My Visit to Steven Anderson?s Faithful Word Baptist Church...

[prophet]

I can only take Anderson at his word. He says exactly the same things as Finney. Finney rejected "original sin" and taught that a person lost spiritual life when he commits his first act of sin.

I quoted him. All you have are very poor comebacks "I know him" and "you are a jackass Cavinist."

Perhaps Anderson has a very distorted historical theology. Same with any KJVO, they don't know their historical theology.

FTR, I wasn't calling you a "jackass"'

In case you thought I was.

I was referring to the article's author's use of the term.

Your use of terms, as an inquiry, or even as a subject of debate, are not on a par with the "jackassery" of those whose only retort is to cry: "Pelagians, ahhhhh" whenever they are presented with an opposing viewpoint.

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[prophet]

You are born with a sin nature, but sin is not imputed until the law is broken and you are aware of it.  Do we agree that babies (and the retarded, etc.) sin and yet it is not imputed to them as they don't know the law?

Ugh... Sin has been imputed to us. It is our nature. You cannot have a sin nature without the imputation of sin. That is absurd double-talk.

Yes, babies and special needs people are sinners. We can talk about their accountability and eternal destiny, but FIRST, we need to establish a common foundation that "ALL have sinned..." Either ALL men have Adamic sin or they do not.

"Therefore, just as through one man sin entered into the world, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men, because all sinned? (Rom 5:12)"

The Bible presents the ANTIDOTE to the imputation of Adam's sin as the imputation of the righteousness of Christ. Therefore, your theology is setting up a logical situation where people do not have the imputation of righteousness until they perform their first righteous act.**

Are you aware the Eve sinned several times BEFORE she ate the forbidden fruit?  And yet it was not imputed to her?

Are you aware that Adam's sin is what is imputed to us?

Anderson might not be saying it right, but he is close.

Only if you believe people are not sinners until they commit their first act of sin.










** which some IFBs teach that the sinner's prayer is that first righteous act. The convolutions are absurd.

Imputation is a system of record keeping.

Literally, charges in an account ledger, recorded as they are incurred.

Humans are not charged until they are aware that they are choosing to transgress....which we all will do, because it is our fallen nature to do so.

Sin isn't imputed as a generic "block" of trespass.
Each individual trespass is recorded, kept until the judgement, as evidence against those who reject Christ.

So to insist that "imputation" is a condition into which we are born, exposes a weak understanding of the doctrine of imputation.

My bank cannot arbitrarily impute charges to my account because I'm human.
They can only charge my ledger with expenditures that I authorize.
Neither does The LORD, The Righteous Judge impute charges to our account, unless we are actually guilty of commission of said trespasses.

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[prophet]

Reason why Anderson left Hyle's Anderson
http://stevenandersonfamily.blogspot.com/2012/08/wow-what-shock-not.html

"My husband left Hyles-Anderson College in November of 2005, just months short of graduating, after it became evident that Schaap was a false teacher, and worse yet, a pervert. He has been pointing him out as such ever since. Only a complete freak would (in graphic detail, no less) compare the Lord's supper to having s** with God. I have blogged about him myself a few times. Yesterday, I found excerpts from a recent sermon by Schaap that were shocking, even after having heard so much smut out of the man's mouth already. Who in their right mind sits under that sort of "preaching", much less allows their children to be exposed to his dirty ramblings?"

I'm guessing it was mostly the KJV-onlyism and the Lord's Supper controversy.

It was so insane there, from '01-'06, it would be hard to narrow it down to a particular reason.

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[FSSL]

So then, what righteous act brings us the imputation of Christ?s righteousness?


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[Twisted]

Imputation is a system of record keeping.

Literally, charges in an account ledger, recorded as they are incurred.

Humans are not charged until they are aware that they are choosing to transgress....which we all will do, because it is our fallen nature to do so.

Sin isn't imputed as a generic "block" of trespass.
Each individual trespass is recorded, kept until the judgement, as evidence against those who reject Christ.

So to insist that "imputation" is a condition into which we are born, exposes a weak understanding of the doctrine of imputation.

My bank cannot arbitrarily impute charges to my account because I'm human.
They can only charge my ledger with expenditures that I authorize.
Neither does The LORD, The Righteous Judge impute charges to our account, unless we are actually guilty of commission of said trespasses.

A good analogy.

Hopefully those who have a hard time understanding the Scripture can understand this.

Good job.

 

[prophet]

So then, what righteous act brings us the imputation of Christ?s righteousness?


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Christ has the authority to impute His righteousness to our account.

There is no act that we can do to even square up our ledger, much less to credit it with someone else's wealth.

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[FSSL]

So then, what righteous act brings us the imputation of Christ?s righteousness?


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Christ has the authority to impute His righteousness to our account.

There is no act that we can do to even square up our ledger, much less to credit it with someone else's wealth.

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Then why is an act necessary to receive the imputation of Adamic sin?

 

[FSSL]

Imputation is a system of record keeping.

Literally, charges in an account ledger, recorded as they are incurred.

Humans are not charged until they are aware that they are choosing to transgress....which we all will do, because it is our fallen nature to do so.

Sin isn't imputed as a generic "block" of trespass.
Each individual trespass is recorded, kept until the judgement, as evidence against those who reject Christ.

So to insist that "imputation" is a condition into which we are born, exposes a weak understanding of the doctrine of imputation.

My bank cannot arbitrarily impute charges to my account because I'm human.
They can only charge my ledger with expenditures that I authorize.
Neither does The LORD, The Righteous Judge impute charges to our account, unless we are actually guilty of commission of said trespasses.

A good analogy.

Hopefully those who have a hard time understanding the Scripture can understand this.

Good job.

The fallacy of importing modern concepts back into the NT. We are guilty from conception, not only when we commit our first act of sin.

 

[prophet]

So then, what righteous act brings us the imputation of Christ?s righteousness?


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Christ has the authority to impute His righteousness to our account.

There is no act that we can do to even square up our ledger, much less to credit it with someone else's wealth.

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Then why is an act necessary to receive the imputation of Adamic sin?

Here is why:

Ezk 18:1 ? Ezk 18:4

? The word of the Lord came unto me again, saying, What mean ye, that ye use this proverb concerning the land of Israel, saying, The fathers have eaten sour grapes, and the children's teeth are set on edge? As I live, saith the Lord God, ye shall not have occasion any more to use this proverb in Israel. Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die.

Adam's sin is not imputed to us.

It is inherited.

The life of the flesh is in the blood.
Sin ,when it is finished, bringeth forth death.
Wherefore, as by one man, sin entered into the World, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned.
As in Adam, all die...

The corruption is in is.
It only becomes our record, when we consciously act on it.

I didn't think this was a hard concept.

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[prophet]

Imputation is a system of record keeping.

Literally, charges in an account ledger, recorded as they are incurred.

Humans are not charged until they are aware that they are choosing to transgress....which we all will do, because it is our fallen nature to do so.

Sin isn't imputed as a generic "block" of trespass.
Each individual trespass is recorded, kept until the judgement, as evidence against those who reject Christ.

So to insist that "imputation" is a condition into which we are born, exposes a weak understanding of the doctrine of imputation.

My bank cannot arbitrarily impute charges to my account because I'm human.
They can only charge my ledger with expenditures that I authorize.
Neither does The LORD, The Righteous Judge impute charges to our account, unless we are actually guilty of commission of said trespasses.

A good analogy.

Hopefully those who have a hard time understanding the Scripture can understand this.

Good job.

The fallacy of importing modern concepts back into the NT. We are guilty from conception, not only when we commit our first act of sin.

Since this fragment wasn't a complete thought, would you like to prove that "imputation" ever meant anything other than a ledger of charges?

You have read this, no?

Rev 20:11 ? Rev 20:15
And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them. And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

BTW, these discussions are very healthy to The Church of God, Our Family.

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[FreeToBeMe]

Anderson's a pimple on the nasty ass of fundamental/evangelical Christianity............

 

[FSSL]

Sin came to humanity through Adam (period).

The ideas expressed by Anderson and defended above are totally foreign to Scripture.

Here is the screwy conundrum being defended...

Man has a sinful nature
Until man commits his first sin, he is alive spiritually
When man commits his first sin, he dies spiritually
Then man receives the imputation of sin from Adam.

Where did man get his sinful nature that has spiritual life? And what kind of man has both a sinful nature and spiritual life?


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[TonyHutsonComedian]

Wasn't Anderson a HAC student at one time?

 

[prophet]

Sin came to humanity through Adam (period).

The ideas expressed by Anderson and defended above are totally foreign to Scripture.

Here is the screwy conundrum being defended...

Man has a sinful nature
Until man commits his first sin, he is alive spiritually
When man commits his first sin, he dies spiritually
Then man receives the imputation of sin from Adam.

Where did man get his sinful nature that has spiritual life? And what kind of man has both a sinful nature and spiritual life?


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You are stuck on this....man does not receive Adam's sin imputed to his record.

On the other hand, we are all born with a dead spirit, and it remains so until we are quickened.

In Adam, all die.

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[FSSL]

On the other hand, we are all born with a dead spirit, and it remains so until we are quickened.

If Adams sin is not imputed to us, then where did we get a sinful nature?

Anderson teaches that we have a sinful nature and are spiritually alive until we commit our first sin.

 

[prophet]

On the other hand, we are all born with a dead spirit, and it remains so until we are quickened.

If Adams sin is not imputed to us, then where did we get a sinful nature?

Anderson teaches that we have a sinful nature and are spiritually alive until we commit our first sin.

You clearly have a hang-up on the definition of "imputation".

We can't carry on this discussion, if we can't agree on the definition of terms.

All I can do is repeat what I've already said, and hope your ADHD doesn't make you miss it again.

IMPUTATION :

The record keeping of an individual debit or credit on a financial ledger.

This:

"Blessed is the man to whom the LORD will not impute iniquity".

Would make no sense, if every man had Adam's sin imputed to his account.

We have a "sin nature" that gives us a natural bent towards iniquity and sin.
This nature is blind, because the part of us that communicates with God is dead.
This nature destroys itself, without understanding why.  It is similar to a mammal versus a human. The mammal cannot reason.
The unregenerate human cannot spiritually discern, like the born again can.



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[FSSL]

When you take Adam out of the equation, you cannot answer where we get our sin nature.

Please tell us, from where did we get our sin nature? And why put quotes around it... are you unsure we even have one?

 

[prophet]

You've spent several posts trying to fit words in my mouth.

I never denied our inheritance from Adam.

It just isn't "imputed" to our account.

It is in us, and causes us to sin ,ourselves, creating our own account that rivals Adam's.

"The soul that sinneth, it shall surely die".






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[biscuit1953]

You've spent several posts trying to fit words in my mouth.

I never denied our inheritance from Adam.

It just isn't "imputed" to our account.

It is in us, and causes us to sin ,ourselves, creating our own account that rivals Adam's.

"The soul that sinneth, it shall surely die".






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If Adam's sin isn't imputed to our account from birth then why do babies die who have never committed a physical act of sin?

 

[FSSL]

You've spent several posts trying to fit words in my mouth.
I never denied our inheritance from Adam.
It just isn't "imputed" to our account.

Double-talk. Your definitions compete with each other.