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How Bob Gray Sr rates the "goodness" of his boys. It's all so troubling: http://www.bobgraysr.com/2013/08/my-independent-pastor-sons.html
This is so incredibly sad to me...
- Thread starter Patebald
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OZZY said:
Moron. You're about as bright as burned out light bulb and as intelligent as a box of rocks.
The article referenced is sad. Its sad that the only "independence" he celebrates in his sons are what "time" the evening service takes place.... or what "night" soul winning takes place on.
Pitiful.
Should not surprise anyone that this type of article of being proud of sons comes from a pastor of a system that teaches performance based acceptance and pride. They act right and fall in line with the company line so they are good boys, and if they didn't would their father still love them and encourage them, would he find pride in that they are his children?
Jesus warned about boasting concerning performance..."Do not marvel that the demons are subject to you, but that your name's are written in the Book of Life."
Seems Jesus was more concerned with a relationship than mere performance.
Performance based Christianity is not only a poor representation of Christianity, but it is a poor understanding of God and His gift of salvation.
Jesus warned about boasting concerning performance..."Do not marvel that the demons are subject to you, but that your name's are written in the Book of Life."
Seems Jesus was more concerned with a relationship than mere performance.
Performance based Christianity is not only a poor representation of Christianity, but it is a poor understanding of God and His gift of salvation.
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T-Bone said:
No, no, no! Those on the outside are disgruntled malcontents with an axe to grind and should be ignored. Those on the inside are the only ones to be trusted and because they never criticize anything it proves that the "system" works. :-\
Remember Hephzibah House!!! Only the "bad" ones ever complained so there was obviously nothing going on worthy of concern. 8)
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Well apparently you have more inside information than I do on that
Yeah... good point. Seeing how he's NEVER met me nor has he EVER been to the church I attend and serve. But we can go on letting him think he's got me pinned... We don't want to confuse him. You know, kind of like we do with the mentally challenged.
Yeah... good point. Seeing how he's NEVER met me nor has he EVER been to the church I attend and serve. But we can go on letting him think he's got me pinned... We don't want to confuse him. You know, kind of like we do with the mentally challenged.
Patebald said:Well apparently you have more inside information than I do on that
Yeah... good point. Seeing how he's NEVER met me nor has he EVER been to the church I attend and serve. But we can go on letting him think he's got me pinned... We don't want to confuse him. You know, kind of like we do with the mentally challenged.
I have found when people think they know something insidious about someone else it does little good to continue in the dialogue on that particular matter...just better to say thanks and move along. 8)
Patebald said:
Could you perhaps elaborate on what you see as sad or troubling?
I had several thoughts as I read the article:
- (He is proud) - as I was reading how he has to fight to not think his boys are wrong because they do one or two things differently? Wow... Perhaps he just had a hard time letting go as a parent
- Bob Gray II being voted in with 96% (what a laugh! what a distortion!) - He told the church that he was ONLY stepping down if they voting Bob Gray II as the pastor. Naturally he had 96% What's really surprising is that 4% dared go against the word of the great Bob Gray, Sr
- re Scott Gray's history: I see he still cannot bring himself to mention that Scott Gray was working for Jack Schaap. I wonder what he thought about Scott working for Jack Schaap when Bob Gray, Sr was busy attacking Jack Schaap at every turn, not for his perverted teachings, but merely because Schaap wouldn't say things about the KJV that Bob Gray wanted him to say
- I've not heard Scott Gray preach, but I find Bob Gray II to be slimy; not sure why, but I always feel unclean after I listen to him. BGII seems to feel he has to put on an act to keep the attention of the listeners.
- Having an organized soul-winning program is not the problem; the problem is belittling people and humiliating them if they don't attend it
- (re church time) -- huge laugh here... it is Bob Gray, Sr who went around preaching that the services HAD to be at a certain time, and that is was sinful to change them.
- re hiring of school admin - I'm frankly skeptical; why even bother to deny such an allegation? It is so utterly trivial. It's almost like he is protesting too much.
- Our standards are strong but different - shaking head in puzzlement; I thought the teaching was that our standards are supposed to come from the Bible, and they should be the same. Preferences may differ; standards shouldn't -- at least that's what he taught us. Changing again, eh?
Just wondering what the OP thought was sad and/or troubling about the post.
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Could you perhaps elaborate on what you see as sad or troubling?
Sure. Bob Gray's sons do things differently than their dad and some things that they do go against the dogma he spent his entire ministry preaching as doctrine. Bob has noticed this and he has heard talk about it. Because Bob's religiosity is immersed in performance he had to use blog space to share with the "world" that his sons may not do it exactly the way he would do it, but they're still faithful Independent, Fundamental Baptist.
For example, this paragraph: They may not have the same level of separation from the world, but they will separate from the world. They may not have the same requirements for Sunday school teachers and workers, but they will have requirements for their workers.
Bob can't allow his reputation to be tarnished by the fact that his boys are "independent" and in reality that means that they can do things how ever they see fit, even if it is different from him.
But stop and think for a moment about the implications of this one line: They may not have the same level of separation from the world, but they will separate from the world.
He just defined me and my ministry, but he would never admit that because it looks radically different from his. That one line is so incredibly ambiguous and relative and has the potential to bite him in the butt. Bob is nervous... especially about Scotty. Trust me - there was great amounts of tension between them when Jack Schaap was doing his thing with the KJV summits while Scott was working on staff at the college. His dad had to come out and attack the very institution at which his son was working. But it didn't phase Scott one bit - he kept doing his thing and promoting the school.
Trust me: This blog was a power play and his sons just happened to be the pawns that Bob used to make his next move to protect his "King & Queen"
Sure. Bob Gray's sons do things differently than their dad and some things that they do go against the dogma he spent his entire ministry preaching as doctrine. Bob has noticed this and he has heard talk about it. Because Bob's religiosity is immersed in performance he had to use blog space to share with the "world" that his sons may not do it exactly the way he would do it, but they're still faithful Independent, Fundamental Baptist.
For example, this paragraph: They may not have the same level of separation from the world, but they will separate from the world. They may not have the same requirements for Sunday school teachers and workers, but they will have requirements for their workers.
Bob can't allow his reputation to be tarnished by the fact that his boys are "independent" and in reality that means that they can do things how ever they see fit, even if it is different from him.
But stop and think for a moment about the implications of this one line: They may not have the same level of separation from the world, but they will separate from the world.
He just defined me and my ministry, but he would never admit that because it looks radically different from his. That one line is so incredibly ambiguous and relative and has the potential to bite him in the butt. Bob is nervous... especially about Scotty. Trust me - there was great amounts of tension between them when Jack Schaap was doing his thing with the KJV summits while Scott was working on staff at the college. His dad had to come out and attack the very institution at which his son was working. But it didn't phase Scott one bit - he kept doing his thing and promoting the school.
Trust me: This blog was a power play and his sons just happened to be the pawns that Bob used to make his next move to protect his "King & Queen"