Is God angry with sin , and was sin the Sovereign plan of God ?

Ekklesian said:
The questioner is forgetting that God, Whose ways and thoughts are of an infinitely higher order and nature than the ways and thoughts of a corrupt and fallen man, is not a man, and neither is He corrupt.

So the question is really like asking what the color blue tastes like. It's nonsense. The anger and grief of a man comes by disappointment and a thwarting of his will and expectations by individuals and circumstances out of his control.

Projecting these passions upon the uncorruptible God changes His glory into something resembling a man, or birds, or four-footed beasts, or creeping things. It's really an insidious form of idolatry.

So, if we were all idolaters, as is Leatherneck (apparently), then the question might stump us. But, Calvinists understand that God is nothing like a man or a bird or a four-footed beast or a creeping thing, and we see the question telling us more about Leatherneck than about ourselves.

Would you like to confess your idolatry and repent, and become a Calvini...er, uh...I mean, Christian?
Click to expand...
The question was to provoke thought it wasn’t that anyone who knows God to attempt to reduce Him in anyway. God is Holy wether men know and understand that or not. Interesting that you would mention idolatry. Ignoring the truth and context of scripture to follow Calvin is pretty much the definition of idolatry. I follow Jesus and no I will not repent of that.
 
Baptist Renegade said:
The scripture is clear - CHRIST DIED FOR SINNERS - 1 Tim 1:5. We may (and do) proclaim this with boldness and confidence.

Now consider the following:

John 6:37 - All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.

No one comes to Christ unless the FATHER draws him (Jn 6:44) so if they have any interest whatsoever, it is because the Father is drawing them to the Son. If they come to the son, they do not have to wonder whether or not they are "Elect." All they need to do is "Make their calling and election sure (2 Pet 1:10) by "Believing on the Lord Jesus Christ" (Acts 16:31).

It really does not get much simpler! If they are elect, they will come. If they are not elect, they will not come although your "Witness" will testify against them on the day of judgment.

Our job is not to "Get them to come." Our job is to FAITHFULLY PROCLAIM the word of God which is able to make one wise unto salvation (2 Tim 3:15) and from there, God will draw such as are "Ordained to Eternal Life" (Acts 13:48).

Where "Seeker Friendly" types often mess up is in their attempt to make the Gospel Message more palpable and appealing to the natural man. They may downplay matters of sin, repentance, and judgment and focus on John 3:16 and "God loves you and has a wonderful plan for your life!" John 3:16 is perhaps the most beautiful verse in the bible and through this passage, I personally came to faith personally but It had no meaning to me until I realized I was a sinner who deserved HELL!
Click to expand...
While Calvinist ignore and change the context of John 3:16, Hebrews 11:6, Romans 10:13,1John 2:2, Revelation 22:17 and many many more scriptures that expose Calvinism as the lie and deception that it is.
 
voicecrying said:
Election is in the scripture.

Just a sampling:

Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.
1 Peter 1:2

And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.
Matthew 24:22

And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
Matthew 24:31

Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.
Romans 8:33
Click to expand...
Absolutely elected in Him according to His foreknowledge.
 
ALAYMAN said:
So would it be fair to say that you do not object to the manner in which Calvinists generally present the gospel to the lost when witnessing, but rather your objection is against the manner in which they teach salvation to those within their congregations?
Click to expand...
To take any scripture out of context and change the meaning and truth of the gospel is deception and wrong no matter where it is done.
 
voicecrying said:
I believe Calvinism still teaches that Jesus is the sinless son of God who suffered the wrath of God, died on the cross, and rose from the dead, and whoever believes will be saved. Do they not teach that?
Click to expand...
Not all of them many teach you cannot believe unless you were elected by God before He created the heavens and earth, which contradicts scriptures that say “ for whosoever shall call on the Lord will be saved” Romans 10:13, John 3:16 etc.
 
Leatherneck0311 said:
Not all of them many teach you cannot believe unless you were elected by God before He created the heavens and earth, which contradicts scriptures that say “ for whosoever shall call on the Lord will be saved” Romans 10:13, John 3:16 etc.
Click to expand...
They do teach/preach the gospel - and they teach/preach that whosoever shall call on the Lord will be saved. If you would take a step back from the strawman you are arguing against, you would see that. Your real disagreement is you believe everyone who has ever been born has the potential to be a "whosoever" while Calvinism teaches only those who God predestinated will be a "whosoever".
 
ALAYMAN said:
Sure they do. The key to what voice said is found in the Calvinist teaching that all who actually do believe will be saved, but, none will/would ever first believe without being zapped first, lol.
Click to expand...
This is so.
 
Ransom said:
Hm.



Yep, we believe that...



...and that...



...and that...



...and that...



... and that.



We certainly do. Did I miss a memo?
Click to expand...
I just wondered if you'd take the bait, Cal...er...Ransom! LOL
 
voicecrying said:
They do teach/preach the gospel - and they teach/preach that whosoever shall call on the Lord will be saved. If you would take a step back from the strawman you are arguing against, you would see that. Your real disagreement is you believe everyone who has ever been born has the potential to be a "whosoever" while Calvinism teaches only those who God predestinated will be a "whosoever".
Click to expand...
Lol, there are no strawman other than the one Calvinist have created. The verse says elect according to the foreknowledge of God no where does scripture teach a heavenly lottery , and or that God believes or repents for anyone.
 
Leatherneck0311 said:
Lol, there are no strawman other than the one Calvinist have created. The verse says elect according to the foreknowledge of God no where does scripture teach a heavenly lottery , and or that God believes or repents for anyone.
Click to expand...
You were arguing that they don't believe "whosoever".
 
voicecrying said:
You were arguing that they don't believe "whosoever".
Click to expand...
Rephrase I don’t know what you are trying to say. Scripture says whosoever calls on the Lord will be saved Romans 10:13 and John 3:16, and how you got I was arguing that they don’t believe “whosoever” is not what I was arguing and makes no sense.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top