Wait? Really.......................

[bruinboy]

I have wanted to ask this for some time. We have all been taught that sex before marriage is wrong. Some have even taken to the extreme of not even kissing before marriage (which I believe is extremely unhealthy and weird).  Not saying that some will claim it worked well for them.
But the question is: While I believe one should wait for marriage to have sex, what level of intimacy do you think is acceptable? What if one partner has a physical anomaly that would make sex difficult if not impossible? What if one partner had a physical characteristic that could just not be overlooked/dealt with by the other? 
I suspect I know what the answer(s) are going to be. The one that I do not find acceptable is that "well, if they love one another as they should, than physical characteristics shouldn't matter".  Personally, I don't buy that for a second. That kind of love only presents itself and grows after many years of marriage.
Fire away.       

 

[wtyson]

If you already suspect you know the answer are you really asking or trying to start a debate?

The Bible gives clear principles of dating, courtship & relationships...correct? The best relationships follow the Bible's guidance.

WTyson

 

[Anchor]

I have wanted to ask this for some time. We have all been taught that sex before marriage is wrong. Some have even taken to the extreme of not even kissing before marriage (which I believe is extremely unhealthy and weird).  Not saying that some will claim it worked well for them.
But the question is: While I believe one should wait for marriage to have sex, what level of intimacy do you think is acceptable? What if one partner has a physical anomaly that would make sex difficult if not impossible? What if one partner had a physical characteristic that could just not be overlooked/dealt with by the other? 
I suspect I know what the answer(s) are going to be. The one that I do not find acceptable is that "well, if they love one another as they should, than physical characteristics shouldn't matter".  Personally, I don't buy that for a second. That kind of love only presents itself and grows after many years of marriage.
Fire away.     

I'm not really sure that I know exactly what you're asking.  But I'll bite on the one I do know--"...what level of intimacy do you think is acceptable?"

Answer: any level that still permits/drives you to fulfill the Scriptural mandate to "Flee fornication (I Cor. 6:18)."  Needless to say this will probably look different for every couple as every person has differing triggers. 

 

[Ransom]

But the question is: While I believe one should wait for marriage to have sex, what level of intimacy do you think is acceptable?

What can you get away with, do you mean?

At the very least, I think we can agree that if unmarried people question whether a particular act is appropriate, it in all likelihood isn't.

Some years ago I heard a podcast by John Piper in which he said that he got questions from married couples about the appropriateness of certain sex acts within their marriage. As an aside to the answer, he also remarked that if married people had concerns, it was a no-brainer that unmarried couples shouldn't be doing them.

What if one partner has a physical anomaly that would make sex difficult if not impossible? What if one partner had a physical characteristic that could just not be overlooked/dealt with by the other?

I would think that by the time marriage becomes a serious probability, the couple would have had this discussion. For example, if one partner wants children and the other doesn't or is incapable of performance in that respect, that would be a bit of a deal-breaker, you would think.

 

[bruinboy]

If you already suspect you know the answer are you really asking or trying to start a debate?

I said that I suspect I know the answer I am going to get. Big difference, but thanks. I am not trying to start an argument for sure. I am really interested in what others think. 

The Bible gives clear principles of dating, courtship & relationships...correct? The best relationships follow the Bible's guidance.

I don't think so, that is why I am asking. If it is so clear, why are there so many opinions on what is right or wrong? 

WTyson

 

[bruinboy]

I have wanted to ask this for some time. We have all been taught that sex before marriage is wrong. Some have even taken to the extreme of not even kissing before marriage (which I believe is extremely unhealthy and weird).  Not saying that some will claim it worked well for them.
But the question is: While I believe one should wait for marriage to have sex, what level of intimacy do you think is acceptable? What if one partner has a physical anomaly that would make sex difficult if not impossible? What if one partner had a physical characteristic that could just not be overlooked/dealt with by the other? 
I suspect I know what the answer(s) are going to be. The one that I do not find acceptable is that "well, if they love one another as they should, than physical characteristics shouldn't matter".  Personally, I don't buy that for a second. That kind of love only presents itself and grows after many years of marriage.
Fire away.     

I'm not really sure that I know exactly what you're asking.  But I'll bite on the one I do know--"...what level of intimacy do you think is acceptable?"

Answer: any level that still permits/drives you to fulfill the Scriptural mandate to "Flee fornication (I Cor. 6:18)."  Needless to say this will probably look different for every couple as every person has differing triggers.

I kinda agree, but doesn't that lead to a pretty broad definition of fornication? 

 

[bruinboy]

But the question is: While I believe one should wait for marriage to have sex, what level of intimacy do you think is acceptable?

What can you get away with, do you mean?

Not really, at my age, it doesn't really matter.

At the very least, I think we can agree that if unmarried people question whether a particular act is appropriate, it in all likelihood isn't.

Some years ago I heard a podcast by John Piper in which he said that he got questions from married couples about the appropriateness of certain sex acts within their marriage. As an aside to the answer, he also remarked that if married people had concerns, it was a no-brainer that unmarried couples shouldn't be doing them.

What if one partner has a physical anomaly that would make sex difficult if not impossible? What if one partner had a physical characteristic that could just not be overlooked/dealt with by the other?

I would think that by the time marriage becomes a serious probability, the couple would have had this discussion. For example, if one partner wants children and the other doesn't or is incapable of performance in that respect, that would be a bit of a deal-breaker, you would think.

Absolutely.  However, I am not sure about people who would refrain from kissing before marriage, to discuss this before marriage. 

 

[Ransom]

Absolutely.  However, I am not sure about people who would refrain from kissing before marriage, to discuss this before marriage. 

Then they get what they deserve.

 

[bruinboy]

Here is one of the articles that piqued my interest on the subject:

http://ijr.com/2016/04/584099-woman-confesses-she-waited-until-marriage-to-have-sex-thats-when-everything-became-dark/

I am thinking that I might have to be more specific to get more of your thoughts on the subject.  Where do you draw the line on premarital sex and your biblical/cultural reasoning as to why. Thanks in advance.

1st 2nd 3rd 4th base

[admin note: We have to keep this forum so that it is rated safe for kids, per Google. I change it to the "bases"]

 

[Twisted]

Here is one of the articles that piqued my interest on the subject:

http://ijr.com/2016/04/584099-woman-confesses-she-waited-until-marriage-to-have-sex-thats-when-everything-became-dark/

I am thinking that I might have to be more specific to get more of your thoughts on the subject.  Where do you draw the line on premarital sex and your biblical/cultural reasoning as to why. Thanks in advance.

Holding hands
Kissing.....

Is this the FFF or Cosmopolitan magazine?

 

[bruinboy]

Here is one of the articles that piqued my interest on the subject:

http://ijr.com/2016/04/584099-woman-confesses-she-waited-until-marriage-to-have-sex-thats-when-everything-became-dark/

I am thinking that I might have to be more specific to get more of your thoughts on the subject.  Where do you draw the line on premarital sex and your biblical/cultural reasoning as to why. Thanks in advance.

Holding hands
Kissing....

Is this the FFF or Cosmopolitan magazine?

Great post.

 

[TheRealJonStewart]

Some have even taken to the extreme of not even kissing before marriage (which I believe is extremely unhealthy and weird).  Not saying that some will claim it worked well for them.

looooool how is it extreme to hold that position? that's a popular criteria held by many couples.

 

[Walt]

But the question is: While I believe one should wait for marriage to have sex, what level of intimacy do you think is acceptable?

What can you get away with, do you mean?

At the very least, I think we can agree that if unmarried people question whether a particular act is appropriate, it in all likelihood isn't.

An interesting discussion.  Certainly, in the last few generations, what was considered acceptable by fundamentalists has changed.

I would be interested in what people think the Bible says on the topic; as far as I'm concerned, the Bible is clear that sexual relations are sinful outside of marriage, but there isn't a lot about dating. I'm willing to be convinced otherwise.

Anyway, John Rice taught that is was OK for engaged couples to kiss (I'm not sure when he wrote his book). It seems that the sexual promiscuity of the ~1960s brought on a (over-)reaction in the churches that began to forbid kissing, and then holding hands, and then any physical touching at all -- even to the ludicrous extent that when a girl passed out or broke her leg, young college men were afraid to carry her to the medical office.

I think that the parents of the dating couple should be the ones setting the rules.

We certainly do live in a sex-soaked society, and it's probably better to err on the side of caution.  Some people teach that dating should be postponed until college, and there is, perhaps, much wisdom in that.

By the way, I'm attempting to use "dating" in the broadest sense to include "courtship", though many make a distinction between the two.

What if one partner has a physical anomaly that would make sex difficult if not impossible? What if one partner had a physical characteristic that could just not be overlooked/dealt with by the other?

I would think that by the time marriage becomes a serious probability, the couple would have had this discussion. For example, if one partner wants children and the other doesn't or is incapable of performance in that respect, that would be a bit of a deal-breaker, you would think.

Of course, that leads to the question of WHY a couple is marrying - do they love each other, or are they looking for someone who can do something for them?

In other words, I prefer that the man who marries my daughter is marrying her because he loves her, not for what he can get from her. If it turns out that our daughter cannot have kids, I hope they stay married. Likewise, I want her to marry the man because she loves HIM, not what he can do, or what she can change him into. This kind of thinking, in my opinion, is a major cause of marital trouble.