Demons and demon possession

[Gringo]

I rarely come here but I have some legitmate questions and I was hoping to get some input:

As you may or may not know, Greg Locke, has created a movie about demon possession and recently showed it in many theaters where supposedly many people were "delivered". In thinking about demons and demon possession:

Those of you that might remember me from years past will probably realize that I'm not convinced at all of demons but I AM interested to know what the Bible teaches about them. Because,
this man puts all the emphasis on deliverance and no emphasis on what happens to the demons once they are expelled. Isn't there a story in the Bible where they needed somewhere or go after being expelled and so they ended up in a bunch of pigs - who drowned. Did the demons ALSO drown? I'm being serious.

1. Can demons reproduce or are there the same amount of demons today as there were when they were expelled from heaven? Give me verses, please.
2. Can demons die or are all demons living today that were alive at their expulsion? Give me verses, please.
3. MUST demons have someone to reside in or can they just float around? Give me verses, please.
4. Is it true that demons can reside in someone who also has the Holy Spirit residing in them (as Locke says)? And if so, what good is the Holy Spirit? Verses please.

When these people were "delivered" from their demon possession in these theaters the other day, WHERE did the demons then go? WHAT happened to them? If they just entered other people, then what good was this event if other people are now possessed that WEREN'T possessed?

And also, if demons can enter a mortal person without asking that person, WHY must they obey another mortal person when that person commands them to come out?

Thanks

 

[Dr. Huk-N-Duck]

Those of you that might remember me from years past will probably realize that I'm not convinced at all of demons but I AM interested to know what the Bible teaches about them.

Are you not a Christian then? The Bible is very clear about this, so not sure why you’d question.

 

[ALAYMAN]

Are you not a Christian then? The Bible is very clear about this, so not sure why you’d question.

Gringo is/was an agnostic formerly acquainted with the fundy environment of Tennessee Temple (Roberson era).

Gringo:
And also, if demons can enter a mortal person without asking that person, WHY must they obey another mortal person when that person commands them to come out?

Gringo, those queries are interesting, but they they ask questions that the passage about demons entering pigs isn’t really trying to answer.

 

[Dr. Huk-N-Duck]

Gringo is/was an agnostic formerly acquainted with the fundy environment of Tennessee Temple (Roberson era).

Well, that helps clear things up then. Ironically, his tsunami of questions concerning demonic activity tend to foretell his belief in them. On a similar note, I recall taking a psychology class once with a non-believer professor who admitted he entered the field not believing in demons, but today doesn’t rule out their existence. Essentially, he went from an atheist to an agnostic because of the fact that in his field of study, he’d encountered patients who exhibited symptoms that couldn’t be explained without looking to the supernatural.

 

[abcaines]

A recurring phrase in you post is: "give me verses, please." "Verses" are just as available to you as they are to me. In Matthew 22 The Saducees are chided for not knowing the Scriptures. BTW, in answer to your first question, Jesus plainly tells them in this passage, that in the resurrection, humans will become like angels in that they do not marry or are given in marriage, suggesting no ability to procreate.

Rather than being fed "verses", you would be better served if you took on the work of searching the Scriptures for yourself. The main advantage is that you would own the knowledge in PROPER context rather than it being spoon fed to you. I could give you verses but if you aren't interested in doing the work of searching the Scriptures for yourself, I highly doubt you'd care to read what I type in trying to provide the context. It would be lengthy.

Here is a link which does an excellent job of giving you a springboard into searching out the answers for yourself.

https://www.gotquestions.org/one-third-angels.html

PS... You do well to remember that satisfaction of your curiosity about demons is not the only purpose of the Scriptures.

 

[Baptist Renegade]

I rarely come here but I have some legitmate questions and I was hoping to get some input:

As you may or may not know, Greg Locke, has created a movie about demon possession and recently showed it in many theaters where supposedly many people were "delivered". In thinking about demons and demon possession:

Those of you that might remember me from years past will probably realize that I'm not convinced at all of demons but I AM interested to know what the Bible teaches about them. Because,
this man puts all the emphasis on deliverance and no emphasis on what happens to the demons once they are expelled. Isn't there a story in the Bible where they needed somewhere or go after being expelled and so they ended up in a bunch of pigs - who drowned. Did the demons ALSO drown? I'm being serious.

1. Can demons reproduce or are there the same amount of demons today as there were when they were expelled from heaven? Give me verses, please.
2. Can demons die or are all demons living today that were alive at their expulsion? Give me verses, please.
3. MUST demons have someone to reside in or can they just float around? Give me verses, please.
4. Is it true that demons can reside in someone who also has the Holy Spirit residing in them (as Locke says)? And if so, what good is the Holy Spirit? Verses please.

When these people were "delivered" from their demon possession in these theaters the other day, WHERE did the demons then go? WHAT happened to them? If they just entered other people, then what good was this event if other people are now possessed that WEREN'T possessed?

And also, if demons can enter a mortal person without asking that person, WHY must they obey another mortal person when that person commands them to come out?

Thanks

Gringo, it's been quite a while since I have seen you around! Hope things are well for you these days!

I don't really have time to dig around and find a bunch of scripture references but I will give you this for your consideration:

Matthew 12:43-45 When the unclean spirit is gone out of a man, he walketh through dry places, seeking rest, and findeth none. Then he saith, I will return into my house from whence I came out; and when he is come, he findeth it empty, swept, and garnished. Then goeth he, and taketh with himself seven other spirits more wicked than himself, and they enter in and dwell there: and the last state of that man is worse than the first. Even so shall it be also unto this wicked generation.​

Based upon this passage, we understand that a demon desires some place in which to inhabit. We also understand the role and purpose of demons which are to seduce, deceive, and generally wreak havoc (1 Tim 4:1). We read that it is Satan's desire to "Blind the minds of them that believe not" (2 Cor 4:4) in order to keep them from the truth. Man's sinful, fallen nature causes him to run from (not towards) God and to seek any other "Answer" or "Truth" besides the things which God has revealed and is clearly seen (Rom 1:20). An good example of this is found in Lee Stroebel's book "Case for Christ" where reading his story, you understand that he was not looking for a "Reason to Believe" but for any and every possible reason NOT TO BELIEVE and to remain in spiritual darkness! This is the nature of mankind who is dead in trespasses and sin (Eph 2:1) and who HATE THE LIGHT and prefer to remain in the dark (Jn 3:19)! All the irrational hatred towards anything having to do with God, with moral and religious values are quite often the result of demonic influences where "Good is called evil and evil is called good" (Isa 5:20). Notice how society despises any sort of moral absolutes and people openly mock such moral virtues because they are considered "Judeo-Christian" in their origin? Fact of the matter is, it is not just "Judeo-Christian" but is something that is hard-wired in every human being whether they wish to acknowledge or not: that is, the "moral compass" of the human conscience! You cannot escape it and even if you have never been exposed to the word of God, your very conscience tells you that there is someone bigger and greater than yourself and that you are in "Deep Tata" with him!

People are quite obsessed with demons and men like Greg Locke have capitalized upon this because "Sensationalism attracts a crowd" and attention is something they crave. A Christian need not be so obsessed with demons and unclean spirits. All they have to do is submit themselves to God, resist the Devil, and he will flee from you (Jas 4:7)! Why even acknowledge or give him the time of day? I do not believe a demon could "Possess" one who is a Child of God who had the Holy Spirit dwelling inside him! God's word says "Greater is he that is in you than he that is in the world (1 Jn 4:4)

Hope this is a start anyway.

 

[abcaines]

Gringo, it's been quite a while since I have seen you around! Hope things are well for you these days!

I don't really have time to dig around and find a bunch of scripture references but I will give you this for your consideration:

Based upon this passage, we understand that a demon desires some place in which to inhabit. We also understand the role and purpose of demons which are to seduce, deceive, and generally wreak havoc (1 Tim 4:1). We read that it is Satan's desire to "Blind the minds of them that believe not" (2 Cor 4:4) in order to keep them from the truth. Man's sinful, fallen nature causes him to run from (not towards) God and to seek any other "Answer" or "Truth" besides the things which God has revealed and is clearly seen (Rom 1:20). An good example of this is found in Lee Stroebel's book "Case for Christ" where reading his story, you understand that he was not looking for a "Reason to Believe" but for any and every possible reason NOT TO BELIEVE and to remain in spiritual darkness! This is the nature of mankind who is dead in trespasses and sin (Eph 2:1) and who HATE THE LIGHT and prefer to remain in the dark (Jn 3:19)! All the irrational hatred towards anything having to do with God, with moral and religious values are quite often the result of demonic influences where "Good is called evil and evil is called good" (Isa 5:20). Notice how society despises any sort of moral absolutes and people openly mock such moral virtues because they are considered "Judeo-Christian" in their origin? Fact of the matter is, it is not just "Judeo-Christian" but is something that is hard-wired in every human being whether they wish to acknowledge or not: that is, the "moral compass" of the human conscience! You cannot escape it and even if you have never been exposed to the word of God, your very conscience tells you that there is someone bigger and greater than yourself and that you are in "Deep Tata" with him!

People are quite obsessed with demons and men like Greg Locke have capitalized upon this because "Sensationalism attracts a crowd" and attention is something they crave. A Christian need not be so obsessed with demons and unclean spirits. All they have to do is submit themselves to God, resist the Devil, and he will flee from you (Jas 4:7)! Why even acknowledge or give him the time of day? I do not believe a demon could "Possess" one who is a Child of God who had the Holy Spirit dwelling inside him! God's word says "Greater is he that is in you than he that is in the world (1 Jn 4:4)

Hope this is a start anyway.

Excellent job of scratching the surface.

 

[ALAYMAN]

Best advice I would give you in this scenario Gringo....don't look to Greg Locke as a credible authority on ANYTHING theological, lol.

 

[AverageJoe]

Best advice I would give you in this scenario Gringo....don't look to Greg Locke as a credible authority on ANYTHING theological, lol.

Nothing to laugh at when it comes to Greg Locke, ALAY! He's a false prophet and a jerk to boot!

 

[biscuit1953]

I rarely come here but I have some legitmate questions and I was hoping to get some input:

As you may or may not know, Greg Locke, has created a movie about demon possession and recently showed it in many theaters where supposedly many people were "delivered". In thinking about demons and demon possession:

Those of you that might remember me from years past will probably realize that I'm not convinced at all of demons but I AM interested to know what the Bible teaches about them. Because,
this man puts all the emphasis on deliverance and no emphasis on what happens to the demons once they are expelled. Isn't there a story in the Bible where they needed somewhere or go after being expelled and so they ended up in a bunch of pigs - who drowned. Did the demons ALSO drown? I'm being serious.

1. Can demons reproduce or are there the same amount of demons today as there were when they were expelled from heaven? Give me verses, please.
2. Can demons die or are all demons living today that were alive at their expulsion? Give me verses, please.
3. MUST demons have someone to reside in or can they just float around? Give me verses, please.
4. Is it true that demons can reside in someone who also has the Holy Spirit residing in them (as Locke says)? And if so, what good is the Holy Spirit? Verses please.

When these people were "delivered" from their demon possession in these theaters the other day, WHERE did the demons then go? WHAT happened to them? If they just entered other people, then what good was this event if other people are now possessed that WEREN'T possessed?

And also, if demons can enter a mortal person without asking that person, WHY must they obey another mortal person when that person commands them to come out?

Thanks

1. Can demons reproduce or are there the same amount of demons today as there were when they were expelled from heaven? I think the link given by abcaines was pretty good. https://www.gotquestions.org/one-third-angels.html
2. Can demons die or are all demons living today that were alive at their expulsion? Man is made a little lower than the angels (Hebrews 2:6-7). Men, just as angels are immortal beings made in the image of God, but men die physically and will live on after death and give an account to our Creator (Hebrews 9:27). Angels are not physical beings, but ministering spirits (Hebrews 1:14). Because of that angels don't die in the same sense men do.

The reason Jesus came into the world in the form of a man in the flesh was so he could suffer and die as a sacrifice for our sins, to taste death for every man (Hebrews 2:14). There is no redemption for angels who sin because they were created with full knowedge whereas we are born in sin (Psalm 51:5) and ignorance (1 Timothy 1:13).
3. MUST demons have someone to reside in or can they just float around? Once again, only men are physical beings. Angels can appear as men but don't have an actual physical body. Demons seek to dwell in bodies in order to control them but some day they will be damned just as men will after they are judged (Mark 8:29-32).
4. Is it true that demons can reside in someone who also has the Holy Spirit residing in them (as Locke says)? And if so, what good is the Holy Spirit? I really like the link abcaines gave at "Got Questions." This link I think answers this question. https://www.gotquestions.org/Christian-demon-possessed.html
5. When these people were "delivered" from their demon possession in these theaters the other day, WHERE did the demons then go? WHAT happened to them? And also, if demons can enter a mortal person without asking that person, WHY must they obey another mortal person when that person commands them to come out? This is where much of the deception is taking place today concerning demon possession. Jesus specifically gave the ability of casting out demons to only his disciples (His personally chosen apostles). In Matthew 10:1 "...he gave them power against unclean spirits, to cast them out, and to heal all manner of sickness and all manner of disease." No Christians today have that ability.
Mat 7:22-23 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity."
Paul proved his apostleship by having the signs of an apostle (2 Corinthians 12:12). In Acts 19:11-16 vagabond Jews saw the apostle Paul doing mighty miracles and attempted to cast out demons in the name of Jesus but were attacked and left naked and wounded. The reason the apostles were given these miraculous powers was to "confirm the word" (Mark 16:20). Throughout the book of Acts we see these signs, wonders and miracles fulfilled just as Jesus said in Mark 16. Jesus warned that in the last days "false Christs and false prophets shall rise, and shall shew signs and wonders, to seduce, if it were possible, even the elect" (Mark 13:22). It especially important all movements and religious leaders are judged according to Scripture.

I believe if someone is truly demon possessed today, they are delivered through prayer and the power of the gospel "which is the power of God unto salvation to every one who believes" (Romans 1:16).

 

[Gringo]

Thank you for your replies, especially Biscuit1953.

If someone came to me and asked me to explain to him how Chopin wrote his "Revolutionary Etude", I would take that as a compliment to me (that he felt like I would know and that he was trying to honor me) and I would attempt to explain it to him the best I could. I don't think I would tell him to find out for himself.

I think my record here (few posts in many years) shows that I am not here to fight with you and that I have a genuine interest. The Bible tells you to always have an answer ready to help the lesser and thank you Biscuit. I really appreciate it.

Thank you abCaines, for the link and to Baptist Renegade for your post.

As for Greg Locke . . . no one needs to warn me about him. I can assure you that I "have his number". At least Hyles attempted to hide his secretary, knowing he was in the wrong. This character FLAUNTS his divorce and remarriage all the while making money (now, probably lots) from his evangelical business. He seemingly has no remorse for his own disobedience to the "rule book" he preaches others to follow or, that he himself, is described in I Cor 6:9 along with others that he preaches about.

PS. . . I think this is the only place where I can say I am a member of "the elect"!! (see picture to the left - LOL)

 

[Dr. Huk-N-Duck]

I think my record here (few posts in many years) shows that I am not here to fight with you and that I have a genuine interest. The Bible tells you to always have an answer ready to help the lesser and thank you Biscuit. I really appreciate it.

It sounds to me like you probably know the Scriptures as well, if not better, than many of us here. Choosing to reject the Bible doesn’t make you ignorant of its message.

 

[voicecrying]

I think my record here (few posts in many years) shows that I am not here to fight with you and that I have a genuine interest. The Bible tells you to always have an answer ready to help the lesser and thank you Biscuit. I really appreciate it.

I always thought you conducted yourself much better than most on here (including previous iterations of the forum).

 

[ALAYMAN]

gringo, what is your interest in this particular subject, and why does Greg Locke’s opinion matter to you?

 

[Ekklesian]

And also, if demons can enter a mortal person without asking that person, WHY must they obey another mortal person when that person commands them to come out?

Thanks

It's only in the name of Jesus (in any linguistic iteration) that a mortal can command demons. They are not subject to the mortal, as the account of the sons of Sceva clearly demonstrates.

My main concern is your over-attention to demons. Why do they concern you so?

 

[Dr. Huk-N-Duck]

My main concern is your over-attention to demons. Why do they concern you so?

That was my original point: why would a guy who, supposedly, doesn’t believe in demons, be so concerned with them? (Something doesn’t add up.)

 

[Gringo]

I never said that I do NOT believe in demons. I said that I am not convinced. There is a difference. I'm quiet aware that I could be wrong and that there really could be life after death and a horrible fate awaiting me because of my lack of conviction on biblical issues. How ironic it is that in my past, I have asked Christ to apply his blood to my account and yet, because I'm not convinced that it's even necessary (no after life), that I still will meet an horrific fate.

I couldn't help but notice that the three people questioning my interest in this subject, are the three that did not attempt to help me with my questions. That's ok. I just wonder, if instead of demons, the subject of my post would have been: "Sirs, what must I do to be saved?", would you have told me to go find out for myself? Would you have asked me why I am interested in such a subject.

That you have treated my post so lightly, is your right and privilege. I clearly remember years ago when we non believers were chained and placed in the basement to await your occasional visit.

I was just trying to start a conversation about this frightening subject. I thought that some of you would have more of an interest in this subject than you seem to.

It's ok.

 

[biscuit1953]

I never said that I do NOT believe in demons. I said that I am not convinced. There is a difference. I'm quiet aware that I could be wrong and that there really could be life after death and a horrible fate awaiting me because of my lack of conviction on biblical issues. How ironic it is that in my past, I have asked Christ to apply his blood to my account and yet, because I'm not convinced that it's even necessary (no after life), that I still will meet an horrific fate.

I couldn't help but notice that the three people questioning my interest in this subject, are the three that did not attempt to help me with my questions. That's ok. I just wonder, if instead of demons, the subject of my post would have been: "Sirs, what must I do to be saved?", would you have told me to go find out for myself? Would you have asked me why I am interested in such a subject.

That you have treated my post so lightly, is your right and privilege. I clearly remember years ago when we non believers were chained and placed in the basement to await your occasional visit.

I was just trying to start a conversation about this frightening subject. I thought that some of you would have more of an interest in this subject than you seem to.

It's ok.

Gringo, the very fact that you are intererested in spiritual things show that you are no different than all the billions of people around the world. The most primitive tribes in the most remote locations realize that there is a Creator because they realize that the sunsets, flowers, birds, fish and everything around them could not just pop up out of nothing. They do sacrifices (even human ones) because God has put his law (the Ten Commandments) in their hearts (Romans 2:14-15). Because their conscience accuses them of violating a moral law that they know they have broken, every time they steal, commit adultery, lie etc, they try to atone for it somehow. They fear death and try to figure out some way to escape it.

Jesus did not come into the world to condemn the world because we are already condemned (John 3:18). We die because we are a sinful race and will be damned by our works (Revelation 20:12). Its like someone asking a criminal on death row why he is there. He will say the reason he is there is because the governor will not give him a pardon, but won't say anything about the rape and murder he committed which is the real reason he is there. The whole human race is guilty of death and God, like a righteous judge who has no desire to sentence anyone to death (2 Peter 3:9), must do so because he is a just Judge. God so loved the world that he gave His only begotten Son so that whosoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life (John 3:16).

I encourage you to go to youtube and type in "THE TALIABO STORY" which comes in four parts. It will show you how a remote tribe that had never seen a white man found redemption through the gospel message. They waited for the one who had taken eternal life from Taliabo to come back. Its a wonderful true story.

 

[ALAYMAN]

I never said that I do NOT believe in demons. I said that I am not convinced. There is a difference. I'm quiet aware that I could be wrong and that there really could be life after death and a horrible fate awaiting me because of my lack of conviction on biblical issues. How ironic it is that in my past, I have asked Christ to apply his blood to my account and yet, because I'm not convinced that it's even necessary (no after life), that I still will meet an horrific fate.

I couldn't help but notice that the three people questioning my interest in this subject, are the three that did not attempt to help me with my questions. That's ok. I just wonder, if instead of demons, the subject of my post would have been: "Sirs, what must I do to be saved?", would you have told me to go find out for myself? Would you have asked me why I am interested in such a subject.

That you have treated my post so lightly, is your right and privilege. I clearly remember years ago when we non believers were chained and placed in the basement to await your occasional visit.

I was just trying to start a conversation about this frightening subject. I thought that some of you would have more of an interest in this subject than you seem to.

It's ok.

What kind of evidence about Christ would convince you enough to place your faith in Him as the Son of God?

 

[Dr. Huk-N-Duck]

I never said that I do NOT believe in demons. I said that I am not convinced. There is a difference. I'm quiet aware that I could be wrong and that there really could be life after death and a horrible fate awaiting me because of my lack of conviction on biblical issues.

Well, there’s not much left to say then, is there? You’ve had the privilege of hearing the Gospel, and from what I understand, even attending a Christian college. If you choose to either reject it or be laissez-faire concerning it, that’s your decision.