Interesting reformed church visit today, a report card.

[Ransom]

When Jesus paid the price for sin, it satisfied the Father, not for our sins only, but also for the sins of the whole world (2 John 2:2).

So does the Father's wrath still abide on sinners (Rom. 1:18)? If so, why, since Jesus paid the price of sin and satisfied the Father?

 

[biscuit1953]

So does the Father's wrath still abide on sinners (Rom. 1:18)? If so, why, since Jesus paid the price of sin and satisfied the Father?

John 3:36 Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life; whoever does not obey the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God remains on him.
Luke 13:2 And he answered them, “Do you think that these Galileans were worse sinners than all the other Galileans, because they suffered in this way?
Luke 13:3 No, I tell you; but unless you repent, you will all likewise perish.
John 5:39 You search the Scriptures because you think that in them you have eternal life; and it is they that bear witness about me,
John 5:40 yet you refuse to come to me that you may have life.

There is no reason to reject the clear reading of 2 Peter 2:1 and assume it doesn’t mean what it says. Men and women go to hell because they refuse the free gift of salvation that was paid for on the cross.

 

[Ransom]

There is no reason to reject the clear reading of 2 Peter 2:1 and assume it doesn’t mean what it says. Men and women go to hell because they refuse the free gift of salvation that was paid for on the cross.

You only begged the question, you didn't answer it.

 

[biscuit1953]

You only begged the question, you didn't answer it.

You didn't like the answer.

What are the main arguments against limited atonement?​

Repentance and faith were the required responses (see Matthew 21:32). If Christ’s death did not provide atonement for everyone, then the apostles, and even Jesus Himself, were offering something that most of their audiences could never receive.

Limited atonement is the point of traditional Calvinism that has caused the most confusion and consternation among Bible-believing theologians. Will only the elect be saved? Yes. However, Christ’s sacrifice is sufficient to pay for all sin, and the offer of salvation is universal. Our invitation for others to accept Christ should echo the Spirit’s call in Revelation 22:17: “‘Come!’ Let the one who is thirsty come; and let the one who wishes take the free gift of the water of life.”

What are the main arguments against limited atonement? | GotQuestions.org

What are the main arguments against limited atonement? What are the biblical, historical, theological, and practical reasons for rejecting limited atonement?

www.gotquestions.org

We can disagree without being disagreeable.

 

[Ransom]

You didn't like the answer.

I don't like answers that fail to answer my questions, specifically, why the Father would still have wrath for sinners (Rom. 1:18) whose sins the Son has propitiated (1 John 2:2).

 

[Ransom]

Men and women go to hell because they refuse the free gift of salvation that was paid for on the cross.

Is that a sin? If so, why has it not been forgiven?

 

[biscuit1953]

I don't like answers that fail to answer my questions, specifically, why the Father would still have wrath for sinners (Rom. 1:18) whose sins the Son has propitiated (1 John 2:2).

I don’t like answers that takes clear verses and assume they don’t mean what they say in order to fill in an acronym.

 

[Ransom]

I don’t like answers that takes clear verses and assume they don’t mean what they say in order to fill in an acronym.

Since I said nothing about that, what you don't like is answering questions someone else asked.

 

[ALAYMAN]

But is CCCGABCBAG CBAGAFEDC more moral if it's played on a pipe organ or an electric guitar?

My argument isn’t against an instrument, per se, but the arrangement.

 

[Ransom]

My argument isn’t against an instrument, per se, but the arrangement.

Same argument, really. Are some chords more God-honoring than others?

 

[biscuit1953]

Same argument, really. Are some chords more God-honoring than others?

Some Christians can’t tell the difference between growling sounds mixed in with dissonant chords along with mind numbing meaningless repetitions, and Psalms, hymns and spiritual songs. Alayman hit the nail on the head when he referred to it as “an exercise in cognitive dissonance.” Mackenzie Morgan who is a worship leader at a Presbyterian church, goes into the history of church music.

“The modern seeker sensitive or seeker friendly church movement was primarily pioneered in the 1980s by Bill Hybels, founding pastor of Willow Creek Community Church in Illinois. The movement gained massive traction through the mega church phenomenon championed by Hybels alongside Rick Warren, founder of the Saddleback Valley Community Church. Its earliest forerunner in the 1960s was Robert Schuler, founder of the Crystal Cathedral. The core strategy involved structuring worship services and environments to specifically appeal to unchurched non-Christian seekers utilizing a marketing focused approach with a practical non-confrontational preaching and engaging performances. The monkeys would rather die than to give up the circus because the circus is built for the monkeys. The circus is built to entertain and what you lead people with in the end is the same measures and things that you have to do to keep them there. As Charles Spurgeon once said, "If you have to give a carnival to get people to come to church, then you will have to keep giving carnivals to keep them coming back."