Jeremy Whitman Lancaster Baptist Church Does anyone know anything about this?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Mamabella
  • Start date Start date
rsc2a said:
[quote author=ItinerantPreacher][quote author=rsc2a]When did we change the topic to preachers and their sermon delivery methods?
Click to expand...

Lol. Best belly chuckle of the day.[/quote]

The industry that he makes money from is the industry that feeds on sensationalism. I did not say the things he reports on never happened at all, but they gain greater exposure by the use of sensationalism. - ItinerantPreacher

You're denying that the above isn't an accurate description of how many pastors build their sermons and/or minstries?
[/quote]

Many? Yes, I suppose I deny that. Some? No, I do not deny that some do. (Truth be told I mistook your response for sarcasm. Normally my sarcasm button is stuck in the on position)
 
Even though my brain is engaged, I simply cannot follow this thread. It is making my head spin.

Prophet, your story makes me so sad. And frustrated. I will NEVER NEVER understand why things are not different. Why perpetrators around here are protected while victims are shunned or worse.

This is exactly the scenario as when the grade school boy committed suicide due to being bullied so badly at HB. Instead of embracing the family of the deceased, instead of weeping with and loving the family, a campaign to impugn them was set in motion. "You know, there were problems in the family before all of this..."was the main talking point that was supposed to get around. The sister of the deceased was called in to the office and they tried to coerce her to change her story of the situation.

I will NEVER NEVER NEVER understand the evil that is embedded in this place.

I cannot not trust a motive or an action or a statement. I simply cannot. JW likes to refer to pastors, and especially missionaries, as they who are "punching holes in the darkness." I'd like to see someone punch a hole in the darkness that envelopes this place.

I could say more on the above, but hearing prophet's story just brought a lot of feelings to the surface. And the story of the baby...and what Ray Young said...evil is the only way to describe this. Evil, evil, evil, and more evil.

But I cannot follow this thread. BALAAM, who was the person in jail JH went to see? I did not get that. Was I the only one?

 
ItinerantPreacher said:
[quote author=BinacaChugger]
However, I wish like crazy that people who only had a good supposition would have spoken up before so many were hurt and decades later........  There is a way to address these issues without causing irreparable damage to a good testimony.
Click to expand...

Seems I am not the one flip flopping.
[/quote]

um....... ???  You said no one who only had a good supposition should speak up.  I agreed that people should not make things up out of anger and ruin a reputation, but wished that people who only had a good supposition would have spoken up before so many were hurt.

You just don't get it.  You don't understand what others have gone through and rather than trying to understand, you criticize.  Rather than acknowledge, you defer the accusation and change the subject.  You want to feel for others and you feel competent because of what your family went through, but you don't understand the megachurch dynamic.  Be thankful that you don't, but stop criticizing those who are there.
 
brainisengaged said:
Even though my brain is engaged, I simply cannot follow this thread. It is making my head spin.

Prophet, your story makes me so sad. And frustrated. I will NEVER NEVER understand why things are not different. Why perpetrators around here are protected while victims are shunned or worse.

This is exactly the scenario as when the grade school boy committed suicide due to being bullied so badly at HB. Instead of embracing the family of the deceased, instead of weeping with and loving the family, a campaign to impugn them was set in motion. "You know, there were problems in the family before all of this..."was the main talking point that was supposed to get around. The sister of the deceased was called in to the office and they tried to coerce her to change her story of the situation.

I will NEVER NEVER NEVER understand the evil that is embedded in this place.

I cannot not trust a motive or an action or a statement. I simply cannot. JW likes to refer to pastors, and especially missionaries, as they who are "punching holes in the darkness." I'd like to see someone punch a hole in the darkness that envelopes this place.

I could say more on the above, but hearing prophet's story just brought a lot of feelings to the surface. And the story of the baby...and what Ray Young said...evil is the only way to describe this. Evil, evil, evil, and more evil.

But I cannot follow this thread. BALAAM, who was the person in jail JH went to see? I did not get that. Was I the only one?
Click to expand...

The person the JH went to see was Prophet. Sorry for not making it clear

And no, BC I was not glad that he died as I am sure you know. After spending years enamored with the man and the system I began to see on a pesonal level that all was not what JH deemed everything to be.
 
Ok, BALAAM, I think I get it. The picture that was painted for us was of the magnificent great man who stooped down to the jail to reach out to the wayward one...yet when this troubled soul had come to him for counsel, comfort, and justice -- he met quite a different response than the public one.

 
brainisengaged said:
Ok, BALAAM, I think I get it. The picture that was painted for us was of the magnificent great man who stooped down to the jail to reach out to the wayward one...yet when this troubled soul had come to him for counsel, comfort, and justice -- he met quite a different response than the public one.
Click to expand...

Yes, and it is very possible after hearing this story that he would not have been in that situation if JH was as concerned with the one as he was with the masses.
 
[quote author=ItinerantPreacher]I do not believe that Biblically I am required to forgive someone until they seek forgiveness. Here is my reasoning albeit in a nutshell. God does not forgive me until I seek repentance. I am incapable of doing something God does not do Himself.[/quote]

God showed His love for us, in that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us....
 
rsc2a said:
[quote author=ItinerantPreacher]I do not believe that Biblically I am required to forgive someone until they seek forgiveness. Here is my reasoning albeit in a nutshell. God does not forgive me until I seek repentance. I am incapable of doing something God does not do Himself.
Click to expand...

God showed His love for us, in that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us....
[/quote]

This verse shows love, not forgiveness.
 
Love keeps no record of wrongs...

Love is not forgiveness.  It is forgiveness and a lot of other things combined.
 
rsc2a said:
Love keeps no record of wrongs...

Love is not forgiveness.  It is forgiveness and a lot of other things combined.
Click to expand...

So, only three English versions remotely support you. The NIV, The Voice and The Message.

Universal Salvation. No hell, because love doesn't keep score.

Except that this theory is contradicted by the balance of scripture.
 
Dear Itinerant Preacher ~. I tried to send you a message, but the system keeps goofing up.  I, too, am a pastor & somewhat involved in this tragedy.  I would like to talk with you privately, if you'll email me?  My name is Roy Payne & my email is:

rjepayne@yahoo.com

Hope to hear back from you soon.

Yours In Christ,

Roy
 
ItinerantPreacher said:
rsc2a said:
Love keeps no record of wrongs...

Love is not forgiveness.  It is forgiveness and a lot of other things combined.
Click to expand...

So, only three English versions remotely support you. The NIV, The Voice and The Message.
Click to expand...

What in the world are you talking about?

Oh, and lest we forget...

Forgive our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us...

[quote author=ItinerantPreacher]Universal Salvation. No hell, because love doesn't keep score.

Except that this theory is contradicted by the balance of scripture.[/quote]

I haven't made this connection either way. If you feel that is what pre-emptive forgiveness has to look like, then I suggest you change your views on salvation because the Bible is clear that while we were still enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of His Son...
 
As far as the topic of "forgiveness" goes, Jesus admonished Peter to forgive multiple times in a day, indicating there existed no attitude of repentance.  Jesus asked God to forgive those who crucified Him when they were not seeking forgiveness.  Same goes for Stephen when he was being stoned.  I forgive others, not because it helps them, but rather for the good it does my own soul.  It removes the burden of bitterness that acts as a cancer in my heart.  Mark 11:25 "And when ye stand praying, forgive ..."
 
Roy Payne said:
As far as the topic of "forgiveness" goes, Jesus admonished Peter to forgive multiple times in a day, indicating there existed no attitude of repentance.  Jesus asked God to forgive those who crucified Him when they were not seeking forgiveness.  Same goes for Stephen when he was being stoned.  I forgive others, not because it helps them, but rather for the good it does my own soul.  It removes the burden of bitterness that acts as a cancer in my heart.  Mark 11:25 "And when ye stand praying, forgive ..."
Click to expand...

Welcome to the forum!
Some here are a little sensitive when the words bitter or bitterness are used.  :)
 
Tarheel Baptist said:
Roy Payne said:
As far as the topic of "forgiveness" goes, Jesus admonished Peter to forgive multiple times in a day, indicating there existed no attitude of repentance.  Jesus asked God to forgive those who crucified Him when they were not seeking forgiveness.  Same goes for Stephen when he was being stoned.  I forgive others, not because it helps them, but rather for the good it does my own soul.  It removes the burden of bitterness that acts as a cancer in my heart.  Mark 11:25 "And when ye stand praying, forgive ..."
Click to expand...

Welcome to the forum!
Some here are a little sensitive when the words bitter or bitterness are used.  :)
Click to expand...



Maybe is has to do with the fact that many of those who commit abuse use those words to diminish and discredit their victims.
 
Sorry ... not used to dealing with hyper-sensitive people.  In my defense, I used the term "bitterness" in reference to myself, so I fail to see how any clear-thinking person could possibly be offended.
 
prophet    God has done a work in your heart....I cried reading your post. I've never trusted man they will change but God never changes. Thank you for helping me get home when I had nothing...I've learned until you're in those situations you really have no clue how to help others....may God continue to watch over you and your family
 
ItinerantPreacher said:
rsc2a said:
[quote author=ItinerantPreacher]I do not believe that Biblically I am required to forgive someone until they seek forgiveness. Here is my reasoning albeit in a nutshell. God does not forgive me until I seek repentance. I am incapable of doing something God does not do Himself.
Click to expand...

God showed His love for us, in that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us....
Click to expand...

This verse shows love, not forgiveness.
[/quote]

“And when you stand praying, if you hold anything against anyone, forgive him, so that your Father in heaven may forgive you your sins" (Mark 11:25).

“For if you forgive men when they sin against you, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. But if you do not forgive men their sins, your Father will not forgive your sins” (Matthew 6:14-15).

"Do not judge, and you will not be judged. Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven. Give, and it will be given to you. A good measure, pressed down, shaken together and running over, will be poured into your lap. For with the measure you use, it will be measured to you" (Luke 6:37-38).

“When they came to the place called the Skull, there they crucified him, along with the criminals—one on his right, the other on his left. Jesus said, ‘Father, forgive them, for they do not know what they are doing.’

"When came Peter to him, and said, Lord, how oft shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? till seven times? Jesus saith unto him, I say not unto thee, Until seven times: but, Until seventy times seven."

"Judge not, and ye shall not be judged: condemn not, and ye shall not be condemned: forgive, and ye shall be forgiven:"

"And forgive us our sins; for we also forgive every one that is indebted to us. And lead us not into temptation; but deliver us from evil."
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top