.... allowing the Chicago bus route to borrow his pickup for a promotion.
Pastor Makes Mistake...
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Hey, if one soul was saved...
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Maybe he can pay for the bodywork? They can take it out of his tithe.
Tithing went away when the 2nd Temple was destroyed in 70 AD
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So did your sense of humour, too, apparently.
It's not humor. It's the truth. So what Temple are you building?
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I was making a joke about tithing. Don't pretend you know better that I was serious.
Doesn't Matthew 23:23 & Luke 11:42-52 imply we should still give the 10%. Is it not at least implied?
At least does not 2 Corinthians 9:6-10 imply your financial blessing will be proportionate to your willingness to give. Those who have should give more as God leads. I always assumed the standard changed from the min of 10% to above and beyond as ye have faith. I don't subscribe to the prosperity gospel, but I know the more I give to Gods work the more I seem to have left over. When God impresses me to give, I just write the check and he continue to bring it in. God has blessed me with 3 lifetimes worth of financial blessing. Maybe it is unrelated, maybe it was just luck of the draw.
What % do you think is enough to support Gods work and the full time servants. How much do you think is enought to support missionaries around the world. God has always used his people to pay for the Levites in the old testament and the full time servants in the new testament. What do you believe is the new testiment method to support the church? do you believe "all" ministers should support themselves with a separate job?
Not trying to persuade anyone just want to hear your view. I always say to each their own.
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Jesus was attacking the hypocrisy of the Pharisees, who were not only subject to the Law of Moses, but boasted in obeying in it while disobeying its weightier matters.
As Paul said, addressing religious Jews: "You who boast in the law, do you dishonor God by breaking the law?" (Rom. 2:23).
The tenth was a requirement of the Law. It was essentially a tax as well as the inheritance of the Levites in lieu of territory. Christians are not subject to the Law, and therefore a tenth is not required of us.
Sure. Giving should be proportional to income, and the blessing you receive shall be proportional to your giving. But that very passage says: "Each one must give as he has decided in his heart, not reluctantly or under compulsion, for God loves a cheerful giver" (7). In other words:
- You decide what amount is right for you to give. It's a matter of heart, not law.
- That amount should be such that you are willing to give it, not reluctant.
- Giving is voluntary, not compulsory like the Old Covenant tenth.
If that means you want to give away a tenth of your wealth to the Lord's work, go ahead. No one's stopping you. At least the math's easy. Some people are wealthy enough that they can be more generous with their money, and others might be unable to give a tenth because they won't be able to make ends meet.
It's odd, isn't it, that in the one place in the New Testament that teaches Gentile Christians how to give, Paul says nothing about giving a tenth? If he wanted to, he could have.
Decide for yourself how much is right to give back to God. But don't make your personal decision a law for everyone else, and don't imitate the Pharisees in Matt. 23:23 by being over-scrupulous with your tithing and forgetting the important things.
No.
How do you define God's work? Is it a mega church with 6 figure staff salaries with million dollar homes?
How about a private jet?
My own opinion is that we should take care of the widows and orphans. My other opinion with the advent of technology is that you can spread the Gospel much faster and more efficiently with the internet, radio, television, streaming than with missionaries.
Well, we all know what opinions are like.
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Methinks the newbie coverbd doth not yet comprehend the sarcasm and witful jest historically attributed to this site.
Reminds me of a bus kid's understanding of doctrine...
I bet the poor guy never even got a pickle in his lunch with the ends bit off...
Lev 27:30-32
30 And all the tithe of the land, whether of the seed of the land, or of the fruit of the tree, is the Lord's: it is holy unto the Lord.
31 And if a man will at all redeem ought of his tithes, he shall add thereto the fifth part thereof.
32 And concerning the tithe of the herd, or of the flock, even of whatsoever passeth under the rod, the tenth shall be holy unto the Lord.
What's your point? The second Temple was destroyed in 70 AD and
the tithes were brought to the Temple to support the Levitical priesthood which is no more.
When the third Temple is built I would gladly send my tithe there.
the tithes were brought to the Temple to support the Levitical priesthood which is no more.
When the third Temple is built I would gladly send my tithe there.
Why Tithing Is Not Required Today
There are seven decisive reasons for saying Christians are not required to tithe.1. Believers are no longer under the Mosaic covenant (Rom. 6:14–15; 7:5–6; Gal. 3:15–4:7; 2 Cor. 3:4–18).
The commands stipulated in the Mosaic covenant are no longer in force for believers. Some appeal to the division between the civil, ceremonial, and moral law to support tithing. Yet these divisions, I would observe, are not the basis Paul uses when addressing how the law applies to us today. And even if we use these distinctions, tithing is clearly not part of the moral law. It’s true the moral norms of the Old Testament are still in force today, and we discern them from the law of Christ in the New Testament, but tithing is not among these commands.
2. The examples of Abraham and Jacob are not normative patterns.
Some think tithing is required because both Abraham and Jacob gave a tenth, and they both lived before the Mosaic covenant was in place. Such examples hardly prove tithing is for all time, however. Abraham’s gift to Melchizedek was a one-time event; there is no evidence he regularly gave God a tenth.
Jacob’s giving of a tenth signified his gratefulness to God for promising to be with him and to protect him. His gratefulness and generosity still speak to us today, but a historical description of what Jacob gave doesn’t support the idea that all believers must give God a tenth of their income.
3. Tithes were given to the Levites and priests, but there are no Levites and priests in the new covenant.
Levites and priests were tied to the sacrificial system of the old covenant. Now all believers are priests (1 Pet. 2:9; Rev. 1:6; 5:10; 20:6), with Jesus as our Melchizedekian high priest (Heb. 7).
4. The tithe is tied to the land Israel received under the old covenant.
Israel was supposed to celebrate a tithe every three years in Jerusalem. But that requirement cannot apply to Christians today. It related to the Jews as a nation—to Jews who lived in the land of promise. With the coming of Christ, the Jewish nation is no longer the locus of God’s people, though individual Jews are part of the church through faith in Jesus.
The earthly Jerusalem is no longer central in God’s purposes (Gal. 4:25). Believers are part of the heavenly Jerusalem (Gal. 4:26) and look forward to the city to come (Heb. 11:10), to the new heavens and new earth (Rev. 21:1–22:5). Abraham isn’t heir of the land of Israel, but of the whole world (Rom. 4:13).
5. If tithing is required today, how much should we give?
As noted above, the number was certainly more than 10 percent and closer to 20 percent. Those who advocate tithing should probably settle on 20 percent.
6. When Jesus affirmed the tithe, it was before the dawn of the new covenant.
Some defend tithing by saying Jesus praised tithing, even if he said it was less important than other things (Matt. 23:23; Luke 11:42). This argument appears strong, but it’s not persuasive. Jesus also mentioned offering sacrifices in the temple (Matt. 5:23–24), but Christians don’t think—even if the temple were rebuilt—that we should do that. Our Lord’s words are understandable when we think about his location in redemptive history.
Jesus spoke about sacrifices and tithing before the cross and resurrection, before the dawn of the new covenant. He used tithing and sacrifices as illustrations when addressing his contemporaries. He kept the law since he was “born under the law” (Gal. 4:4). But we can no more take his words as a commendation for tithing today than we can his words about offering sacrifices.
7. Nowhere is tithing mentioned when commands to give generously are found in the New Testament.
When Christians are instructed to give to the poor, they aren’t commanded to give “the poor tithe.” Instead, they are instructed to be generous in helping those in need (Acts 2:43–47; 4:32–37; 11:27–30; Gal. 2:10; 1 Cor. 16:1–4; 2 Cor. 8:1–9:15). For example, 1 Corinthians 16:1–4—a passage often cited in popular circles in support—doesn’t mention tithing; it relates to a one-time gift for poor saints in Jerusalem.