Water into wine or Welch's?

[ItinerantPreacher]

Let's not forget that in Exodus 22:29 they were to offer to God the first of their ripe fruit and their LIQUORS!

Define the word liquor using an old dictionary and not a preconception.

Even dictionary.com realizes the meaning is not limited to an alcoholic beverage. Same as the NKJV translators and ESV translators.

 

[Recovering IFB]

Let's not forget that in Exodus 22:29 they were to offer to God the first of their ripe fruit and their LIQUORS!

Define the word liquor using an old dictionary and not a preconception.

Even dictionary.com realizes the meaning is not limited to an alcoholic beverage.

IP, answer my question from page 3
IP, let me ask you this, why would Paul in Romans 14, ask us not to make somebody stumble, or in Collosians 2, tell uss not to let people judge us if we were drinking grape juice? It doesn't make sense in a Biblical context if it was grape juice! It had to be talking about alcoholic beverages, there is no other way that it makes sense!

 

[rsc2a]

Let's not forget that in Exodus 22:29 they were to offer to God the first of their ripe fruit and their LIQUORS!

Define the word liquor using an old dictionary and not a preconception.

Even dictionary.com realizes the meaning is not limited to an alcoholic beverage. Same as the NKJV translators and ESV translators.

"I'm a KJVo guy except for all those places where I'm not."

 

[ItinerantPreacher]

Let's not forget that in Exodus 22:29 they were to offer to God the first of their ripe fruit and their LIQUORS!

Define the word liquor using an old dictionary and not a preconception.

Even dictionary.com realizes the meaning is not limited to an alcoholic beverage. Same as the NKJV translators and ESV translators.

"I'm a KJVo guy except for all those places where I'm not."

Not the point at all. Many others here use other versions, simply pointed it out.

 

[rsc2a]

Let's not forget that in Exodus 22:29 they were to offer to God the first of their ripe fruit and their LIQUORS!

Define the word liquor using an old dictionary and not a preconception.

Even dictionary.com realizes the meaning is not limited to an alcoholic beverage. Same as the NKJV translators and ESV translators.

"I'm a KJVo guy except for all those places where I'm not."

Not the point at all. Many others here use other versions, simply pointed it out.

The fact that you are hypocritical of your KJVo stance when it crashes into your personal mores isn't a relevant point?

 

[ItinerantPreacher]

Let's not forget that in Exodus 22:29 they were to offer to God the first of their ripe fruit and their LIQUORS!

Define the word liquor using an old dictionary and not a preconception.

Even dictionary.com realizes the meaning is not limited to an alcoholic beverage. Same as the NKJV translators and ESV translators.

"I'm a KJVo guy except for all those places where I'm not."

Not the point at all. Many others here use other versions, simply pointed it out.

The fact that you are hypocritical of your KJVo stance when it crashes into your personal mores isn't a relevant point?

Nothing like hijacking a thread to distract from the point.

Was I right about the word or not?

 

[Ransom]

Define the word liquor using an old dictionary and not a preconception.

So, in other words, "liquor" meaning . . . <drum roll> . . . JUICE?

 

[ItinerantPreacher]

Define the word liquor using an old dictionary and not a preconception.

So, in other words, "liquor" meaning . . . <drum roll> . . . JUICE?

You mean you looked it up and it only means alcoholic? What was your source? I tried the English dictionary, but if you have something more definitive, please, enlighten us.

I found the word liquor has a close relative, liquid. What did you find, or were you just spouting pre-conceived ideas?

 

[Ransom]

You mean you looked it up and it only means alcoholic?

No, it means I already knew what "liquor" meant, and am not at all surprised to find out that if the biblical authors wanted to make a distinction between alcoholic and non-alcoholic grape products, they had the vocabulary for it. :

 

[ItinerantPreacher]

You mean you looked it up and it only means alcoholic?

No, it means I already knew what "liquor" meant, and am not at all surprised to find out that if the biblical authors wanted to make a distinction between alcoholic and non-alcoholic grape products, they had the vocabulary for it. :

Which they used, dema, juice.

 

[The Rogue Tomato]

Maybe THIS is what was in the Bible?!

Since it was just grape drink, maybe Jesus used these to change the water. 

 

[Recovering IFB]

Let's not forget that in Exodus 22:29 they were to offer to God the first of their ripe fruit and their LIQUORS!

Define the word liquor using an old dictionary and not a preconception.

Even dictionary.com realizes the meaning is not limited to an alcoholic beverage.

IP, answer my question from page 3
IP, let me ask you this, why would Paul in Romans 14, ask us not to make somebody stumble, or in Collosians 2, tell uss not to let people judge us if we were drinking grape juice? It doesn't make sense in a Biblical context if it was grape juice! It had to be talking about alcoholic beverages, there is no other way that it makes sense!

IP, are you going to answer this or what?

 

[Ransom]

You mean you looked it up and it only means alcoholic?

Exactly. So all this cant about "wine" meaning "unfermented juice" is shown to be only so much dishonest blather. Thanks!

 

[AmazedbyGrace]

So wine means juice

And liquors mean juice

What does "strong drink" as used in Deu. 14:26 mean?

 

[AmazedbyGrace]

"I'm a KJVo guy except for all those places where I'm not."

This is an excellent point. If the KJV is the every word perfect Bible, why is it that the meaning of some words are being redefined.

This is suggesting the KJV uses archaic wording and needs a serious update to ensure the abstinence viewpoint can be upheld.

This is not a very consistent way to view Scripture.

 

[rsc2a]

Let's not forget that in Exodus 22:29 they were to offer to God the first of their ripe fruit and their LIQUORS!

Define the word liquor using an old dictionary and not a preconception.

Even dictionary.com realizes the meaning is not limited to an alcoholic beverage. Same as the NKJV translators and ESV translators.

"I'm a KJVo guy except for all those places where I'm not."

Not the point at all. Many others here use other versions, simply pointed it out.

The fact that you are hypocritical of your KJVo stance when it crashes into your personal mores isn't a relevant point?

Nothing like hijacking a thread to distract from the point.

Pointing out that you are a hypocrite who redefines words whenever they don't fit your erroneous preconceived notions about the very topic being discussed isn't a hijack...it is simply pointing out that you really don't care about what Scripture teaches regarding this topic.

You'll simply dodge, ignore, redefine or do whatever is necessary to distort the clear meaning to shove it into your own personal predilection.

In short, if you were going to be intellectually honest with us (and, more importantly, yourself), this is clearly a case where you either need to abandon your idolatrous KJVo-ism or your hard stance on alcohol, a stance Paul refers to as the teachings of demons. Granted since one is idolatry and the second makes you a messenger of Satan, I'd probably abandon both, but that's just me.

[quote author=ItinerantPreacher]Was I right about the word or not?[/quote]

Dictionary does give an alternate definition: "any liquid substance as broth from cooked meats or vegetables". Now if you want to completely ignore every bit of context, then you might be able to use that definition, but I'm certain that context is driving your hermeneutics.

Interestingly enough, every example of the word used in a sentence on dictionary.com refers to alcoholic beverages. And, of course, the term was being used to describe alcoholic beverages 300 years before King Jimmy commissioned the translation that bears his name.

 

[rsc2a]

So wine means juice

And liquors mean juice

What does "strong drink" as used in Deu. 14:26 mean?

Strong juice.

 

[ItinerantPreacher]

Websters 1828
LIQ'UOR, n. lik'or [L. liquor.]
A liquid or fluid substance. [See Liquid.] Liquor is a word of general signification, extending to water, milk, blood, say, juice, &c.; but its most common application is to spirituous fluids, whether distilled or fermented, to decoctions, solutions, tinctures.

 

[ItinerantPreacher]

Websters 1913
Liq´uor   Pronunciation: lĭk´ẽrd
n. 1. Any liquid substance, as water, milk, blood, sap, juice, or the like.
2. Specifically, alcoholic or spirituous fluid, either distilled or fermented, as brandy, wine, whisky, beer, etc.
3. (Pharm.) A solution of a medicinal substance in water; - distinguished from tincture and aqua.
Labarraque's liquor
(Old Chem.) a solution of an alkaline hypochlorite, as sodium hypochlorite, used in bleaching and as a disinfectant.
Liquor of flints
(Old Chem.) soluble glass; - so called because formerly made from powdered flints. See Soluble glass, under Glass.
Liquor of Libavius
(Old Chem.) See Fuming liquor of Libavius, under Fuming.
Liquor sanguinis
(Physiol.) the blood plasma.
Liquor thief
a tube for taking samples of liquor from a cask through the bung hole.
To be in liquor
to be intoxicated.

 

[Recovering IFB]

Well? IP?, are you going to answer my post, Hint: reply 53?