Southern Baptist Are Becoming IFB

[Binaca Chugger]

"Let your light so shine before men that they praise your good works and glorify your Father in heaven."

It's amazing the impact you can have on others simply by loving your neighbors and living your faith.

Agreed.  Now combine that with Mat 28:19-20  Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen. and it will be even more amazing the impact you can have for the Kingdom of God.

Yup. Nothing there about knocking on doors. Plenty of natural teaching opportunities simply by living my faith openly and loving others. Even had a baptism in there. And I don't come across as an obnoxious vacuum salesman.

All depends on how you present yourself, your church, your God and the Gospel.

Que Sera Sera is a horrible method of fulfilling the Great Commission.  I cannot fathom only speaking to people about Christ if they ask me why I am so caring, compassionate, helpful and kind.

 

[rsc2a]

Oddly enough, it was that caring, compassionate helpful kindness that caused the church to expand so quickly its first couple centuries. Running INTO plague-stricken cities to help victims tends to get you noticed.

And buying groceries for your neighbor gives you a reason to share your faith that doesn't come across like a sales pitch.

 

[Binaca Chugger]

I have to say I am a bit surprised by some of the lack of knowledge by those criticizing the SBC.

The convention is VERY different today than the 50's and 60's...in a good way. The conservatives started a takeover of the Convention in 1979  with the election of Adrian Rogers and Conservatives have held the position since then. Roger's election began a cleansing of liberals (the real kind...theological liberals) from the Convention leadership positions in Nashville and wholesale firings of liberal professors in the SBC colleges and seminaries. Later 1900 churches would leave the newly conservative convention and start the Cooperative Baptist Fellowship. Not long after Jerry Falwell and many independent Baptist churches joined the SBC.

I believe David Cloud knowingly misleads people with his yellow journalism. I have been at some of the same events that he has reported on and I know he has lied about them. His use of "quotes" to "prove" his agenda on CCM are seldom from the last quarter century and taken clearly out of context. There are several more but that's enough.

Hey, the OP pointed out that the SBC is becoming IFB!

 

[Binaca Chugger]

Hey, the OP pointed out that the SBC is becoming IFB!

If Jack Hyles were still alive, he's count the convention in his attendance.

Now that's the stuff I thought this thread would generate! 

 

[Just John]

I have to say I am a bit surprised by some of the lack of knowledge by those criticizing the SBC.

The convention is VERY different today than the 50's and 60's...in a good way. The conservatives started a takeover of the Convention in 1979  with the election of Adrian Rogers and Conservatives have held the position since then. Roger's election began a cleansing of liberals (the real kind...theological liberals) from the Convention leadership positions in Nashville and wholesale firings of liberal professors in the SBC colleges and seminaries. Later 1900 churches would leave the newly conservative convention and start the Cooperative Baptist Fellowship. Not long after Jerry Falwell and many independent Baptist churches joined the SBC.

I believe David Cloud knowingly misleads people with his yellow journalism. I have been at some of the same events that he has reported on and I know he has lied about them. His use of "quotes" to "prove" his agenda on CCM are seldom from the last quarter century and taken clearly out of context. There are several more but that's enough.

Hey, the OP pointed out that the SBC is becoming IFB!

LOL.  Directed at several posts. Not the OP.

But I hope they don't get too close to to some of those IFB's. 

(I rather liked Rice except for some of his  over-the-top  crazy pamphlets including on dancing and the movies from the 50's,  the blatant redaction of Spurgeon's printed sermons to omit his reformed views and his terrible blindness about Hyles. He didn't seem to be hateful but really did want to share God with people first and foremost).

 

[Just John]

I also don't get what was said about Southern Baptists hating Jews. i would say it's pretty much the exact opposite.  The SBC takes a pretty evangelical line on eschatology which tends to look at Israel with favor.  The SBC of today is not the same racist SBC of the south 70 uears ago.

Detailed info and timeline on the Conservative Resurgence at wikipedia - "Southern Baptist Convention conservative resurgence"

 

[Fresh Air]

"Let your light so shine before men that they praise your good works and glorify your Father in heaven."

It's amazing the impact you can have on others simply by loving your neighbors and living your faith.

Right. That's what Jesus did with the woman at the well. He just sat there and His countenance was so radiant she demanded to know why...

<insert eye roll emoticon here>

That's also why Matthew and Mark both end with the Great Omission that notoriously starts "Sit ye and wait for others to come and ask you." And why Paul said, "We don't persuade men; we let them watch our lives." And why Ezekiel never spoke about warning the wicked who are going in their wicked way. And why Acts tell us when persecution scattered the early Church they went everywhere painting people's houses and raking leaves. And why Romans tells us, "How shall they hear without a neighbor who cuts a little bit extra of the grass past his side of the lawn." And why...

Oh nevermind...

 

[rsc2a]

You mean the Jesus and Paul who engaged people in public settings in ways that were natural given the context? Or the Jesus who deliberately drove people away? Or the Paul who told people to live quietly and let their lives be their witness? How about you provide a single example of where door knocking was used to reach people in Scripture?

It's kind of sad that you think the story of the Samaritan woman is a largely lesson on evangelism.

 

[praise_yeshua]

"Let your light so shine before men that they praise your good works and glorify your Father in heaven."

It's amazing the impact you can have on others simply by loving your neighbors and living your faith.

You have no idea how to apply what you've quoted. It wasn't written to you. It was a condemnation of Israel. Israel was to be a shining light to this world and all know how that turned out.

The Gospel isn't about you.

Jesus followers shouldn't follow the teachings of Jesus, particularly in the sermon in which He instructed His followers in how they should act? What kind of hyper-dispensational Ruckman koolaid are you drinking?

And the Gospel is about me. It's about you. It's about all of creation...and, most importantly, it's about Jesus.

Get a grip man.... Jesus wasn't talking to you. He was talking to a bunch of Jews that had rejected Him for centuries. It has nothing to do with some NUT believing hyper-dispenstionlism.

The Gospel is ALL about Christ. Let you light shine before men isn't talking about how Jesus died for everyone. The message of the Gospel is now complete. Its not being taught on the hillside somewhere in Israel. The Gospel is useless without the message of the cross. Jesus wasn't preaching the cross in the verses you mentioned. He left that for His disciples.

I know you don't understand this because you continually think the entirety of the revelation of God to man is about you. Its not. There is very little there about you or anyone today. That's why no one is getting the "bountiful" blessing of the tithe. That's why we lay up treasure...... in HEAVEN.... instead of treasures in the local church bank account. Sorry buddy. If you can't see the big picture..... .then don't play try playing on every little hill you come across.

 

[praise_yeshua]

You mean the Jesus and Paul who engaged people in public settings in ways that were natural given the context? Or the Jesus who deliberately drove people away? Or the Paul who told people to live quietly and let their lives be their witness? How about you provide a single example of where door knocking was used to reach people in Scripture?

1Co 1:21  For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.

Its kind of sad that you think your life will actual tell others about Jesus. Our message is one of self guilt and powerlessness. We are guilty. We have never been lights to anything. The message of the Gospel is the "Light". We point to the "Light".

It's kind of sad that you think the story of the Samaritan woman is a largely lesson on evangelism.

You know Tom didn't even imply this. Jesus did talk of "living water" at the "well" to a dirty worthless Jew wannabee. To a sinful women with no promises to claim. It does sound a little familiar.

 

[rsc2a]

[quote author=praise_yeshua]Its kind of sad that you think your life will actual tell others about Jesus. Our message is one of self guilt and powerlessness. We are guilty. We have never been lights to anything.[/quote]

I read this and it makes me sad for you. God is love, joy and peace. You should embrace and celebrate that.

 

[praise_yeshua]

[quote author=praise_yeshua]Its kind of sad that you think your life will actual tell others about Jesus. Our message is one of self guilt and powerlessness. We are guilty. We have never been lights to anything.

I read this and it makes me sad for you. God is love, joy and peace. You should embrace and celebrate that.
[/quote]

Sure He is.... what does that have anything to do with what I said?

We are not the "Light of the world". John already covered that. The sooner people start becoming guilty before God..... the better. We don't come to God any other way. Godly sorrow worketh repentance.

 

[rsc2a]

I am a child of the King, a partaker of the divine nature, wear robes of white, and am indwelled by the living God.  Why should I feel guilt instead of joy, Law instead of grace, condemnation instead of freedom?

 

[Smellin Coffee]

Why should I feel guilt instead of joy, Law instead of grace, condemnation instead of freedom?

You must not be a Chicago Cubs fan, then.

;D

 

[praise_yeshua]

I am a child of the King, a partaker of the divine nature, wear robes of white, and am indwelled by the living God.  Why should I feel guilt instead of joy, Law instead of grace, condemnation instead of freedom?

So Romans 3:19 doesn't apply to you?

Rom 3:19  Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.

Rejoicing in freedom doesn't remove reality of guilt.

Why pretend you're not guilty? Do you really believe this endears people to seek God?

 

[rsc2a]

I am a child of the King, a partaker of the divine nature, wear robes of white, and am indwelled by the living God.  Why should I feel guilt instead of joy, Law instead of grace, condemnation instead of freedom?

So Romans 3:19 doesn't apply to you?

Rom 3:19  Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.

Rejoicing in freedom doesn't remove reality of guilt.

Why pretend you're not guilty? Do you really believe this endears people to seek God?

No...it doesn't. And because I'm not. And, yes, it does.1

But now the righteousness of God has been manifested apart from the law, although the Law and the Prophets bear witness to it— the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all who believe. For there is no distinction: for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, and are justified by his grace as a gift, through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus - Romans 3:21-24

1 Romans 2:4

 

[praise_yeshua]

I am a child of the King, a partaker of the divine nature, wear robes of white, and am indwelled by the living God.  Why should I feel guilt instead of joy, Law instead of grace, condemnation instead of freedom?

So Romans 3:19 doesn't apply to you?

Rom 3:19  Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.

Rejoicing in freedom doesn't remove reality of guilt.

Why pretend you're not guilty? Do you really believe this endears people to seek God?

No...it doesn't. And because I'm not. And, yes, it does.1

But now the righteousness of God has been manifested apart from the law, although the Law and the Prophets bear witness to it— the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all who believe. For there is no distinction: for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, and are justified by his grace as a gift, through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus - Romans 3:21-24

1 Romans 2:4

I'll take that as a yes. You're guilty. I'm guilty. We are all guilty. Its God compassion and grace that offered us an escape. We don't pretend we're not still guilt. Freedom isn't the absence of guilt. In fact, the argument could be made the knowledge of self guilt is somewhat liberating. Again. Godly sorrow worketh repentance.

 

[rsc2a]

You'll take what as a yes? The fact that I said no?

Maybe this is why you are so angry and condescending? Instead of seeing others as people who are loved by God, people who Christ came to save, people who bear the very image of their Maker...you see them instead as a cancer on creation? Never seeing them as captives, never seeing them as broken, never seeing them as neighbor.

 

[Binaca Chugger]

"Let your light so shine before men that they praise your good works and glorify your Father in heaven."

It's amazing the impact you can have on others simply by loving your neighbors and living your faith.

Right. That's what Jesus did with the woman at the well. He just sat there and His countenance was so radiant she demanded to know why...

<insert eye roll emoticon here>

That's also why Matthew and Mark both end with the Great Omission that notoriously starts "Sit ye and wait for others to come and ask you." And why Paul said, "We don't persuade men; we let them watch our lives." And why Ezekiel never spoke about warning the wicked who are going in their wicked way. And why Acts tell us when persecution scattered the early Church they went everywhere painting people's houses and raking leaves. And why Romans tells us, "How shall they hear without a neighbor who cuts a little bit extra of the grass past his side of the lawn." And why...

Oh nevermind...

Bump

 

[rsc2a]

Bump because?