Tom Vineyards sexual misconduct

[bgwilkinson]

How does an employee fire the Chairman of the Board of Directors?

My guess is that you'll find this specific procedure in this book:

We learned more about church government after God took him.

I hope you don't get your info from that book.

You might want to rethink what you got from it.

Consider the whole life and the ministry of the man that wrote it.

Run from it.

Sadly many thought he was an expert.

 

[Citadel of Truth]

I hope you don't get your info from that book...Run from it.

My friend, my posting of this book was purely sarcastic. You asked how an employee (the pastor) could fire the Chairman of the Board. My point was that the Vineyards learned this from the man who was accountable to no one.

 

[Just me]

Vineyard was accountable to no one, period. Everyone answered to him and if you had a problem with that JAV would happily bring you into submission through a number of methods.  All of which are not pleasant. There might be a head of deacons or head of directors or whatever you wish to call it but the reality is that person answered to JAV.  Maybe not in public but definitely in private.

All the "men" I knew who were responsible for anything were complete "yes" men.

That was the Vineyard way and I am sure the Tommy (with Jimmy standing over his shoulder) way also.

Under JAV could you buck his system, yes.  Is it advisable, no.  The easiest thing is to simply leave and find a real place of  worship because you would never get past all the yes men.

 

[theretoolong]

As  my name states I was there too long and one thing that is a fact is if you ever questioned a Vineyard you were either fired, asked to leave and/or forced to sign a letter of confidentiality.

 

[TruthBearer]

I notice that Windsor Hills Baptist Church is a State of Oklahoma not-for-profit Corp. and is subject to the Oklahoma not-for-profit Corp law.

https://www.sos.ok.gov/corp/corpInformation.aspx?id=1400193035

Churches are held to their bylaws formed by the church. I cannot think of any church that has board members.

Even though they may be registered as a non-profit organization they are not governed by board members like a secular non-profit organization.

There is also the issue of the property being in the name of Tommy Boy not any board members or the church. Tommy Boy is the legal property owner. Even if the church was held to board members he could anyone that opposes him arrested for trespassing on private property, property that he holds the deed too not the church.

The church can fire him but they would have to find their own place to meet.

 

[bgwilkinson]

I notice that Windsor Hills Baptist Church is a State of Oklahoma not-for-profit Corp. and is subject to the Oklahoma not-for-profit Corp law.

https://www.sos.ok.gov/corp/corpInformation.aspx?id=1400193035

Churches are held to their bylaws formed by the church. I cannot think of any church that has board members.

Even though they may be registered as a non-profit organization they are not governed by board members like a secular non-profit organization.

There is also the issue of the property being in the name of Tommy Boy not any board members or the church. Tommy Boy is the legal property owner. Even if the church was held to board members he could anyone that opposes him arrested for trespassing on private property, property that he holds the deed too not the church.

The church can fire him but they would have to find their own place to meet.

A real not-for-profit corp. has by laws and a board of directors, they usually are the deacons in a legitimate church.

If the pastor owns the assets you do not really have a church. You have something else.

You have a group of unsuspecting victims of a family business masquerading as a church. IMHO

If you looked at the articles of incorporation at the Secretary of State web site you would find out the real story.

https://www.sos.ok.gov/corp/corpInformation.aspx?id=1400193035

It only costs $5.00 to get the real scoop from the state.

It could be that  JV and his son are the board of directors. That would be a shame, but not surprising, knowing JV.

 

[RedRover01]

I notice that Windsor Hills Baptist Church is a State of Oklahoma not-for-profit Corp. and is subject to the Oklahoma not-for-profit Corp law.

https://www.sos.ok.gov/corp/corpInformation.aspx?id=1400193035

That's all fine and good but in order for anything to happen there must be a formal vote.  As far as I know, no one will let a vote happen. I'm sure if past employees brought suit on being fired it would bring about consequences. But that will probably beer happen.  Easier for most to just walk away.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

"beer" happen ... what is "beer" happen. Is that the Christian version of Budlight? lol jk

Oh my sooooul! (Said in my best drawn out southern accent!)  That is the second time I've been called out on here for my spelling!!  Stop being grammar nazis!!  And stop judging me!!  Lol jk


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[JustABigKid]

As  my name states I was there too long and one thing that is a fact is if you ever questioned a Vineyard you were either fired, asked to leave and/or forced to sign a letter of confidentiality.

It took the verse in the Bible that says, "Obey them which have the rule over you" to a whole new level. My family lived a very poor life not because my parents didn't work because they both worked 2 jobs but because they were told to give so much to the church. From paying for our school (about 10k yr), to tithe, to missions, to presents for the preacher 3 times a year, to every other thing that they were asked to give to.

 

[Just me]

As  my name states I was there too long and one thing that is a fact is if you ever questioned a Vineyard you were either fired, asked to leave and/or forced to sign a letter of confidentiality.

It took the verse in the Bible that says, "Obey them which have the rule over you" to a whole new level. My family lived a very poor life not because my parents didn't work because they both worked 2 jobs but because they were told to give so much to the church. From paying for our school (about 10k yr), to tithe, to missions, to presents for the preacher 3 times a year, to every other thing that they were asked to give to.

I use to roll my eyes every time the head lapdog Deacon Cox would get up in front of the church, before preacher came into the auditorium so he would not know. (yeah right)  Gave the same speech everytime and tried hard to make everyone feel bad for not giving their last dime to the preachers birthday or anniversary offering.  I would look at JAV and his new Suburban every 2 years, motor home, nice house and expensive trips all over the country and think, nope aint giving him a dime.

And now Tommy boy for the last decade has been even more so bankrupting the church to live the same life.  PTL it ain't working.

 

[Citadel of Truth]

... head lapdog Deacon Cox...

Would this be the father or the son?

 

[movedon]

... head lapdog Deacon Cox...

Would this be the father or the son?

Father

 

[Just me]

... head lapdog Deacon Cox...

Would this be the father or the son?

Father

Bingo.  Definitely the senior

 

[Walt]

As  my name states I was there too long and one thing that is a fact is if you ever questioned a Vineyard you were either fired, asked to leave and/or forced to sign a letter of confidentiality.

It took the verse in the Bible that says, "Obey them which have the rule over you" to a whole new level. My family lived a very poor life not because my parents didn't work because they both worked 2 jobs but because they were told to give so much to the church. From paying for our school (about 10k yr), to tithe, to missions, to presents for the preacher 3 times a year, to every other thing that they were asked to give to.

I use to roll my eyes every time the head lapdog Deacon Cox would get up in front of the church, before preacher came into the auditorium so he would not know. (yeah right)  Gave the same speech everytime and tried hard to make everyone feel bad for not giving their last dime to the preachers birthday or anniversary offering.  I would look at JAV and his new Suburban every 2 years, motor home, nice house and expensive trips all over the country and think, nope aint giving him a dime.

It ain't unique to Vineyard; I suspect that Hyles taught this; I know of a HAC-supporting churches run similarly; the pastor would go to a staff member or a deacon and tell them what he believed they should get him for his anniversary, or birthday, etc.  The stuckee would get up in front of the congregation when the pastor was out, pretend it was a secret, and their own idea, and take up the money. All of the time, the pastor knew all about it, and in fact, had orchestrated it.

Made me sick.

 

[JustABigKid]

As  my name states I was there too long and one thing that is a fact is if you ever questioned a Vineyard you were either fired, asked to leave and/or forced to sign a letter of confidentiality.

It took the verse in the Bible that says, "Obey them which have the rule over you" to a whole new level. My family lived a very poor life not because my parents didn't work because they both worked 2 jobs but because they were told to give so much to the church. From paying for our school (about 10k yr), to tithe, to missions, to presents for the preacher 3 times a year, to every other thing that they were asked to give to.

I use to roll my eyes every time the head lapdog Deacon Cox would get up in front of the church, before preacher came into the auditorium so he would not know. (yeah right)  Gave the same speech everytime and tried hard to make everyone feel bad for not giving their last dime to the preachers birthday or anniversary offering.  I would look at JAV and his new Suburban every 2 years, motor home, nice house and expensive trips all over the country and think, nope aint giving him a dime.

It ain't unique to Vineyard; I suspect that Hyles taught this; I know of a HAC-supporting churches run similarly; the pastor would go to a staff member or a deacon and tell them what he believed they should get him for his anniversary, or birthday, etc.  The stuckee would get up in front of the congregation when the pastor was out, pretend it was a secret, and their own idea, and take up the money. All of the time, the pastor knew all about it, and in fact, had orchestrated it.

Made me sick.

Yep....I see this every year when it's pastor's birthday, anniversary, or it's time for Christmas bonuses.  A few years ago (under a different pastor), the "church" decided to buy one of our deacons a new gun to celebrate his many years of service to the church.  Stupid.

I am thankful for the pastor where I am at now. He never expects anything from the church and tries to leave within the means that make up the majority of the church. He is taken care of but because the church wants him to be not because he demands it but he doesn't live like a king either. Many times he will even put his entire check back into the church to make sure a special event is taken care of or whatever else might be up and doesn't tell anyone. At birthdays and such people give to him as they see fit on their own not something that is pushed upon them.

Its great being somewhere that the pastor truly cares about the people not his pocket book.

 

[AmazedbyGrace]

I notice that Windsor Hills Baptist Church is a State of Oklahoma not-for-profit Corp. and is subject to the Oklahoma not-for-profit Corp law.

https://www.sos.ok.gov/corp/corpInformation.aspx?id=1400193035

Churches are held to their bylaws formed by the church. I cannot think of any church that has board members.

Even though they may be registered as a non-profit organization they are not governed by board members like a secular non-profit organization.

There is also the issue of the property being in the name of Tommy Boy not any board members or the church. Tommy Boy is the legal property owner. Even if the church was held to board members he could anyone that opposes him arrested for trespassing on private property, property that he holds the deed too not the church.

The church can fire him but they would have to find their own place to meet.

The church does not seem to be owned by Vineyard. Have you seen any proof of this?
I wonder if perhaps this rumor was spread to make people think Tom Vineyard was untouchable.

http://www.oklahomacounty.org/assessor/SearchMethod.htm

 

[TruthBearer]

I notice that Windsor Hills Baptist Church is a State of Oklahoma not-for-profit Corp. and is subject to the Oklahoma not-for-profit Corp law.

https://www.sos.ok.gov/corp/corpInformation.aspx?id=1400193035

Churches are held to their bylaws formed by the church. I cannot think of any church that has board members.

Even though they may be registered as a non-profit organization they are not governed by board members like a secular non-profit organization.

There is also the issue of the property being in the name of Tommy Boy not any board members or the church. Tommy Boy is the legal property owner. Even if the church was held to board members he could anyone that opposes him arrested for trespassing on private property, property that he holds the deed too not the church.

The church can fire him but they would have to find their own place to meet.

The church does not seem to be owned by Vineyard. Have you seen any proof of this?
I wonder if perhaps this rumor was spread to make people think Tom Vineyard was untouchable.

http://www.oklahomacounty.org/assessor/SearchMethod.htm

Yes I have. If you own property you have a title or deed with your name on it. The title deed for Windsor Hills Baptist Church has Merle Thomas Vineyard the deed was signed over to him by James Allen Vineyard. There are no other names on the deed, which makes Tommy Boy the sole legal owner of the property at 5517 NW 23rd.

The county assessor page does not give any information on ownership of tax exempt property.

 

[bgwilkinson]

Well here is all the property that comes up for Windsor Hills Baptist Church.

Owner Name Search Results

Screen Produced 6/26/2014 8:45:43 PM

Account # Property Type Owner Name Physical Address
R145447530 Exempt WINDSOR HILLS BAPTIST CHURCH
R145447541 Exempt WINDSOR HILLS BAPTIST CHURCH 5517 NW 23RD ST
R145447680 Exempt WINDSOR HILLS BAPTIST CHURCH
R145448800 Exempt WINDSOR HILLS BAPTIST CHURCH
R145448940 Exempt WINDSOR HILLS BAPTIST CHURCH 2414 N MOULTON DR
R145449220 Exempt WINDSOR HILLS BAPTIST CHURCH 5635 NW 23RD ST
R140367000 Exempt WINDSOR HILLS BAPTIST CHURCH 5515 NW 23RD ST
R140361000 Exempt WINDSOR HILLS BAPTIST CHURCH
R145449225 Exempt WINDSOR HILLS BAPTIST CHURCH 5633 NW 23RD ST
R145448945 Exempt WINDSOR HILLS BAPTIST CHURCH

If someone is interested to pay the 5.00 or more to the State of Oklahoma, they could get the corporation info.
I'm not going to do the work for you, only give you hints.

https://www.sos.ok.gov/corp/corpInformation.aspx?id=1400193035

OKLAHOMA CITY ** WINDSOR HILLS BAPTIST CHURCH
Details
Filing Number: 1400193035
Name Type: Legal Name
Status: In Existence
Corp type: Domestic Not For Profit Corporation Church
Jurisdiction: Oklahoma
Formation Date: 10 Dec 1957

If you want more it costs.


You can also get copies of all legal filings at your county court house.
This would include all mortgages and deeds.
They are probably an open book in the public records.
Probably everyone knows but the members.

We were in this situation at FBCH until just the last few years.

Like JH and Mrs. N divorce . It is public record in Lake County Indiana. In it JH basically validates his culpability in the divorce.

Very few FBCH members have ever bothered to look.

 

[TruthBearer]

Well here is all the property that comes up for Windsor Hills Baptist Church.

Owner Name Search Results

Screen Produced 6/26/2014 8:45:43 PM

Account # Property Type Owner Name Physical Address
R145447530 Exempt WINDSOR HILLS BAPTIST CHURCH
R145447541 Exempt WINDSOR HILLS BAPTIST CHURCH 5517 NW 23RD ST
R145447680 Exempt WINDSOR HILLS BAPTIST CHURCH
R145448800 Exempt WINDSOR HILLS BAPTIST CHURCH
R145448940 Exempt WINDSOR HILLS BAPTIST CHURCH 2414 N MOULTON DR
R145449220 Exempt WINDSOR HILLS BAPTIST CHURCH 5635 NW 23RD ST
R140367000 Exempt WINDSOR HILLS BAPTIST CHURCH 5515 NW 23RD ST
R140361000 Exempt WINDSOR HILLS BAPTIST CHURCH
R145449225 Exempt WINDSOR HILLS BAPTIST CHURCH 5633 NW 23RD ST
R145448945 Exempt WINDSOR HILLS BAPTIST CHURCH

If someone is interested to pay the 5.00 or more to the State of Oklahoma, they could get the corporation info.
I'm not going to do the work for you, only give you hints.

https://www.sos.ok.gov/corp/corpInformation.aspx?id=1400193035

OKLAHOMA CITY ** WINDSOR HILLS BAPTIST CHURCH
Details
Filing Number: 1400193035
Name Type: Legal Name
Status: In Existence
Corp type: Domestic Not For Profit Corporation Church
Jurisdiction: Oklahoma
Formation Date: 10 Dec 1957

If you want more it costs.


You can also get copies of all legal filings at your county court house.
This would include all mortgages and deeds.
They are probably an open book in the public records.
Probably everyone knows but the members.

We were in this situation at FBCH until just the last few years.

Like JH and Mrs. N divorce . It is public record in Lake County Indiana. In it JH basically validates his culpability in the divorce.

Very few FBCH members have ever bothered to look.

You can get all the information you posted here off the county assessors page. You can get more detailed information by doing a title search, and you don't have to pay $5.00 for access if you know the right people they will do it for free.

 

[bgwilkinson]

Well here is all the property that comes up for Windsor Hills Baptist Church.

Owner Name Search Results

Screen Produced 6/26/2014 8:45:43 PM

Account # Property Type Owner Name Physical Address
R145447530 Exempt WINDSOR HILLS BAPTIST CHURCH
R145447541 Exempt WINDSOR HILLS BAPTIST CHURCH 5517 NW 23RD ST
R145447680 Exempt WINDSOR HILLS BAPTIST CHURCH
R145448800 Exempt WINDSOR HILLS BAPTIST CHURCH
R145448940 Exempt WINDSOR HILLS BAPTIST CHURCH 2414 N MOULTON DR
R145449220 Exempt WINDSOR HILLS BAPTIST CHURCH 5635 NW 23RD ST
R140367000 Exempt WINDSOR HILLS BAPTIST CHURCH 5515 NW 23RD ST
R140361000 Exempt WINDSOR HILLS BAPTIST CHURCH
R145449225 Exempt WINDSOR HILLS BAPTIST CHURCH 5633 NW 23RD ST
R145448945 Exempt WINDSOR HILLS BAPTIST CHURCH

If someone is interested to pay the 5.00 or more to the State of Oklahoma, they could get the corporation info.
I'm not going to do the work for you, only give you hints.

https://www.sos.ok.gov/corp/corpInformation.aspx?id=1400193035

OKLAHOMA CITY ** WINDSOR HILLS BAPTIST CHURCH
Details
Filing Number: 1400193035
Name Type: Legal Name
Status: In Existence
Corp type: Domestic Not For Profit Corporation Church
Jurisdiction: Oklahoma
Formation Date: 10 Dec 1957

If you want more it costs.


You can also get copies of all legal filings at your county court house.
This would include all mortgages and deeds.
They are probably an open book in the public records.
Probably everyone knows but the members.

We were in this situation at FBCH until just the last few years.

Like JH and Mrs. N divorce . It is public record in Lake County Indiana. In it JH basically validates his culpability in the divorce.

Very few FBCH members have ever bothered to look.

You can get all the information you posted here off the county assessors page. You can get more detailed information by doing a title search, and you don't have to pay $5.00 for access if you know the right people they will do it for free.

Well there you go just trying to be helpful.

 

[Just me]

Well there you go just trying to be helpful.

Soothing your guilt for sending him to us I see