Is Ron DeSantis the Future of the Republican Party?

[AverageJoe]

An electoral college almost forces a two-party system into existence. A candidate has to build a coalition of various voting blocs to win the Presidency...when the law is followed, anyway...and that is nearly impossible to do without organization.

There's nothing disorganized with having more than two parties. It works in many different countries. It gives the people more choices for whom they want as POTUS. The EC isn't an end-all, perfect solution.

 

[FSSL]

To a point, I can agree with your point of view. Still, I could not, in all good conscience vote for someone who is just as lacking in character as Biden is...and that would be Trump.

It’s these absurd overstatements that I cannot reconcile.

Why do you not vote for policy?

 

[AverageJoe]

It’s these absurd overstatements that I cannot reconcile.

Why do you not vote for policy?

Policy isn't the only thing in life. There are matters of conscience as well...Maybe you don't have one...just a guess on my part.

 

[FSSL]

Policy isn't the only thing in life. There are matters of conscience as well...Maybe you don't have one...just a guess on my part.

Well… some conservatives find ways to avoid voting on policy.
—Regan was divorced and his wife was into witchcraft
—Romney was a Mormon
—John McCain picked a woman running mate
—Trump said some things on Twitter
I vote on matters of policy.

 

[AverageJoe]

Well… some conservatives find ways to avoid voting on policy.
—Regan was divorced and his wife was into witchcraft

I voted for Ronald REAGAN. Divorced wasn't something that bothered me. Both of my parents had been divorced. As far Nancy being into witchcraft...that was her...not him!

—Romney was a Mormon

And? Many Mormons have good political sense. I voted for Romney, though I thought he was a little weak in his attempt to win. He had no zeal.

—John McCain picked a woman running mate

I did not vote for McCain. His background (RINO) was always troubling to me. I wrote a person in.

—Trump said some things on Twitter

Though I didn't like his use of Twitter, I did vote for Trump both times. I won't make that mistake again.

I vote on matters of policy.

I vote on matters of policy and conscience...I don't vote one without the other. You may if you wish...that's your right as an American.

 

[FSSL]

(About Romney) He did not fight off the Dems. They had the “Russian” playbook starting up against him. They saved it for the next guy when Romney backed down.

I’m not trying to get personal… just bringing up rational thinking.

Since some conservatives won’t vote for the policies that got rid of Roe v Wade (via constitutional judges), are their consciences not skewed?

 

[AverageJoe]

(About Romney) He did not fight off the Dems. They had the “Russian” playbook starting up against him. They saved it for the next guy when Romney backed down.

I’m not trying to get personal… just bringing up rational thinking.

Since some conservatives won’t vote for the policies that got rid of Roe v Wade (via constitutional judges), are their consciences not skewed?

Not at all....RvW isn't the only thing in this world that needed attention! I certainly wouldn't take anything you say personally. I don't think you'd be that petty.

 

[FSSL]

…RvW isn't the only thing in this world that needed attention!

Wow! What conscience is that?

 

[AverageJoe]

Wow! What conscience is that?

A clear one...one that won't kowtow to a forum administrator saying "it's not personal" and then making an asinine comment like that one!

 

[Dr. Huk-N-Duck]

A clear one...one that won't kowtow to a forum administrator saying "it's not personal" and then making an asinine comment like that one!

Sorry to interrupt, but I think you might have misunderstood what he meant. I think he was referring to conscience in respect to voters who cast a ballot for a candidate who supports abortion, not you personally.

 

[FSSL]

I’ll move on because it’s now getting confused. I am not here to challenge anyone personally. Sometimes questions, dealing with personal beliefs, are hard to answer.

 

[AverageJoe]

Sorry to interrupt, but I think you might have misunderstood what he meant. I think he was referring to conscience in respect to voters who cast a ballot for a candidate who supports abortion, not you personally.

Thank you...I did indeed, and I apologize to FSSL for the misunderstanding. I was trying to get our dogs outside to go to the "potty" and then get their lunch, as well as trying to answer questions from the insurance agency while posting. It's not always wise for me to multitask, especially since Covid last year. I can't always keep things "in line" when I'm trying to do so many things at once these days. Thanks for pointing this out, HUK! I appreciate it.

 

[AverageJoe]

I’ll move on because it’s now getting confused. I am not here to challenge anyone personally. Sometimes questions, dealing with personal beliefs, are hard to answer.

Not for me. I've never had a hard time defending my positions. I can hold my own, and have for over 60 years now.

 

[ALAYMAN]

I threw away my vote in 1992 voting for Ross Perot because of principles and conscience, but since then I've become much much more pragmatic in my view of politics. Yes sometimes it comes down to essentially the lesser of two evils in some respects, but as others have said on this forum I voted for Trump and held my nose both times because of promises he made and kept to the protection of unborn fetuses. And 40 years of broken promises by establishment conservatives gave us paltry gains but Trump delivered. His narcissistic overbearing attitude and mean tweets and his callous attitude towards women and other disgusting boorish behavior bothers me, but not near as much as the murder of unborn children. I'd vote for him again without a hesitation given all of the opposing considerations.

 

[Ransom]

What good is a "principle" when it really is just pietism. We are given two choices. Eg. Trump/Biden. Certainly, Biden has a total lack of character. So, not voting for Trump only gives weight toward Biden.

No, there's always the third option: No Suitable Candidates. I will sit out an election with a clear conscience if no candidate will suitably represent my interests. We had a provincial election this spring. The choice was between Tweedledee and Tweedledum, so I declined to vote.

If I was American, I would have done likewise in 2016. Neither Clinton nor Trump appeared as presidential material. To be fair to Trump, he did accomplish a few good things: for example, his SCOTUS appointments, and his peace efforts in the MIddle East. I might have reconsidered in 2020, but I suspect, based on his sore-loser antics between November and the inauguration, that I'd have had some buyer's regret. I would strategically vote for a candidate I don't like, if he made it possible to implement policies I do like. I have my doubts Trump could have done that, given his inability to take criticism and his antagonism toward anyone who criticized him. We said character counted during the Clinton administration, and it's still true.

 

[Dr. Huk-N-Duck]

No, there's always the third option: No Suitable Candidates. I will sit out an election with a clear conscience if no candidate will suitably represent my interests. We had a provincial election this spring. The choice was between Tweedledee and Tweedledum, so I declined to vote.

If I was American, I would have done likewise in 2016. Neither Clinton nor Trump appeared as presidential material. To be fair to Trump, he did accomplish a few good things: for example, his SCOTUS appointments, and his peace efforts in the MIddle East. I might have reconsidered in 2020, but I suspect, based on his sore-loser antics between November and the inauguration, that I'd have had some buyer's regret. I would strategically vote for a candidate I don't like, if he made it possible to implement policies I do like. I have my doubts Trump could have done that, given his inability to take criticism and his antagonism toward anyone who criticized him. We said character counted during the Clinton administration, and it's still true.

I understand what you’re saying, but in America, we’re taught from a young age to participate in our democratic system, if for no other reason, to show respect to those who paid the ultimate sacrifice for our right to vote. For that reason, I’ll always cast a vote, even if it’s for a 3rd party candidate with no chance of winning.

 

[FSSL]

I do not see much before voting day, November 5, 2019 which would prevent a person from voting against Biden. Which, a vote cast for Trump, actually was. Trump, though divorced, crass and has a history of crudeness (which he apologized for)... having been a Democrat in those years certainly was our only choice.

I'm not in favor of Trump's character and behavior at times... I didn't vote for that. Much of that was concocted by the media. I held my nose and hoped he would win to continue the vast amount of policies (in spite of the tremendous fight against the media, Dems and neverTrumpers).

If it wasn't for Trump choosing a large amount of good justices, Supreme Court and through the Federal System... we would certainly be Venezuela by now.

 

[illinoisguy]

Before I say anything, let me say that I voted for Trump in 2016 and 2020 and I don't regret it (lesser of two evils and all that). I'm a deplorable, I cling to God and guns, and I always was and still am a card-carrying member of the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy. Having said that, I am concerned with what appears to be the current strategy of turning the upcoming November election into a referendum on the deity of Trump. It seems like we are saying, "If you believe Trump is God, if you believe he is above the law and was right to withhold the top secret papers, if you support the January 6 Capitol rioters who were trying to kill the Vice President, then vote Republican. Otherwise, vote for the Demon-crats."

Meanwhile, Biden and the Demon-cratic candidates are moving up in the polls. This strategy of turning the election into an affirmation of the Trump personality cult appears to be counter-productive at this time. It seems to me that at some point we are going to have to be willing to move on, and to consider a presidential candidate like DeSantis who will carry on with Trump's conservative policies, without all the Trump baggage and craziness. Will it take a disastrous Demon-cratic victory in November to help us to decide to concentrate on promoting conservative and pro-life principles, instead of focusing like a laser beam on Trump-worship?

 

[aleshanee]

I threw away my vote in 1992 voting for Ross Perot because of principles and conscience, but since then I've become much much more pragmatic in my view of politics. Yes sometimes it comes down to essentially the lesser of two evils in some respects, but as others have said on this forum I voted for Trump and held my nose both times because of promises he made and kept to the protection of unborn fetuses. And 40 years of broken promises by establishment conservatives gave us paltry gains but Trump delivered. His narcissistic overbearing attitude and mean tweets and his callous attitude towards women and other disgusting boorish behavior bothers me, but not near as much as the murder of unborn children. I'd vote for him again without a hesitation given all of the opposing considerations.

.
what i have heard... from family members who were very familiar with ross perot from as far back as the early 1970s.. .. and who worked for companies perot was associated with... .. perot had a deep seated hatred of the bush family and vowed even before the 1988 election he would do all he could keep george bush the 1st from being elected as president... .

when his efforts in 1988 failed he not only went the "run for office as a 3rd party candidate" route... but he also admitted to people close to him that he was doing it for no other reason but to serve as a spoiler... to split the conservative vote... and hopefully help get clinton elected.... . ...

the interesting thing is.... he did not tell people he said that to, to keep his true reasons for running quiet.. and of course they didn;t... .so months before the election the information was out there that perot knew he had no chance of winning.... just wanted to help clinton beat bush....... ...but the news mdeia largely ignored it.... and other people who knew ross perot and thought they knew him better than they really did... didn;t believe it.. . they did not believe a man with the kind of reputation perot had would do such a thing just to undermine fellow conservatives.... ....

even after he gave an interview years later not only admitting what his reasons for running in 1992 had been.... but saying he had been prepared to do the same thing in 1996 if it looked like clinton might lose.... people still did not believe it....

 

[aleshanee]

Before I say anything, let me say that I voted for Trump in 2016 and 2020 and I don't regret it (lesser of two evils and all that). I'm a deplorable, I cling to God and guns, and I always was and still am a card-carrying member of the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy. Having said that, I am concerned with what appears to be the current strategy of turning the upcoming November election into a referendum on the deity of Trump. It seems like we are saying, "If you believe Trump is God, if you believe he is above the law and was right to withhold the top secret papers, if you support the January 6 Capitol rioters who were trying to kill the Vice President, then vote Republican. Otherwise, vote for the Demon-crats."

Meanwhile, Biden and the Demon-cratic candidates are moving up in the polls. This strategy of turning the election into an affirmation of the Trump personality cult appears to be counter-productive at this time. It seems to me that at some point we are going to have to be willing to move on, and to consider a presidential candidate like DeSantis who will carry on with Trump's conservative policies, without all the Trump baggage and craziness. Will it take a disastrous Demon-cratic victory in November to help us to decide to concentrate on promoting conservative and pro-life principles, instead of focusing like a laser beam on Trump-worship?

.
i agree with most of what you are saying.... ..but i don;t see it as a worship of trump that keeps many supporters speaking in favor of him over de-santis... although de-santis would be an excellent president no doubt... .. we all know de-santis would do the same things trump did domestically... .. but the concern is whether or not he would have the same influence and the same deal making skils with leaders of foreign countries that donald trump has already proven he has...... it does not matter whether they would like him or not.... but whether or not they would respect him.. ..would ron de-santis be able to negotiate something like the abraham accords?... .. we don;t know..... we believe he would do all he could to make things like that happen.... . but we know trump already did make it happen.....

there is nothing wrong with de-santis that a few more years experience in the big arena would not make better..... but i will be voting for whichever republican gets the nomination and runs against the demon-rats in 2024... even if it;s ultra pious - but pathetically pitiful, pence.... ...even if i wasn;t already dedicated to keeping democrats out of office - seeing how they have been able to destroy the country with just one extra vote in their favor... much less a substantial majority... would have been enough to convince me.... .