The Arrogance of Pastors
- Thread starter Twisted
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Twisted said:
Yes, ha ha.
But on a non-arrogant level, supposed the other couple had some crisis come up in their life and needed extended counseling - everything would be consistent with the story as related.
The other explanation shifts the arrogance to the pastor's wife: what if he made the appointment, and then told his wife, who said that she couldn't stand "Member's" wife and forced him to break off the appointment. He would probably claim "something important" just as he did.
I'm only stating that there are other explanations than assuming the man is arrogant.
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(This story is condensed)
An evangelist was at a meeting.
As was his custom, he found a small room to pray before the meeting began.
As he prayed, he heard the door open next door and men entered the room.
He heard them say that the offering for the evangelist was the largest one they had ever taken. The pastor wanted the deacons to only give him half. All the deacons agreed.
Long story short: The evangelist mentioned how the evangelist lives off of the offering. The pastor got under conviction and told the evangelist that he would mail him his offering later.
When he got the check, it was for all the offering, not half.
Now that little story is from a wonderful booklet entitled, "Churches, Camps and Conference Centers that are Thieves, Rogues, and Rip-Off Artists".
The evangelist was J. Harold Smith. The booklet has many such stories.
An evangelist was at a meeting.
As was his custom, he found a small room to pray before the meeting began.
As he prayed, he heard the door open next door and men entered the room.
He heard them say that the offering for the evangelist was the largest one they had ever taken. The pastor wanted the deacons to only give him half. All the deacons agreed.
Long story short: The evangelist mentioned how the evangelist lives off of the offering. The pastor got under conviction and told the evangelist that he would mail him his offering later.
When he got the check, it was for all the offering, not half.
Now that little story is from a wonderful booklet entitled, "Churches, Camps and Conference Centers that are Thieves, Rogues, and Rip-Off Artists".
The evangelist was J. Harold Smith. The booklet has many such stories.
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I was in a staff meeting when another staff member told us of a pastor friend of his that had a "situation" with a visiting ministry.
After the meeting, the visiting ministry told the pastor that they required a certain minimum for a love offering. (Not the way to do it at all!)
As the pastor usually did, during the meeting, the pastor told his people that "every penny coming in the offering tonight will go to this ministry".
When the ministry told the pastor about the minimum, he became angry and told the treasurer to cut them a check for that amount. The amount was $1,000.
The total offering collected was over $5,000.
As this staff member told his story with a smile on his face (I guess his point was that "that pastor sure showed them") I asked him what became of the rest of the money.
He had no idea. I told him I knew what happened to it, it went into the church bank account. I told him (and everyone else at the meeting) that his friend has just committed fraud and felony theft, and if someone were to press charges, he would probably go to jail.
Well, that sure soured his disposition.
But this is what some pastors do (not all). Have you ever stolen part of an offering from someone?
After the meeting, the visiting ministry told the pastor that they required a certain minimum for a love offering. (Not the way to do it at all!)
As the pastor usually did, during the meeting, the pastor told his people that "every penny coming in the offering tonight will go to this ministry".
When the ministry told the pastor about the minimum, he became angry and told the treasurer to cut them a check for that amount. The amount was $1,000.
The total offering collected was over $5,000.
As this staff member told his story with a smile on his face (I guess his point was that "that pastor sure showed them") I asked him what became of the rest of the money.
He had no idea. I told him I knew what happened to it, it went into the church bank account. I told him (and everyone else at the meeting) that his friend has just committed fraud and felony theft, and if someone were to press charges, he would probably go to jail.
Well, that sure soured his disposition.
But this is what some pastors do (not all). Have you ever stolen part of an offering from someone?
I sent that book to some pastors...........months after I held revival meetings for them. Good read.Twisted said:
I became the pastor of a small country church and upon arriving I found out that the previous pastor had booked a big city pastor who was going into the ministry of evangelism full-time. I told him that we had a small congregation and we were barely making budget and I gave him the option of bowing out and that it was his decision. He said, "Brother, God can do miracles in little churches as well as he can and big churches, I'm coming . When he arrived in his new customized van I put him in a motel, took care of all of his meals, he ate at our table each evening before services. I took a love offering every evening and had taken love offerings for weeks before in hopes of having enough to honor him properly with the honorarium. He preached over the heads of those country folks and left.
A few weeks Later I received a letter from him letting me know that the love offering had not been sufficient and that to make up for it he wanted our church to make three payments on his customized van. He never heard from me again.
What I did not tell him was that because of of the church folks giving toward the love offerings that the church budget was not sufficient enough to pay me that week.
A few weeks Later I received a letter from him letting me know that the love offering had not been sufficient and that to make up for it he wanted our church to make three payments on his customized van. He never heard from me again.
What I did not tell him was that because of of the church folks giving toward the love offerings that the church budget was not sufficient enough to pay me that week.
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fishinnut said:
This has reminded me of an event.
We were involved in a ministry that was trying to raise support. A pastor is another state invited me to come to a special meeting he was holding and present.
I drove there (at least 6 hours), got a motel room, ate, etc., then went to the meeting.
About an hour into the meeting the pastor approached me and told me he had changed his mind.
Well, ok, what can I do about it?
After returning home I wrote him a letter explaining that he had invited me, and that I had incurred expenses. I asked him to help cover those expenses.
I never heard from him again.
After of reading that book, I had a pastor ask me to come preach for him for a Sunday telling me that he had been unjustly attacked. Something wasn't right there, bad vibes everywhere. He took my family out to eat after the PM service. He looked across the table & said his guy that wrote the checks didn't show at church so he'd mail a check to me during the week. I looked him right in the eyes & said, "We can drop my family off at the motel & we drive over to the man's house together." He thought about it & told me that he'd slide the check under my motel door the next morning. He did.Twisted said:
Short lived.Twisted said:
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You want to think these stories are made up, but in the words of Kramer...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6-YtF2P_VmU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6-YtF2P_VmU
Funny. As big as he got.........he needed that van.Twisted said:
Twisted said:
Booklet was written in 1985 by Ralph Sexton, Sr. Not sure where to find a copy
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From a guy who was an evangelist & a HAC grad..........I have a different viewpoint.BALAAM said:
JH was friends with several evangelist like the Rice brothers, Boyd & BJ Sr. to name a few. But he got the big-head & thought that he was the only one who could preach at his church & fill the building. JS believed that to the day he was finally called on the carpet.
So......many HAC students & grads got the idea that evangelists were not needed in the life of a church. They were not taught how to plan, prepare for, promote & conduct revival meetings. I spoke to RY about this & he told me that he had no idea about revivals & evangelist. I speak from experience when I say that many grads certainly did not learn to care for the needs of the evangelist especially in the area of finances, unless it was an IFB big-name.
Oh, they learned how to have conferences with pastors doing the preaching. Again, it may not have been taught but it was caught.
I once, well, more than once actually, heard a preacher proclaim that his church was the greatest church since the time of Paul. The implication, of course, was that he was the greatest pastor since the time of Paul.