Voting Alignment: Christian or Policy

illinoisguy said:
Here is what Trump said about his policy concerning war in a speech in Mosinee, Wisconsin in September, 2024:

"I will expel warmongers. We have these people, they want to go to war all the time. You know why? Missiles are $2 million apiece. That’s why. They love to drop missiles all over the place. I had no wars.... I will expel the warmonger from our national security state and carry out a much needed clean up of the military industrial complex to stop the war profiteering and to always put America first. We put America first. We’re going to end these endless wars. Endless wars, they never stop."

Once elected, Trump changed his mind and started his war with Iran. As conservative Christian Americans, we are expected to go along with this and enthusiastically support the war, because it's all about loyalty to Trump, not about "anything policy related." Anyone who does not express personal loyalty to Trump is accused of TDS, which is regarded as a terrible crime - because it's all about Trump.

www.forbes.com

Will Donald Trump Tame the Military-Industrial Complex?

Donald Trump's campaign rhetoric about reining in the military industrial complex does not show the signs of a genuine commitment to crack down on weapons manufacturers.
www.forbes.com www.forbes.com
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2 million a piece and I get accused of being a conspiracy theorist for saying they want wars to continue forever to make money. As if they forgot that we were in the Middle East for over 20 years pull out and go right back a year and a half later.
 
illinoisguy said:
As I read Romans 13:1-6, it appears to be teaching that we should obey the law, pay our taxes, not resist secular government, and avoid any appearance of attempting to overthrow the government. Sounds like good advice for the January 6 insurrectionists and Christian tax resisters like Kent Hovind.

I don't see anything here that mandates MAGA-type support for all policies of whoever happens to hold the office of President. But if that is what this passage teaches, am I in trouble for not having actively supported the policies of Bill Clinton, Barack Obama and Joe Biden when they were President? Will obedience to this passage require me to support all policies of a future President Newscum or Occasional-Cortex?

Based on Romans 13:1-6, were early Christians required to support the warmongering and endless pre-emptive wars of Emperors Claudius and Nero?
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I like this guy.
 
illinoisguy said:
As I read Romans 13:1-6, it appears to be teaching that we should obey the law, pay our taxes, not resist secular government, and avoid any appearance of attempting to overthrow the government. Sounds like good advice for the January 6 insurrectionists and Christian tax resisters like Kent Hovind.

I don't see anything here that mandates MAGA-type support for all policies of whoever happens to hold the office of President. But if that is what this passage teaches, am I in trouble for not having actively supported the policies of Bill Clinton, Barack Obama and Joe Biden when they were President? Will obedience to this passage require me to support all policies of a future President Newscum or Occasional-Cortex?

Based on Romans 13:1-6, were early Christians required to support the warmongering and endless pre-emptive wars of Emperors Claudius and Nero?
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“At least 200” FBI agents dressed as Trump supporters were in the crowd on January 6, 2021. It was a government operation. Tell the whole story or don’t tell it at all. The lawfare against Donald Trump and his supporters is what goes on in third world countries

https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2023/11/rep-clay-higgins-drops-bomb-newsmax-200-fbi/

https://twitter.com/x/status/1886861726207168886
 
illinoisguy said:
Once elected, Trump changed his mind and started his war with Iran.
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When he was shot at, then began to contemplate eternal things with the blind guides of White, Huckabee and Cruz, and became a Zionist believing he was some kind messianic figure--Hallelujah! (@Tarheel Baptist, see what I did there?) -- in God's Dispy scheme...

...then he changed his mind.
 
Who said this?

"There is becoming a great influence, almost an insidious penetration of our own minds that the only thing this country is engaged in is weaponry and missiles. And, I'll tell you that we can't afford to do that."

- President Dwight D. Eisenhower, January, 1961.

End of story.
 
I vote for the person across party lines. I did it for our sheriff in palm beach county.
 
"
illinoisguy said:
As I read Romans 13:1-6, it appears to be teaching that we should obey the law, pay our taxes, not resist secular government, and avoid any appearance of attempting to overthrow the government. Sounds like good advice for the January 6 insurrectionists and Christian tax resisters like Kent Hovind.

I don't see anything here that mandates MAGA-type support for all policies of whoever happens to hold the office of President. But if that is what this passage teaches, am I in trouble for not having actively supported the policies of Bill Clinton, Barack Obama and Joe Biden when they were President? Will obedience to this passage require me to support all policies of a future President Newscum or Occasional-Cortex?

Based on Romans 13:1-6, were early Christians required to support the warmongering and endless pre-emptive wars of Emperors Claudius and Nero?
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"Sounds like good advice for ...J6 and...Kent Hovind".
It is absolutely hilarious that you default to that; as if either of those subjective cases even remotely support your argument.
My argument was nothing more nor less than the plain language of the text I quoted.
And I must say that your feeble attempt to make this Scripture refer to laws rather than men is embarrassing.
If the "minister of God" is COMMANDING us to disobey God then and only then may we oppose that man.
And that's all I got for you.
All of your hypothetical and hyperbolic questions notwithstanding....
 
JimKnox said:
Governmental "rights" do not override God's clear commands.
"We ought to obey God rather than man".
End of debate.
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The Bible was not written in the context of a constitutional republic. Paul wrote Romans 13 during the rule of Nero, who was effectively an absolute ruler.

The government guarantees its citizens certain rights that limit its own powers. Your own Declaration of Independence says all men are "endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights." On July 4, of all days, you ought to appreciate what that means. Whether or not anyone actually believes that their rights come from God, by so declaring, the founders were saying those rights were not theirs to grant or take away.

The First Amendment protects the people's right to speak their mind, to publish those opinions in print, to gather together to protest peacefully and lawfully, and to request that the government change policies or fix problems. It is not disobeying Rom. 13:1's command to "be subject to the governing authorities," if the governing authorities themselves have obligated themselves to protect your right to dissent.
 
Ransom said:
The Bible was not written in the context of a constitutional republic. Paul wrote Romans 13 during the rule of Nero, who was effectively an absolute ruler.

The government guarantees its citizens certain rights that limit its own powers. Your own Declaration of Independence says all men are "endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights." On July 4, of all days, you ought to appreciate what that means. Whether or not anyone actually believes that their rights come from God, by so declaring, the founders were saying those rights were not theirs to grant or take away.

The First Amendment protects the people's right to speak their mind, to publish those opinions in print, to gather together to protest peacefully and lawfully, and to request that the government change policies or fix problems. It is not disobeying Rom. 13:1's command to "be subject to the governing authorities," if the governing authorities themselves have obligated themselves to protect your right to dissent.
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smallnailgunstudy.webp
 
Ransom said:
The Bible was not written in the context of a constitutional republic. Paul wrote Romans 13 during the rule of Nero, who was effectively an absolute ruler.

The government guarantees its citizens certain rights that limit its own powers. Your own Declaration of Independence says all men are "endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights." On July 4, of all days, you ought to appreciate what that means. Whether or not anyone actually believes that their rights come from God, by so declaring, the founders were saying those rights were not theirs to grant or take away.

The First Amendment protects the people's right to speak their mind, to publish those opinions in print, to gather together to protest peacefully and lawfully, and to request that the government change policies or fix problems. It is not disobeying Rom. 13:1's command to "be subject to the governing authorities," if the governing authorities themselves have obligated themselves to protect your right to dissent.
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You are wrong.
Every word of your post is born of humanism.
Judges 21:25.
Indeed there is nothing new under the sun.
July 4 is my birthday and as a US Marine the significance of the day , (nor its history) , is not lost on me.
Here I stand.
 
JimKnox said:
Governmental "rights" do not override God's clear commands.
"We ought to obey God rather than man".
End of debate.
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The constitution recognizes our rights as coming from God, not the government. The exercise of the right to dissent is also an act of obedience to God when the dissent aligns with biblical principles.
 
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