Ohio church calls new pastor.

[Walt]

Some of you old timers might be interested in this:
http://www.plainchurch.org/index.php/search/

Some churches just keep making bad decisions & refuse to properly do proper background investigations.

Or (perhaps worse?) they just don't care...

 

[Walt]

Marty is still among us, no doubt reading this thread!  He will be back posting soon to stir up more angst and animosity!

What really amazed me was his refusal to acknowledge that he was no longer qualified to be a pastor.

 

[cpizzle]

"We believe in one God who eternally exists in three divine Persons: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. These three Persons are one in essence but distinct in personality. Each Person is fully and equally God. We reject the claim that the Trinity constitutes  belief in three gods. We further reject the view that Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are three roles or three different ways of looking at God."

Three lines.

That is a good explanation of the Trinity as commonly understood.  However, this shows the problem with the study of theology.  Most of what you said is opinion, not completely explained by the scripture.

Which parts are not explained by Scripture? I submit that it is the above that is the opinion, not my statement.

I agree with your statement on the Trinity...but I wouldn't bet my Salavation on it.  It is still my best attempt at explaining the unexplainable.  I would not be surprised to get to heaven and find out we were totally off on our true understanding on the nature of God. 

The Bible never explains the Trinity.  We have multiple passages that give us insight about the unity of the Father, Son (Word), and Holy Ghost.  We do our best to put those verses together in their context and come up with a way to explain God.

 

[Vince Massi]

When I was in Catholic school, the nun made clear that the Trinity is not taught in the Bible. She explained that it is a man-made attempt to explain something that God says is not explainable.

 

[bgwilkinson]

Systematic Theology is important. It is man's best attempt to explain the unexplainable and is helpful in pointing out false doctrines.


Johnny Mac says,
"Since the Trinity cannot be comprehended by the human mind, the doctrine of the Trinity must be defined with negative statements (often called ?apophatic theology,? or ?negative theology?). For example, the phrase ?without division and without replication of the essence,? used above, is an expression of negative theology. Such phrases and assertions are needed to place proper boundaries on the positive statements, such as the one made above that ?God is absolutely and eternally one essence subsisting in three distinct and ordered persons.? This positive statement needs boundaries to prevent people from thinking that the three persons each have either a third of the divine essence (partialism) or a full divine essence that is distinct from the full but identical essences of the other two persons (tritheism). If the essence were divided among the three persons, none of the persons would be divine. And if the essence were replicated in the three persons, the result would be three gods."

MacArthur, J., & Mayhue, R. (Eds.). (2017). Biblical Doctrine: A Systematic Summary of Bible Truth (p. 189). Wheaton, IL: Crossway.

I realize there is a natural bias against Systematic Theology by many IFBs but it very helpful in characterizing the Christian Religion.

 

[brianb]

Notice he said he went to bible college near Chicago without naming the school. He isn't the first HAC grad (actually I dont think he graduated) that doesn't want to mention the name of his alma mater.

https://www.friendshipbaptistonline.com/pastor

I am not ashamed

Here is a quote from their web page. Is it any wonder that people call the IFBx unscholarly? What ever happened to proofreading?

"Therefore, we believe and stand firmly that have the very Word of God preserved in the King James Bible for the English Speaking People."

If you think that is an acceptable sentence in the English language maybe you too are an IFBx.
There may be other sentences like that, but that is the only one I looked at. Tells you all you need to know. This guy should sell used cars making an honest living.

Recently on their FB page the administrator posted an NIV verse. Either there is a division in the congregation or they haven't updated their Statement of Faith. 

 

[bgwilkinson]

Notice he said he went to bible college near Chicago without naming the school. He isn't the first HAC grad (actually I dont think he graduated) that doesn't want to mention the name of his alma mater.

https://www.friendshipbaptistonline.com/pastor

I am not ashamed

Here is a quote from their web page. Is it any wonder that people call the IFBx unscholarly? What ever happened to proofreading?

"Therefore, we believe and stand firmly that have the very Word of God preserved in the King James Bible for the English Speaking People."

If you think that is an acceptable sentence in the English language maybe you too are an IFBx.
There may be other sentences like that, but that is the only one I looked at. Tells you all you need to know. This guy should sell used cars making an honest living.

Recently on their FB page the administrator posted an NIV verse. Either there is a division in the congregation or they haven't updated their Statement of Faith.

Well maybe they haven't bought into KJVO completely.

 

[Jim Jones]

Marty has wood.

 

[no value]

Notice he said he went to bible college near Chicago without naming the school. He isn't the first HAC grad (actually I dont think he graduated) that doesn't want to mention the name of his alma mater.

So freaking what? I graduated from seminary and I don't mention it for a couple of reasons---1) most wouldn't have heard of the school, and 2) the rest don't care.  And BTW---it wasn't HAC.

Say what you will about Brother Marty; I think he's a stand-up guy. Yeah, he screwed up---who hasn't. He confessed it, undoubtedly to God, his wife and whoever else needed to hear it---good for him. He moved away and stayed away for a time to hopefully rebuild his life and regain some respect and credibility---I hope he has.

Stepping into the pastorate of an established church is never easy. I just recently made that transition myself, and the best way I can describe the past 3 weeks is cordially awkward. (or awkwardly cordial). We're nice and cordially but the congregation and my family don't really know each other very well.

For me---my hat's off to you Brother Marty. God Speed and Good Success. I hope you do well.

 

[16KJV11]

Since when has HAC been known to produce academic geniuses?  You give them too much credit! 

The surprise is less that HAC produces such subpar graduates (I know it's a clown college), than that people who presumably graduated from high school actually go there of their own free will.

I can't speak for others, but I can speak for myself.

I passed the college entrance exam in 7th grade.  I got a 30 out of 36 on my ACT in 12th grade at a public school.  I had a full scholarship to the University of TN when I graduated HS.  My dad was one of the top elected officials in the State of TN and could have helped me get into law school after college.  However, God called me to HAC. 

I have no regrets either.  I earned a business degree after leaving HAC.  Now, I am in upper management of a mid sized business (200+) with over 80 million in annual revenue.  I pastor a growing church in Middle TN with people I love and who love me.  My wife is a nurse and we are living an upper middle class lifestyle while serving the Lord and giving to others.  Not bad for a "clown college" graduate

At best, I've always been a nominal student, even in the the University and Community College I attended prior to HAC, yet I graduated Summa Cum Laude from HAC in 3.5 years.
There were some challenging classes but most of them were less than challenging.
I'm still glad I went for I learned a lot of things besides academics and found God's will for my life in the form a beautiful, godly wife!  :-*

 

[Walt]

Notice he said he went to bible college near Chicago without naming the school. He isn't the first HAC grad (actually I dont think he graduated) that doesn't want to mention the name of his alma mater.

So freaking what? I graduated from seminary and I don't mention it for a couple of reasons---1) most wouldn't have heard of the school, and 2) the rest don't care.  And BTW---it wasn't HAC.

Say what you will about Brother Marty; I think he's a stand-up guy. Yeah, he screwed up---who hasn't. He confessed it, undoubtedly to God, his wife and whoever else needed to hear it---good for him. He moved away and stayed away for a time to hopefully rebuild his life and regain some respect and credibility---I hope he has.

Stepping into the pastorate of an established church is never easy. I just recently made that transition myself, and the best way I can describe the past 3 weeks is cordially awkward. (or awkwardly cordial). We're nice and cordially but the congregation and my family don't really know each other very well.

For me---my hat's off to you Brother Marty. God Speed and Good Success. I hope you do well.

I'm not saying that he has chosen an easy life or that he's not a "stand-up guy" (whatever that means).

I am saying that committing adultery disqualifies one for the pastorate.  He gave up the privilege of pastoring when he chose to commit adultery.

I'm happy for him if he has repented of his sin and made it right - but let him preach on the street, in nursing homes, in prison, but pastoring - no.

 

[FSSL]

I know of a couple situations where adultery is in a person's past (while they were in vocational ministry). After obvious repentance, confirmed by time, they are leading great ministries today.

Certainly, these illustrations of remarkable grace and forgiveness are few and far between.

I do agree that it disqualifies a person. Is that disqualification permanent? Is there a biblical basis for a permanent disqualification?

 

[Tarheel Baptist]

I know of a couple situations where adultery is in a person's past (while they were in vocational ministry). After obvious repentance, confirmed by time, they are leading great ministries today.

Certainly, these illustrations of remarkable grace and forgiveness are few and far between.

I do agree that it disqualifies a person. Is that disqualification permanent? Is there a biblical basis for a permanent disqualification?

I know of a couple of situations wherein the adulterous pastor was restored to ministry and eventually repeated the sinful behavior. One man had 3 different episodes.

I also know of one man who, like your example, is faithful to his ministry (assistant pastor) and his wife today. I don't know if you can definitively claim a biblical basis for disqualification or not. I do believe you can follow biblical evidence and come to that conclusion.

 

[FSSL]

I know. It is a thoughy! Forgiveness does not equal trust.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Tarheel Baptist]

I know. It is a thoughy! Forgiveness does not equal trust.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

True.
And forgiveness doesn't automatically equal being restored to your previous position. God forgave Adam, but He didn't put him back into Eden.

 

[Jim Jones]

Past behavior is indicative of future behavior.


Just saying.

 

[Walt]

I know of a couple situations where adultery is in a person's past (while they were in vocational ministry). After obvious repentance, confirmed by time, they are leading great ministries today.

Certainly, these illustrations of remarkable grace and forgiveness are few and far between.

I do agree that it disqualifies a person. Is that disqualification permanent? Is there a biblical basis for a permanent disqualification?

A great discussion...

 

[FSSL]

Jim Jones: Is that Scriptural? Where does progressive sanctification fit in that slogan?

 

[Jim Jones]

Jim Jones: Is that Scriptural? Where does progressive sanctification fit in that slogan?

Ask your local law enforcement agency.

There is A very good reason they keep your criminal record.

 

[sword]

Jim Jones: Is that Scriptural? Where does progressive sanctification fit in that slogan?

Ask your local law enforcement agency.
There is A very good reason they keep your criminal record.

This is just my personal view but I would not have a pastor who had a significant moral failure in his past. I can still respect him, ask his personal advice, even be his friend but I would not sit under his leadership as my pastor.

There are a number of Bible greats who committed terrible sins and were still used greatly by God. David is a great example of Gods wonderful grace. I do not have chapter and verse to support my view, but I do hold my pastor to a higher standard than my friends and family. If I am to sit under his leadership and allow him to have influence on my life, then I expect more from him.