need some help finding..........

[subllibrm]

Thing about dead preaches is that they taught within the context of their generation.

I like J Vernon McGee - and I have his total Bible program. I enjoy listening to him.

But. I also like my local pastor who is very much alive and it touch with many of today's issues ...

I loved listening to McGee.

 

[Walt]

Prosperity theology (sometimes referred to as the prosperity gospel, the health and wealth gospel, or the gospel of success) is a Christian religious doctrine that financial blessing is the will of God for Christians, and that faith, positive speech, and donations to Christian ministries will increase one's material wealth.


Not getting this from Greene or Hyles

I've heard a few of Hyles' early messages (before 1970), and my recollection is that they may have been sound.  But try this test (good for any "preacher").  Listen to  a sample of his messages, and see how many times he talks about himself, and how many times he mentions Jesus Christ (and praying "in Jesus' name" doesn't count).  Most of the preachers in the Hyles' system fail this test -- the "preaching" is really just a string of personal stories. Or else, a Bible verse is used as a launchpad and the preacher tells you what he thinks of something - not what the Bible says.

I don't usually associate Hyles with prosperity gospel -- that was more Schaap's line, I thought.

 

[Tarheel Baptist]

Hey, anybody know where I can get an 8-track recording of Tom Malone's greatest hits?

Also looking for Lester Roloff, on vinyl.

I found The Bible on Microphish , so I just need the NT on Beta.

Also, stone carvings of the Apocrypha, if those are still available, any one have directions to the Bazaar at Mecca?

Earnestly Contend

I'm looking for the Authorized King James Bible on parrot.

Three sons of a Yiddish Mama left their homeland, went abroad and prospered.
They discussed the gifts they were able to give their old mother.
AVRAHAM, the first, said:    "I built a big house for our mother."
MOISHE, the second, said:  "I sent her a Mercedes with a driver."
DAVID, the youngest, said:  "You remember how our mother enjoys
reading the bible.  These days she can't see very well.
I sent her a remarkable parrot that recites the whole bible...
Mama just has to name the chapter and verse
and the parrot will recite it word for word.
It took many years to train this parrot and it is quite rare."

Soon thereafter, a letter of thanks came from their mother.
AVRAHAM, she said, the house you built is so huge.
I live only in one room, but I have to clean the whole house!
MOISHE, she said, I am too old to travel.
I stay most of the time at home so I rarely use the Mercedes.
And that driver has shpilkas -- he's a pain in the tuchas.
But DAVID, she said, THE CHICKEN WAS DELICIOUS.

 

[Bo]

Prosperity theology (sometimes referred to as the prosperity gospel, the health and wealth gospel, or the gospel of success) is a Christian religious doctrine that financial blessing is the will of God for Christians, and that faith, positive speech, and donations to Christian ministries will increase one's material wealth.


Not getting this from Greene or Hyles

"Tithe, and you'll be blessed, don't, and you'll be cursed".


Earnestly Contend

that's biblical....you don't have to like it!  but it is.....

 

[prophet]

Prosperity theology (sometimes referred to as the prosperity gospel, the health and wealth gospel, or the gospel of success) is a Christian religious doctrine that financial blessing is the will of God for Christians, and that faith, positive speech, and donations to Christian ministries will increase one's material wealth.


Not getting this from Greene or Hyles

"Tithe, and you'll be blessed, don't, and you'll be cursed".


Earnestly Contend

that's biblical....you don't have to like it!  but it is.....

You can't show me where the Bible tells me to tithe.
As a born-again believer, I am under no curse.
Like I said, you may not be up on sound doctrine.

Earnestly Contend

 

[Smellin Coffee]

Prosperity theology (sometimes referred to as the prosperity gospel, the health and wealth gospel, or the gospel of success) is a Christian religious doctrine that financial blessing is the will of God for Christians, and that faith, positive speech, and donations to Christian ministries will increase one's material wealth.


Not getting this from Greene or Hyles

"Tithe, and you'll be blessed, don't, and you'll be cursed".


Earnestly Contend

that's biblical....you don't have to like it!  but it is.....

So you give 30% for your 3 tithes?

1. The Levitical, or sacred tithe (Num. 18: 21, 24).

2. The tithe of the feasts (Deut. 14:22-27).

3. The tithe for the poor (Deut. 14:28, 29).

 

[Bo]

I understand where you guys are coming from.  I honestly do.  And I don't just mean malachi. 
But take into consideration.....the WHOLE bible.  Not just bits and pieces. 

I know we are not BOUND by the law of the children of Israel.  I got that.  Think about the message in the entirety of the bible.  Giving to the poor......reaping what you sew.......giving thanks to God (i.e. blessings before meals...tithings).  Now BIBLICALLY yes....we will be blessed for tithings.  I agree we will be blessed if we tithe....and I believe if we don't and we are able to....we will probably get some negativity from God.  Just like the rich man and Lasurus.  Time after time after time even in the gospels of Christ it shows this. 

Just because it doesn't use the word "tithe" yall think its ok to skip out on it.  Most likely tryin to justify lack of obedience.  And also....going back to Malachi....I know it may have been for the children of Israel only....in your opinions....but God made sure His message stood the test of time...and He never said ANYWHERE in His word and the we are now exempt from tithing.

Is it the right thing to do to financially help the church....the poor....the needy....anyone?  YES......so wouldn't it be wrong not to help if you were able?  Jesus Himself said that if anyone asks anything of us to give it and offer more. 

I like to use the WHOLE doctrine.  So yes....I believe God wants us to tithe.....He said "when you have done it to the least of these...you have done it to me"  so if we give to the poor (like He says we should) we are giving to Him.  Giving is good....not giving when you can is bad.  FUNDAMENTALS

People need to start taking their bible as seriously as they did in the days of yesteryear.....but the bible even says that people wont.....so im not surprised

 

[praise_yeshua]

Prosperity theology (sometimes referred to as the prosperity gospel, the health and wealth gospel, or the gospel of success) is a Christian religious doctrine that financial blessing is the will of God for Christians, and that faith, positive speech, and donations to Christian ministries will increase one's material wealth.


Not getting this from Greene or Hyles

"Tithe, and you'll be blessed, don't, and you'll be cursed".


Earnestly Contend

that's biblical....you don't have to like it!  but it is.....

So you give 30% for your 3 tithes?

1. The Levitical, or sacred tithe (Num. 18: 21, 24).

2. The tithe of the feasts (Deut. 14:22-27).

3. The tithe for the poor (Deut. 14:28, 29).

I bet he has a problem getting where those told it to go......

It amazing just how hirelings have distorted things to their advantage!!!

 

[praise_yeshua]

I understand where you guys are coming from.  I honestly do.  And I don't just mean malachi. 
But take into consideration.....the WHOLE bible.  Not just bits and pieces. 

I know we are not BOUND by the law of the children of Israel.  I got that.  Think about the message in the entirety of the bible.  Giving to the poor......reaping what you sew.......giving thanks to God (i.e. blessings before meals...tithings).  Now BIBLICALLY yes....we will be blessed for tithings.  I agree we will be blessed if we tithe....and I believe if we don't and we are able to....we will probably get some negativity from God.  Just like the rich man and Lasurus.  Time after time after time even in the gospels of Christ it shows this. 

Just because it doesn't use the word "tithe" yall think its ok to skip out on it.  Most likely tryin to justify lack of obedience.  And also....going back to Malachi....I know it may have been for the children of Israel only....in your opinions....but God made sure His message stood the test of time...and He never said ANYWHERE in His word and the we are now exempt from tithing.

Is it the right thing to do to financially help the church....the poor....the needy....anyone?  YES......so wouldn't it be wrong not to help if you were able?  Jesus Himself said that if anyone asks anything of us to give it and offer more. 

I like to use the WHOLE doctrine.  So yes....I believe God wants us to tithe.....He said "when you have done it to the least of these...you have done it to me"  so if we give to the poor (like He says we should) we are giving to Him.  Giving is good....not giving when you can is bad.  FUNDAMENTALS

People need to start taking their bible as seriously as they did in the days of yesteryear.....but the bible even says that people wont.....so im not surprised

Sure its great to give. You're suppose to be lead by the Spirit to give where God wants to give it. Sadly. That's not usually down at the local IFB.

Giving to local hireling isn't blessing much of anyone.

 

[Bo]

I understand where you guys are coming from.  I honestly do.  And I don't just mean malachi. 
But take into consideration.....the WHOLE bible.  Not just bits and pieces. 

I know we are not BOUND by the law of the children of Israel.  I got that.  Think about the message in the entirety of the bible.  Giving to the poor......reaping what you sew.......giving thanks to God (i.e. blessings before meals...tithings).  Now BIBLICALLY yes....we will be blessed for tithings.  I agree we will be blessed if we tithe....and I believe if we don't and we are able to....we will probably get some negativity from God.  Just like the rich man and Lasurus.  Time after time after time even in the gospels of Christ it shows this. 

Just because it doesn't use the word "tithe" yall think its ok to skip out on it.  Most likely tryin to justify lack of obedience.  And also....going back to Malachi....I know it may have been for the children of Israel only....in your opinions....but God made sure His message stood the test of time...and He never said ANYWHERE in His word and the we are now exempt from tithing.

Is it the right thing to do to financially help the church....the poor....the needy....anyone?  YES......so wouldn't it be wrong not to help if you were able?  Jesus Himself said that if anyone asks anything of us to give it and offer more. 

I like to use the WHOLE doctrine.  So yes....I believe God wants us to tithe.....He said "when you have done it to the least of these...you have done it to me"  so if we give to the poor (like He says we should) we are giving to Him.  Giving is good....not giving when you can is bad.  FUNDAMENTALS

People need to start taking their bible as seriously as they did in the days of yesteryear.....but the bible even says that people wont.....so im not surprised

Sure its great to give. You're suppose to be lead by the Spirit to give where God wants to give it. Sadly. That's not usually down at the local IFB.

Giving to local hireling isn't blessing much of anyone.

I agree with that.  That's why I believe if you give 10% to a needy family....or a homeless person (regardless of what they decide to do with it) it still counts to God as tithing.  And yes.....sadly its not always properly used at a church.  But I also tend to lean towards thinking God would likely (as long as you give because you want to give for God)  that once you give....as long as your heart was in the right place when you give it.....God wont hold you accountable for what the person...place..whatever...receiving it does...

 

[Smellin Coffee]

I understand where you guys are coming from.  I honestly do.  And I don't just mean malachi. 
But take into consideration.....the WHOLE bible.  Not just bits and pieces. 

I know we are not BOUND by the law of the children of Israel.  I got that.  Think about the message in the entirety of the bible.  Giving to the poor......reaping what you sew.......giving thanks to God (i.e. blessings before meals...tithings).  Now BIBLICALLY yes....we will be blessed for tithings.  I agree we will be blessed if we tithe....and I believe if we don't and we are able to....we will probably get some negativity from God.  Just like the rich man and Lasurus.  Time after time after time even in the gospels of Christ it shows this. 

Just because it doesn't use the word "tithe" yall think its ok to skip out on it.  Most likely tryin to justify lack of obedience.  And also....going back to Malachi....I know it may have been for the children of Israel only....in your opinions....but God made sure His message stood the test of time...and He never said ANYWHERE in His word and the we are now exempt from tithing.

Is it the right thing to do to financially help the church....the poor....the needy....anyone?  YES......so wouldn't it be wrong not to help if you were able?  Jesus Himself said that if anyone asks anything of us to give it and offer more. 

I like to use the WHOLE doctrine.  So yes....I believe God wants us to tithe.....He said "when you have done it to the least of these...you have done it to me"  so if we give to the poor (like He says we should) we are giving to Him.  Giving is good....not giving when you can is bad.  FUNDAMENTALS

People need to start taking their bible as seriously as they did in the days of yesteryear.....but the bible even says that people wont.....so im not surprised

Sure its great to give. You're suppose to be lead by the Spirit to give where God wants to give it. Sadly. That's not usually down at the local IFB.

Giving to local hireling isn't blessing much of anyone.

I agree with that.  That's why I believe if you give 10% to a needy family....or a homeless person (regardless of what they decide to do with it) it still counts to God as tithing.  And yes.....sadly its not always properly used at a church.  But I also tend to lean towards thinking God would likely (as long as you give because you want to give for God)  that once you give....as long as your heart was in the right place when you give it.....God wont hold you accountable for what the person...place..whatever...receiving it does...

Why aren't you being biblical in your tithing by giving 30%? The same "Law" that mentions the 10% also mentions the other two 'tithes'. To believe in 10% tithe is shortchanging what God had intended and biblically mandated in the OT.

 

[Bo]

I aint tithed a full 10% in a LOOOONNNNNGGGGG time.......I owe a lot...lol  But I aint gonna say there aint nothing wrong with it.  I know im wrong.    And I know that at times that I feel like I caint afford to give.....if I would just give anyway....He would see me through and it wouldn't be bad as I believe it would.....but....me bein human.....I don't always.....and im ashamed of it sometimes. 

I just wanna do whats right.....and if there is even a possibility that it might be wrong......I figure its better not to take the chance

 

[prophet]

I aint tithed a full 10% in a LOOOONNNNNGGGGG time.......I owe a lot...lol  But I aint gonna say there aint nothing wrong with it.  I know im wrong.    And I know that at times that I feel like I caint afford to give.....if I would just give anyway....He would see me through and it wouldn't be bad as I believe it would.....but....me bein human.....I don't always.....and im ashamed of it sometimes. 

I just wanna do whats right.....and if there is even a possibility that it might be wrong......I figure its better not to take the chance

Then read the NT.

Find out that God wants you to give, when He gives you extra.
He wants you to give to the needs of the other Saints...when you have "abundance".
He wants you to care for the needs of your family.  If you don't, you have denied the Faith.
He wants you to treat anyone you come across, who has a need that you can meet, as yourself.
That is all.


Earnestly Contend

 

[Binaca Chugger]

I aint tithed a full 10% in a LOOOONNNNNGGGGG time.......I owe a lot...lol  But I aint gonna say there aint nothing wrong with it.  I know im wrong.    And I know that at times that I feel like I caint afford to give.....if I would just give anyway....He would see me through and it wouldn't be bad as I believe it would.....but....me bein human.....I don't always.....and im ashamed of it sometimes. 

I just wanna do whats right.....and if there is even a possibility that it might be wrong......I figure its better not to take the chance

Then read the NT.

Find out that God wants you to give, when He gives you extra.
He wants you to give to the needs of the other Saints...when you have "abundance".
He wants you to care for the needs of your family.  If you don't, you have denied the Faith.
He wants you to treat anyone you come across, who has a need that you can meet, as yourself.
That is all.


Earnestly Contend

Amen.

 

[Binaca Chugger]

Yes.  Hyles taught prosperity gospel.  It was a little different though.  You had to earn God's power to perform God's work so that you could receive the accolades of men and be able to care for your family.

 

[Bo]

?The only institution in this world that goes from house-to-house begging a bunch of poverty-stricken people that are going to be liabilities instead of assets to come is the New Testament Church. ... The Church wants outcasts. Jesus wants outcasts!? ?Dr. Jack Hyles


dont seem so big about forcing tithes to me

 

[Walt]

I understand where you guys are coming from.  I honestly do.  And I don't just mean malachi. 
But take into consideration.....the WHOLE bible.  Not just bits and pieces. 

I know we are not BOUND by the law of the children of Israel.  I got that.  Think about the message in the entirety of the bible.  Giving to the poor......reaping what you sew.......giving thanks to God (i.e. blessings before meals...tithings).  Now BIBLICALLY yes....we will be blessed for tithings.  I agree we will be blessed if we tithe....and I believe if we don't and we are able to....we will probably get some negativity from God.  Just like the rich man and Lasurus.  Time after time after time even in the gospels of Christ it shows this. 

Just because it doesn't use the word "tithe" yall think its ok to skip out on it.  Most likely tryin to justify lack of obedience.  And also....going back to Malachi....I know it may have been for the children of Israel only....in your opinions....but God made sure His message stood the test of time...and He never said ANYWHERE in His word and the we are now exempt from tithing.

Is it the right thing to do to financially help the church....the poor....the needy....anyone?  YES......so wouldn't it be wrong not to help if you were able?  Jesus Himself said that if anyone asks anything of us to give it and offer more. 

I like to use the WHOLE doctrine.  So yes....I believe God wants us to tithe.....He said "when you have done it to the least of these...you have done it to me"  so if we give to the poor (like He says we should) we are giving to Him.  Giving is good....not giving when you can is bad.  FUNDAMENTALS

People need to start taking their bible as seriously as they did in the days of yesteryear.....but the bible even says that people wont.....so im not surprised

You fall into the trap of thinking that everyone who wants to dispute tithing is looking for an excuse not to give.

Consider that the Old Testament is full of rules and regulations ("the law") that shows (a) the holiness of God, and (b) our inability to keep the law.  When Jesus came and was teaching, He elevated everything to a higher standard.  Instead of merely "thou shalt not commit adultery", Jesus taught that even looking upon a woman with lust is sinful; with the Holy Spirit's help, we men should work at controlling our thoughts.  The world sniggers "Hey, I'm married, not dead" in justifying ogling women.  But Jesus calls us to a higher standard.  The same way with murder - the Old Testament law was "Thou shalt not murder" -- but Jesus taught that His higher standard is not to be angry with our brothers.

I believe that the same applies to giving.  Only a Biblical dunce would argue that Jesus didn't teach that His disciples should give. But I believe that He did not mention "tithe" for a good reason -- that was the law, and why should His people consider themselves restricted to merely 10%?  God has promised to bless those who give; instead of attempting to reach some numerical goal, we should seek the Holy Spirit and consider what God would have us give.  That could be well over 10% in some cases.

So, while I don't think tithing is New Testament, giving certainly is - and we should be looking for excuses and ways to give.  His people should be giving people.

 

[Bo]

I understand where you guys are coming from.  I honestly do.  And I don't just mean malachi. 
But take into consideration.....the WHOLE bible.  Not just bits and pieces. 

I know we are not BOUND by the law of the children of Israel.  I got that.  Think about the message in the entirety of the bible.  Giving to the poor......reaping what you sew.......giving thanks to God (i.e. blessings before meals...tithings).  Now BIBLICALLY yes....we will be blessed for tithings.  I agree we will be blessed if we tithe....and I believe if we don't and we are able to....we will probably get some negativity from God.  Just like the rich man and Lasurus.  Time after time after time even in the gospels of Christ it shows this. 

Just because it doesn't use the word "tithe" yall think its ok to skip out on it.  Most likely tryin to justify lack of obedience.  And also....going back to Malachi....I know it may have been for the children of Israel only....in your opinions....but God made sure His message stood the test of time...and He never said ANYWHERE in His word and the we are now exempt from tithing.

Is it the right thing to do to financially help the church....the poor....the needy....anyone?  YES......so wouldn't it be wrong not to help if you were able?  Jesus Himself said that if anyone asks anything of us to give it and offer more. 

I like to use the WHOLE doctrine.  So yes....I believe God wants us to tithe.....He said "when you have done it to the least of these...you have done it to me"  so if we give to the poor (like He says we should) we are giving to Him.  Giving is good....not giving when you can is bad.  FUNDAMENTALS

People need to start taking their bible as seriously as they did in the days of yesteryear.....but the bible even says that people wont.....so im not surprised

You fall into the trap of thinking that everyone who wants to dispute tithing is looking for an excuse not to give.

Consider that the Old Testament is full of rules and regulations ("the law") that shows (a) the holiness of God, and (b) our inability to keep the law.  When Jesus came and was teaching, He elevated everything to a higher standard.  Instead of merely "thou shalt not commit adultery", Jesus taught that even looking upon a woman with lust is sinful; with the Holy Spirit's help, we men should work at controlling our thoughts.  The world sniggers "Hey, I'm married, not dead" in justifying ogling women.  But Jesus calls us to a higher standard.  The same way with murder - the Old Testament law was "Thou shalt not murder" -- but Jesus taught that His higher standard is not to be angry with our brothers.

I believe that the same applies to giving.  Only a Biblical dunce would argue that Jesus didn't teach that His disciples should give. But I believe that He did not mention "tithe" for a good reason -- that was the law, and why should His people consider themselves restricted to merely 10%?  God has promised to bless those who give; instead of attempting to reach some numerical goal, we should seek the Holy Spirit and consider what God would have us give.  That could be well over 10% in some cases.

So, while I don't think tithing is New Testament, giving certainly is - and we should be looking for excuses and ways to give.  His people should be giving people.

i can go along with this.    i guess i just see giving to the poor as giving to God and basically being a tithe.....and we are called to give....

 

[Smellin Coffee]

I aint tithed a full 10% in a LOOOONNNNNGGGGG time.......I owe a lot...lol  But I aint gonna say there aint nothing wrong with it.  I know im wrong.    And I know that at times that I feel like I caint afford to give.....if I would just give anyway....He would see me through and it wouldn't be bad as I believe it would.....but....me bein human.....I don't always.....and im ashamed of it sometimes. 

I just wanna do whats right.....and if there is even a possibility that it might be wrong......I figure its better not to take the chance

I've got no problem with your practice. I just want you to realize that 'biblical tithing' means tithing of 30%, not 10%. So it is erroneous to teach that 10% is 'biblical tithing'.

 

[prophet]

Yes.  Hyles taught prosperity gospel.  It was a little different though.  You had to earn God's power to perform God's work so that you could receive the accolades of men and be able to care for your family.

This is one aspect....aptly described.

Earnestly Contend