The Fad of the Bible College Movement

[praise_yeshua]

The complete lack of charity and grace displayed on this thread is astounding. Apparently it never occurred to anybody that maybe, just maybe, someone who once start a Bible college might have had a smidgen of motivation to advance the cause of Christ and help people become trained to do that.

Nope. Of course that is impossible. Every single one was motivated by nefarious intentions. I shoulda' known...

I don't think anyone said it was impossible for someone to have a sincere desire to start a work for "God".

David desired to build a house for God.... and we know how that worked out....

Act 7:48  Howbeit the most High dwelleth not in temples made with hands; as saith the prophet,
Act 7:49  Heaven is my throne, and earth is my footstool: what house will ye build me? saith the Lord: or what is the place of my rest?
Act 7:50  Hath not my hand made all these things?
Act 7:51  Ye stiffnecked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, ye do always resist the Holy Ghost: as your fathers did, so do ye

Just saying.... Its not always about having good motives.

 

[Tarheel Baptist]

Every pastor I have been on staff under wanted to start a Bible College (even when many existed).

Only churches with resources actually could muster up an Institute or College. It was a fad.

I am not against higher learnIng. But why can't a church just do this Sunday Morning without spending 100s of thousands of dollars?

Hire professors and start adult classes. Don't pretend to give certificates that never help a person secure employment.

I believe in part the start a Bible College movement was a fad within the IFB movement. When I attend college way back in the 70's the choices (as to Bible Colleges) were few. Tennessee Temple and BBC were the most established. I chose Piedmont Bible College because my plans and my calling were to enter 'full time' ministry. I felt like they could prepare me to fulfill my calling. At that point in time, accreditation did not even show up on my radar. I transferred to Liberty and attended Seminary, although I left 20 hours short of my Masters.

Having said all of that, I think some of the Bible Colleges would say that they exist to train people for ministry....period. And that is the justification for their existence and for their disdaining accreditation. I'm not defending their position, I don't agree with it, but I do understand where they are coming from.

 

[Ransom]

I believe in part the start a Bible College movement was a fad within the IFB movement.

Goes back farther than that. Bible colleges such as Biola, Moody, and Dallas were key vectors for disseminating fundamentalist doctrine - particularly Dispensationalism - in the early 20th century.

It would not surprise me to find out that a good number of these church-basement-college-president mannagawds picture themselves as the next D. L. Moody or R. A. Torrey.

 

[Tarheel Baptist]

I believe in part the start a Bible College movement was a fad within the IFB movement.

Goes back farther than that. Bible colleges such as Biola, Moody, and Dallas were key vectors for disseminating fundamentalist doctrine - particularly Dispensationalism - in the early 20th century.

It would not surprise me to find out that a good number of these church-basement-college-president mannagawds picture themselves as the next D. L. Moody or R. A. Torrey.

I can't speak to the motivation behind their inception, but I don't believe Dallas, Biola and Moody can be put into the same category with Commonwealth, Hyles, or the Y'all Come Bible College.

 

[Binaca Chugger]

I will throw a hat in on this one.

The Bible college ministry started many centuries ago as a way to prepare ministers for ministering the Word of God to the common people.  I really don't believe the motive among any group has ever changed from the original intent.  As different doctrines, philosophies and methods have permeated old schools of the Bible, new schools have been formed.  The modern Fundamentalists came out of many denominations in the 1920's to stand against modernism.  It was during this time, I believe after the Niagara Bible Conference, that the determination to start new Bible colleges was decided upon by the leaders of the Fundamentalist movement.  When Lee Roberson was voted out of the SBC, he began his own Bible college to train people for ministry.  He wanted an academic institution to prepare ministers for ministering the Word of God to the common people.

I believe an evolutionary step took place when Jack Hyles springboarded into the national spotlight with the "World's Largest Sunday School."  People wanted to learn HOW the work was done, and thus was the purpose of HAC - training people HOW to get the Gospel to people and people to the Gospel.  Following this step, others have had differing ideas about the HOW of ministry, and, so, many different Bible schools have sprung up.

The notion that the IFB college is started for financial gain is laughable.  If you have even tried to run a local Christian school, you might begin to understand.  Do most of these IFB pastors with a Bible college have a pride problem?  Yes.  But, then again, so do each of us.  After all, we are on here voicing our opinion as if it matters.    I have recognized the apparent need among IFB pastors to start a Bible college, which doesn't need to exist.

Recently, I had an IFB pastor ask me to help him start a Bible Institute at his church.  I declined the job offer.  He is one of the best friends I have and a good man who has a real heart to help people see God's grace.  However, I think training people to disciple people and understand the Bible ought to be the purpose of every church for every member.  If we need to change what church looks like on some service times, so be it.  I personally don't see the need to have people who have a greater desire to learn and lead pay extra money to have the church perform the duty of a church.  If one desires to spend some years of his life to study the Scripture, let him go to such a place that is set aside for that purpose while fulfilling his responsibility to disciple others in a local church.

In short, the Bible college is not a fad.  To make such a claim shows a great deal of misunderstanding about church history.  Maybe I have helped you see why so many of the small Bible colleges have jumped up.

 

[praise_yeshua]

The notion that the IFB college is started for financial gain is laughable.  If you have even tried to run a local Christian school, you might begin to understand.  Do most of these IFB pastors with a Bible college have a pride problem?  Yes.  But, then again, so do each of us.  After all, we are on here voicing our opinion as if it matters.    I have recognized the apparent need among IFB pastors to start a Bible college, which doesn't need to exist.

Success or lack there of..... has never been absolute indicator of motive. Influence peddling has a value. Its not about the money.... its about the influence. I'm not saying all... just some. So don't hammer me too hard.

In short, the Bible college is not a fad.  To make such a claim shows a great deal of misunderstanding about church history.  Maybe I have helped you see why so many of the small Bible colleges have jumped up.

I don't think you excluded the possibility of it being a fad. I see a lot of wishful thinking...

 

[Ransom]

I can't speak to the motivation behind their inception, but I don't believe Dallas, Biola and Moody can be put into the same category with Commonwealth, Hyles, or the Y'all Come Bible College.

Well, no, of course not. They're low-rent wannabes, which was part of my point (albeit probably poorly expressed).

 

[Tarheel Baptist]

Binaca Chugger:
I believe an evolutionary step took place when Jack Hyles springboarded into the national spotlight with the "World's Largest Sunday School."  People wanted to learn HOW the work was done, and thus was the purpose of HAC - training people HOW to get the Gospel to people and people to the Gospel.  Following this step, others have had differing ideas about the HOW of ministry, and, so, many different Bible schools have sprung up.

I think you are right. When I transferred to Liberty my motivation was, partially, to learn in the incubator that was Thomas Road Baptist Church. I think many started Bible Colleges as vocational training for Pastors and 'Christian workers'. Liberty built on that foundation and is still viable today. Most of the other Bible Colleges have seen a decline in enrollment, financial stability and respectability.
But, I disagree that the Bible College movement in IFB-dom wasn't a fad...a widely shared enthusiasm for something. And MHO is that the fad was partially/greatly driven by peer pressure/influence among the brethren.

And, I would add that I believe one of the reasons the Bible colleges have declined is also based on peer pressure NOT to seek accreditation and academic 'excellence', which is, again IMO, stupidity.

 

[sword]

Binaca Chugger:
I believe an evolutionary step took place when Jack Hyles springboarded into the national spotlight with the "World's Largest Sunday School."  People wanted to learn HOW the work was done, and thus was the purpose of HAC - training people HOW to get the Gospel to people and people to the Gospel.  Following this step, others have had differing ideas about the HOW of ministry, and, so, many different Bible schools have sprung up.

I think you are right. When I transferred to Liberty my motivation was, partially, to learn in the incubator that was Thomas Road Baptist Church. I think many started Bible Colleges as vocational training for Pastors and 'Christian workers'. Liberty built on that foundation and is still viable today. Most of the other Bible Colleges have seen a decline in enrollment, financial stability and respectability.
But, I disagree that the Bible College movement in IFB-dom wasn't a fad...a widely shared enthusiasm for something. And MHO is that the fad was partially/greatly driven by peer pressure/influence among the brethren.

And, I would add that I believe one of the reasons the Bible colleges have declined is also based on peer pressure NOT to seek accreditation and academic 'excellence', which is, again IMO, stupidity.

If you are correct then the Christian school (K-12) movement will suffer the same fate.

Only time will tell.

 

[Tarheel Baptist]

Binaca Chugger:
I believe an evolutionary step took place when Jack Hyles springboarded into the national spotlight with the "World's Largest Sunday School."  People wanted to learn HOW the work was done, and thus was the purpose of HAC - training people HOW to get the Gospel to people and people to the Gospel.  Following this step, others have had differing ideas about the HOW of ministry, and, so, many different Bible schools have sprung up.

I think you are right. When I transferred to Liberty my motivation was, partially, to learn in the incubator that was Thomas Road Baptist Church. I think many started Bible Colleges as vocational training for Pastors and 'Christian workers'. Liberty built on that foundation and is still viable today. Most of the other Bible Colleges have seen a decline in enrollment, financial stability and respectability.
But, I disagree that the Bible College movement in IFB-dom wasn't a fad...a widely shared enthusiasm for something. And MHO is that the fad was partially/greatly driven by peer pressure/influence among the brethren.

And, I would add that I believe one of the reasons the Bible colleges have declined is also based on peer pressure NOT to seek accreditation and academic 'excellence', which is, again IMO, stupidity.

If you are correct then the Christian school (K-12) movement will suffer the same fate.

Only time will tell.

In my experience, the K-12 Christian School movement haven't been as unwilling to seek academic credentials.
But, again, that's just my limited experience in a town with only 2 Christian schools.

Do you disagree with my theory about accreditation and peer pressure?

 

[4everfsu]

Binaca Chugger:
I believe an evolutionary step took place when Jack Hyles springboarded into the national spotlight with the "World's Largest Sunday School."  People wanted to learn HOW the work was done, and thus was the purpose of HAC - training people HOW to get the Gospel to people and people to the Gospel.  Following this step, others have had differing ideas about the HOW of ministry, and, so, many different Bible schools have sprung up.

I think you are right. When I transferred to Liberty my motivation was, partially, to learn in the incubator that was Thomas Road Baptist Church. I think many started Bible Colleges as vocational training for Pastors and 'Christian workers'. Liberty built on that foundation and is still viable today. Most of the other Bible Colleges have seen a decline in enrollment, financial stability and respectability.
But, I disagree that the Bible College movement in IFB-dom wasn't a fad...a widely shared enthusiasm for something. And MHO is that the fad was partially/greatly driven by peer pressure/influence among the brethren.

And, I would add that I believe one of the reasons the Bible colleges have declined is also based on peer pressure NOT to seek accreditation and academic 'excellence', which is, again IMO, stupidity.

If you are correct then the Christian school (K-12) movement will suffer the same fate.

Only time will tell.

One of the difference between Liberty and BBC, TTU and other bible colleges is this. Jerry Falwell's goal from the very beginning was to not remain a bible college but a full fledge University. TTU, BBC and others never really expanded their majors from bible, music and education but rather remain the same ole. LU added to their core curriculum.

 

[rsc2a]

So Bible Colleges became a way for churches to charge for what they should already be doing?

 

[Tarheel Baptist]

Binaca Chugger:
I believe an evolutionary step took place when Jack Hyles springboarded into the national spotlight with the "World's Largest Sunday School."  People wanted to learn HOW the work was done, and thus was the purpose of HAC - training people HOW to get the Gospel to people and people to the Gospel.  Following this step, others have had differing ideas about the HOW of ministry, and, so, many different Bible schools have sprung up.

I think you are right. When I transferred to Liberty my motivation was, partially, to learn in the incubator that was Thomas Road Baptist Church. I think many started Bible Colleges as vocational training for Pastors and 'Christian workers'. Liberty built on that foundation and is still viable today. Most of the other Bible Colleges have seen a decline in enrollment, financial stability and respectability.
But, I disagree that the Bible College movement in IFB-dom wasn't a fad...a widely shared enthusiasm for something. And MHO is that the fad was partially/greatly driven by peer pressure/influence among the brethren.

And, I would add that I believe one of the reasons the Bible colleges have declined is also based on peer pressure NOT to seek accreditation and academic 'excellence', which is, again IMO, stupidity.

If you are correct then the Christian school (K-12) movement will suffer the same fate.

Only time will tell.

One of the difference between Liberty and BBC, TTU and other bible colleges is this. Jerry Falwell's goal from the very beginning was to not remain a bible college but a full fledge University. TTU, BBC and others never really expanded their majors from bible, music and education but rather remain the same ole. LU added to their core curriculum.

I never thought I'd say these words:
4everfsu is exactly right! 

Praying for you, Rick...let me know when the surgery is scheduled.

 

[BALAAM]

I think that another problem with some of the bible colleges is that there was a cradle to grave mentality. The model was that you went to an ifb church, your kids go to ifb schools, then ifb bible colleges, and spend the rest of their lives working in ifb churches. The recession seems to have changed a lot of that. People who had been teaching/coaching for years suddenly found themselves out of a job and for the first time realized that they couldn't go outside of ifb'dom and teach.

It seems that the lack of finances and lack of numbers has changed a lot of perspectives as to Bible College.

 

[AmazedbyGrace]

I think that another problem with some of the bible colleges is that there was a cradle to grave mentality. The model was that you went to an ifb church, your kids go to ifb schools, then ifb bible colleges, and spend the rest of their lives working in ifb churches. The recession seems to have changed a lot of that. People who had been teaching/coaching for years suddenly found themselves out of a job and for the first time realized that they couldn't go outside of ifb'dom and teach.

It seems that the lack of finances and lack of numbers has changed a lot of perspectives as to Bible College.

I have noticed more local kids choosing to attend the community college in town, as it costs less and actually provides fully accredited, transferable credits. The state of CA will not recognize TRACS accredited degrees - not even to be a substitute teacher. They also will not grandfather accreditation.

And WCBC (which claims to be pursuing TRACS accreditation) is not even shown as a candidate for TRACS yet.

http://www.tracs.org/TRACS_Members_all.html

Regional accreditation should be a college student's first choice - always.

 

[AmazedbyGrace]

The complete lack of charity and grace displayed on this thread is astounding. Apparently it never occurred to anybody that maybe, just maybe, someone who once start a Bible college might have had a smidgen of motivation to advance the cause of Christ and help people become trained to do that.

Nope. Of course that is impossible. Every single one was motivated by nefarious intentions. I shoulda' known...

There are a lot of questionable motives for those who pushed all teens to enroll in their unaccredited schools so they could "follow God's will for their lives".  Using such manipulation is nefarious.

 

[FSSL]

Strange thing here... regarding Heartland Baptist College:

This page says "Bachelors of Arts DIPLOMA" http://heartlandbaptist.edu/academics/biblical-studies/

It does not say you get a Bachelors of Arts DEGREE.

In fact... there is no such thing as a Bachelors of Arts diploma. A diploma just means you completed course work. A BA is a degree.

 

[sword]

In the past 5 years many states have passed legislation that requires all State colleges to accept transfer credits from all state community colleges for 100% of classes at a one for one credit.

This means students get credit for every class they take before transferring to the larger school.

Most states who do not have reciprocal legislation have many reciprocal programs between schools.

No double paying for the same class.

 

[sword]

One very credible argument for going to a "Like" christian college is to meet a spouse with "Like faith".

If you are an IFB parent or grand parent you would likely want your child to meet & then marry someone from a very similar background. What alternative is there to meet someone of like faith if you are from an IFB church.

Is this a worthy reason for young people to at least attend a like "Christian" college for a year or two. Should the model change to attending for a year or two to get some advanced bible training, make friends & maybe find a spouse. Then encourage those not planning to go into the ministry to go on to a state school near their home church & get training for a career.

An attempt could also be made to get the first years basic classes to meet college transfers requirements like many high schools have.

 

[Ransom]

In fact... there is no such thing as a Bachelors of Arts diploma. A diploma just means you completed course work. A BA is a degree.

I have a feeling that the Web site is using the word wrong, but strictly speaking, a degree is the award conferred upon the student for completing a course of study, while a diploma is the document recording the successful completion of a course of study.

I have a Bachelor of Arts degree, and I have the diploma to prove it.

Heartland appears to be holding out the promise of a piece of paper representing the degree, rather than the degree itself. It's kind of an awkward phrasing.