a-week duty and then forgotten; the more Biblical model seems to be that as Christians lived their lives, they could not help but speak of God and His goodness and what He was doing. The unsaved saw a difference, and those whom the Holy Spirit convicted often asked for more information.  This is a far cry from the "selling heaven" techniques that so many IFB churches use and/or still use.

Greenie applied for but failed, of course.  Admins can't seem to fix it.

Great post, but watch out for black cars pulling up in front of your house at 3am.  This kind of exposure can get you in big trouble!

 

[FSSL]

Here is how I view the two contrasting sides.

The content of preaching and teaching directly impacts the...
... people's motivation to repeat the enthusiasm of the Gospel.
...the unbeliever's ability to hear the enthusiasm of the Gospel.

You cannot replace the enthusiasm of the Gospel with manipulation.
You cannot create enthusiasm for the Gospel with stale, long, droning messages.