When did you notice the "downfall" beginning?

[RAIDER]

Each one of us on the HAC FFF has our own feelings and stories from our time at FBCH and HAC.  I'm sure most of us can remember a time when we felt things were going great and we were behind the program.  I believe we can all agree that somewhere along the way things started to slip.  It may have been while we were at FBCH/HAC.  It may have been after we were gone.  Here is the question for the OP - At what time did you notice things starting to fall?  Is there an event to which you can point?  What year was it? 

 

[RAIDER]

FBCH/HAC were booming while I was a student.  The college enrollment was high.  The auditorium at FBCH was full.  The mezzanine was built to hold the overflow.  People were being saved and baptized.  HAC grads were going into full time Christian service.  Pastor's School, the Christian Womanhood Spectacular, and Youth Conference were the highlight of the IFB world.  During my time I saw nothing but forward movement.

 

[cast.sheep]

I think the answer depends on how old you are.  You and I are around the same age.  I first noticed it in 1989.  I was consumed with having children and rearing them at that time. I knew nothing about "The Battle" until a high-profile staff wife pulled me aside and told me the whole story.  They left later that year.  I was absolutely dumbfounded at what she told me.  And I simply could NOT believe it.  Like you, we were there in the heyday and it was all good until 1989.  At that point we were told not to read anything negative or believe any of the lies being told.  But, some high-profile people left...in groups.  I had a hard time reconciling that high-profile people were leaving over untruths.  Just didn't seem right to me. Nothing was the same after that.  A lot of the preaching was about loyalty to Bro. Hyles and FBCH.  Somewhere in there the whole A.V. Ballenger thing happened and it just seemed to go downhill from there.

 

[RAIDER]

I observed FBCH/HAC from a distance after I graduated.  I visited from time-to-time and attended several Pastor's Schools.  When the Nischik scandal started I wondered what would happen.  From a distance it seemed that the church and college both survived and continued to be strong.  All three of the conferences continued strong.

When Schaap first took the pastorate I believe a lot of people were wanting things to work.  The critics had always said that when Jack Hyles died FBCH would run under 1000 within 2 years.  From a distance Schaap seemed to be handling the new position fairly well. 

I'm not sure the exact year, but I started to notice a pride problem with Schaap.  It was shortly after this that I started noticing dumb, unbiblical statements in his preaching.  His thought pattern became more and more bizarre.  It reached a point a few years before his fall where I wondered, "How in the world can these staff people continue to support this man?"

 

[bgwilkinson]

I observed FBCH/HAC from a distance after I graduated.  I visited from time-to-time and attended several Pastor's Schools.  When the Nischik scandal started I wondered what would happen.  From a distance it seemed that the church and college both survived and continued to be strong.  All three of the conferences continued strong.

When Schaap first took the pastorate I believe a lot of people were wanting things to work.  The critics had always said that when Jack Hyles died FBCH would run under 1000 within 2 years.  From a distance Schaap seemed to be handling the new position fairly well. 

I'm not sure the exact year, but I started to notice a pride problem with Schaap.  It was shortly after this that I started noticing dumb, unbiblical statements in his preaching.  His thought pattern became more and more bizarre.  It reached a point a few years before his fall where I wondered, "How in the world can these staff people continue to support this man?"

Schaap was their lunch ticket, while many believed they had to protect their retirement plan, they were mistaken as the retirement plan was only smoke and mirrors.

 

[Smellin Coffee]

I grew up watching the ship wreck itself and not realizing that was what was happening. I had heard the Dave rumors for many years but just shook it off as "gossip to bring down the man of God." When his gallivanting at Miller Road was verified, my eyes started to open. It wasn't long after that I found the bug in my dad's office and that is when I decided I needed to question EVERYTHING.

 

[Ex-Fundy]

Sometime through my college years it wasn't sitting well at all with me regarding their hyper-focus on "loyalty" and the insanity of rabid KJVO. Then, shortly after Schaap was installed as Fuhrer his narcissism was ramping up to all new levels and enough was enough. Read Voyle Glover's book after that and the rest is history my friends!

I've gotta say though, that it is nothing short of brainwashing when you're caught up in that culture as looking back I cannot for the life of me figure out why I didn't notice these things and proceed to blow the proverbial lid off of it. Sigh.

 

[cast.sheep]

I grew up watching the ship wreck itself and not realizing that was what was happening. I had heard the Dave rumors for many years but just shook it off as "gossip to bring down the man of God." When his gallivanting at Miller Road was verified, my eyes started to open. It wasn't long after that I found the bug in my dad's office and that is when I decided I needed to question EVERYTHING.

WHAT???????  What were they looking for? Who put it there?

 

[Ex-Fundy]

I grew up watching the ship wreck itself and not realizing that was what was happening. I had heard the Dave rumors for many years but just shook it off as "gossip to bring down the man of God." When his gallivanting at Miller Road was verified, my eyes started to open. It wasn't long after that I found the bug in my dad's office and that is when I decided I needed to question EVERYTHING.

WHAT???????  What were they looking for?

Evidence of disloyalty is my best guess.

Are you familiar with the story of the Hyles-bots who were so worked up about his so-called enemies that they broke into George and Marilyn Godfrey's home and stole his honorary doctorate which he received from Hyles? I'm sure he doesn't miss it at all, but this is the kind of crap that went on under Hyles' watch.

 

[RAIDER]

I grew up watching the ship wreck itself and not realizing that was what was happening. I had heard the Dave rumors for many years but just shook it off as "gossip to bring down the man of God." When his gallivanting at Miller Road was verified, my eyes started to open. It wasn't long after that I found the bug in my dad's office and that is when I decided I needed to question EVERYTHING.

Do you remember what year this was?

 

[RAIDER]

Sometime through my college years it wasn't sitting well at all with me regarding their hyper-focus on "loyalty" and the insanity of rabid KJVO. Then, shortly after Schaap was installed as Fuhrer his narcissism was ramping up to all new levels and enough was enough. Read Voyle Glover's book after that and the rest is history my friends!

I've gotta say though, that it is nothing short of brainwashing when you're caught up in that culture as looking back I cannot for the life of me figure out why I didn't notice these things and proceed to blow the proverbial lid off of it. Sigh.

Do you remember what year this was?

 

[cast.sheep]

I grew up watching the ship wreck itself and not realizing that was what was happening. I had heard the Dave rumors for many years but just shook it off as "gossip to bring down the man of God." When his gallivanting at Miller Road was verified, my eyes started to open. It wasn't long after that I found the bug in my dad's office and that is when I decided I needed to question EVERYTHING.

WHAT???????  What were they looking for?

Evidence of disloyalty is my best guess.

Are you familiar with the story of the Hyles-bots who were so worked up about his so-called enemies that they broke into George and Marilyn Godfrey's home and stole his honorary doctorate which he received from Hyles? I'm sure he doesn't miss it at all, but this is the kind of crap that went on under Hyles' watch.

I think I may have heard this sometime or another.  Do they/you know who exactly did that? 

 

[Ex-Fundy]

I am not certain. The Godfreys may know by now possibly, but I doubt that they care much at this point.

If I had to guess I'd say it was just one of the rank and file Hyles-bots.

 

[RAIDER]

I am not certain. The Godfreys may know by now possibly, but I doubt that they care much at this point.

If I had to guess I'd say it was just one of the rank and file Hyles-bots.

And with all the idiots........I mean Hackers that were around it is highly possible that Dr. Hyles knew nothing of it.

 

[Ex-Fundy]

It is possible, but how can he escape some blame in light of the fact that he helped create those monsters?

 

[RAIDER]

It is possible, but how can he escape some blame in light of the fact that he helped create those monsters?

The blind loyalty preaching created many a moron in Hammond.

 

[Smellin Coffee]

I grew up watching the ship wreck itself and not realizing that was what was happening. I had heard the Dave rumors for many years but just shook it off as "gossip to bring down the man of God." When his gallivanting at Miller Road was verified, my eyes started to open. It wasn't long after that I found the bug in my dad's office and that is when I decided I needed to question EVERYTHING.

Do you remember what year this was?

I believe it was about '85 or '86.

 

[Smellin Coffee]

I grew up watching the ship wreck itself and not realizing that was what was happening. I had heard the Dave rumors for many years but just shook it off as "gossip to bring down the man of God." When his gallivanting at Miller Road was verified, my eyes started to open. It wasn't long after that I found the bug in my dad's office and that is when I decided I needed to question EVERYTHING.

WHAT???????  What were they looking for? Who put it there?

Never did figure it out. Don't have time to post the story but it was at my dad's office at Baptist City. I will share the details later when I get the time.

 

[nightbusheretic14]

I was in college when FBC had no pastor and Lapina was running the show. Everything started to get lame once my Senior year came. It all became monotonous and I just wanted to be home. I do miss my friends that I made there and I defenitly do not miss taking a shower there or going to an unflushed toilet. I love having my own bathroom again. Anyways I was actually hoping the college would shut down that year everyone was getting laid off and Lapina was in charge.

 

[Fresh Air]

The last good Pastor's School under Schaap was the one on prayer, 2008 maybe? I went to one after that and I heard so much philosophy, pragmatism, and man worship that I couldn't stomach it anymore. I was also very grieved by the increasing embrace of contemporary Christianity. Not long after I had it privately confirmed to me by someone I trusted that JS was using foul language. I stopped taking my church, having tour groups, etc. I was done.

...that's the short answer.  The long answer is probably more along the lines of a gradual awakening to the importance of hermeneutics, and the dangers of pride combined with an ever-increasing concern for Schaap's contemporary direction. The last book of his I bought/read was the one about which direction we are going. I read it, said to myself, 'I ain't goin' in your direction, buddy' and threw it in the trash.