"Preacher Boy" free labor.....

Tarheel Baptist

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So you've moved on from the "Senior" position? I'm sure you're still the leader regardless of what they call you.

No. It is not. The context is judging a dispute between two members of the family of God. The "court reference" is Paul's attempt to keep them out of court. It doesn't change the fact of handling disputes properly. We are disputing the Scriptures. Which is what happened in the council that took place in Acts 15.

I understand hermeneutics just fine. You need to abandon tradition. We can discuss this at the meeting.

Whatever that means.
You don't understand much of anything from what I've experienced, hermeneutics is just illustrative of said ignorance.
And, you are one of the last people I'd invite to speak before any group of Believers.
Thou art a proud, arrogant, ignorant Pharisee.

A hearty, IFB's treasure, Haymaan!
 

treasure_unseen

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You don't understand much of anything from what I've experienced, hermeneutics is just illustrative of said ignorance.
And, you are one of the last people I'd invite to speak before any group of Believers.
At the very least, you can call me names and make fun of the sincerity of my appeal. That will make you feel better about yourself.

Thou art a proud, arrogant, ignorant Pharisee.
Okay. You can call me that too. You're being a little cowardly.

A hearty, IFB's treasure, Haymaan!
What does that mean?
 

tmjbog

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No. It is not. The context is judging a dispute between two members of the family of God. The "court reference" is Paul's attempt to keep them out of court. It doesn't change the fact of handling disputes properly. We are disputing the Scriptures. Which is what happened in the council that took place in Acts 15.
It's not in the context of believers taking each other to court? Law is mentioned 5 times, court twice, and lawsuit once-or are those all bad translations as well. Paul ends with "Why not rather be defrauded...". How does a dispute about Scripture end in one being "defrauded". You are twisting this one so hard that Jack Hyles himself would be jealous.



6:1 Does any one of you, when he has a case against his neighbor, dare to go to law before the unrighteous and not before the saints? 2 Or do you not know that the saints will judge the world? If the world is judged by you, are you not competent to constitute the smallest law courts? 3 Do you not know that we will judge angels? How much more matters of this life? 4 So if you have law courts dealing with matters of this life, do you appoint them as judges who are of no account in the church? 5 I say this to your shame. Is it so, that there is not among you one wise man who will be able to decide between his brethren, 6 but brother goes to law with brother, and that before unbelievers?
7 Actually, then, it is already a defeat for you, that you have lawsuits with one another. Why not rather be wronged? Why not rather be defrauded? 8 On the contrary, you yourselves wrong and defraud. You do this even to your brethren.
 

treasure_unseen

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It's not in the context of believers taking each other to court? Law is mentioned 5 times, court twice, and lawsuit once-or are those all bad translations as well. Paul ends with "Why not rather be defrauded...". How does a dispute about Scripture end in one being "defrauded". You are twisting this one so hard that Jack Hyles himself would be jealous.

6:1 Does any one of you, when he has a case against his neighbor, dare to go to law before the unrighteous and not before the saints? 2 Or do you not know that the saints will judge the world? If the world is judged by you, are you not competent to constitute the smallest law courts? 3 Do you not know that we will judge angels? How much more matters of this life? 4 So if you have law courts dealing with matters of this life, do you appoint them as judges who are of no account in the church? 5 I say this to your shame. Is it so, that there is not among you one wise man who will be able to decide between his brethren, 6 but brother goes to law with brother, and that before unbelievers?
7 Actually, then, it is already a defeat for you, that you have lawsuits with one another. Why not rather be wronged? Why not rather be defrauded? 8 On the contrary, you yourselves wrong and defraud. You do this even to your brethren.
Talk about missing the forest for the trees of tradition......

I know you went and found the translation that you prefer here. I'm not even going to go into its flaws. What you don't want to recognize is Paul's appeal to why the Saints of God are worthy to judge even the most trivial disputes.

1Co 6:3 Do you not know that we are to judge angels? How much more, then, matters pertaining to this life!

So. Based upon verse #3. Which is clear.... matters that pertain to this life are included. ALL matters. Also... pay real close attention to the word "angels".....I don't know what you think about angels........ but you'd be hard pressed to make an argument for civil cases toward angels.....

Not that it really matters to you. It doesn't. You didn't even make this argument until TB feed you the tradition..... and you ate it all up like a good follower....

Besides, Acts 15 is clear. Brothers were disputing what the Scriptures taught and they convened a council to judge the situation. You don't just get to hide behind what you claim. Good men, don't have problems proving themselves.

Which is what IFB leadership has been doing for decades. Hiding.....
 
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tmjbog

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Talk about missing the forest for the trees of tradition......

I know you went and found the translation that you prefer here. I'm not even going to go into its flaws. What you don't want to recognize is Paul's appeal to why the Saints of God are worthy to judge even the most trivial disputes.

1Co 6:3 Do you not know that we are to judge angels? How much more, then, matters pertaining to this life!

So. Based up verse #3. Which is clear.... matters that pertain to this life are included. ALL matters. Also... pay real close attention to the word "angels".....I don't know what you think about angels........ but you'd be hard pressed to take make an argument for civil cases toward angels.....
Yes, he is contrasting the point that if the saints are to judge large matters than they should not be going to the secular courts to sue the brethren. These verses have nothing to do with Scripture no matter how hard you twist. Law is mentioned 5 times, court twice, Lawsuit once.

Not responding to your conspiracy theories on what you have determined I do or don't believe.

Which is what IFB leadership has been doing for decades. Hiding.....
Always gotta deliver some of that hatred. As in most of your over generalizations, in some cases your right and in some your wrong.
 

treasure_unseen

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Yes, he is contrasting the point that if the saints are to judge large matters than they should not be going to the secular courts to sue the brethren. These verses have nothing to do with Scripture no matter how hard you twist. Law is mentioned 5 times, court twice, Lawsuit once.
Never once did you mention this and now you're an expert. Yeah right.

Those verses posted had "the" and "you" in them more times than "law, court and lawsuit." I've never judged the context of a passage by how many times a word is in them. Is that something new?

Geesh, You didn't even try to handle the fact that angels are mentioned and you can read "all matters" in verse #3. I mean seriously.... You want to claim I'm am the real IFB? You certainly are proving you're the best among them.

What about Acts 15? Why isn't that good enough for you?

Not responding to your conspiracy theories on what you have determined I do or don't believe.
Okay UGC. Just respond to whatever you want. Make something up if you can't find something.

Always gotta deliver some of that hatred. As in most of your over generalizations, in some cases your right and in some your wrong.
Hatred? Why are you including that nonsense over and over again?

I told I love you. God has the record. He knows I'm tell the truth. Why do you insist on lying about me?
 

tmjbog

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Never once did you mention this and now you're an expert. Yeah right.

Those verses posted had "the" and "you" in them more times than "law, court and lawsuit." I've never judged the context of a passage by how many times a word is in them. Is that something new?

Geesh, You didn't even try to handle the fact that angels are mentioned and you can read "all matters" in verse #3. I mean seriously.... You want to claim I'm am the real IFB? You certainly are proving you're the best among them.

What about Acts 15? Why isn't that good enough for you?
When was I supposed to mention it-didn't know I was on a deadline.

The and you are quite common words and probably won't go far in giving you an idea of what the verses are about. Hypothetically, though, lets say there is a verse that mentions law, lawsuit, court several times and does not mention Scripture once. Would you suspect the passage was talking about a legal matter or a debate on Scripture?

I did address the angel issue. Yes, that is specifically why they were not to go to the secular courts. If the saints were going to be judging huge matters than they should be capable of addressing small matters.
 

treasure_unseen

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When was I supposed to mention it-didn't know I was on a deadline.
You did more than not mention it. You said you would like to attend. Can you stop being so dishonest?

The and you are quite common words and probably won't go far in giving you an idea of what the verses are about. Hypothetically, though, lets say there is a verse that mentions law, lawsuit, court several times and does not mention Scripture once. Would you suspect the passage was talking about a legal matter or a debate on Scripture?
It just depend. Context is not built on how often similar words appear in a passage. Who knows, maybe you can start a trend of some sort. I don't think people are going to listen to you but they might. Who knows.

Besides I said I didn't accept your translation of choice. You choose it because it was convenient to your argument.

I did address the angel issue. Yes, that is specifically why they were not to go to the secular courts. If the saints were going to be judging huge matters than they should be capable of addressing small matters.
So huge matters and small matters don't add up to "all matters" in this life? Just like Paul said in verse #3?

No matter how you try, you just can't change Truth. Once you find it, it stands up to all scrutiny.

I'll ask the third time. Why are you ignoring Acts 15?
 

tmjbog

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You did more than not mention it. You said you would like to attend. Can you stop being so dishonest?
I'm not sure. First I have to figure out what I'm being dishonest about.

It just depend. Context is not built on how often similar words appear in a passage. Who knows, maybe you can start a trend of some sort. I don't think people are going to listen to you but they might. Who knows.
Actually that's how words work. For instance if their is an article about orange juice, typically you will find many instances of the words orange, juice, fruit. Not sure why they do it that way.

So huge matters and small matters don't add up to "all matters" in this life? Just like Paul said in verse #3?
Ok. You take that to include disputes on Scripture if you like. But since the verses are not concerning themselves with that there is no guidance on how to handle those disputes. Again the verses are dealing with letting the secular system handle a dispute between Christians.


I'll ask the third time. Why are you ignoring Acts 15?
Ok. What's your point on Acts? I was only dealing with the Scripture that you were taking out of context. What's do you think Acts 15 is saying?
 

treasure_unseen

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I'm not sure. First I have to figure out what I'm being dishonest about.
You know. Jesus will remind you soon.

Actually that's how words work. For instance if their is an article about orange juice, typically you will find many instances of the words orange, juice, fruit. Not sure why they do it that way.
Well. You certainly know how to read a newspaper. Scriptures... not so much.

If you go all the way back into Chapter 5. You'll find that what you appeal to is just a very small section of a larger appeal Paul makes concerning "judging" properly. Which includes Spiritual matters. Just like those at Berea, they shouldn't blindly accept just anything someone says. They were to effectively address the entirety of the subject matter.

1Co 5:1 It is actually reported that there is sexual immorality among you, and of a kind that is not tolerated even among pagans, for a man has his father's wife.
1Co 5:2 And you are arrogant! Ought you not rather to mourn? Let him who has done this be removed from among you.

1Co 5:11 But now I am writing to you not to associate with anyone who bears the name of brother if he is guilty of sexual immorality or greed, or is an idolater, reviler, drunkard, or swindler—not even to eat with such a one.
1Co 5:12 For what have I to do with judging outsiders? Is it not those inside the church whom you are to judge?

Hey. Don't believe what Paul said. Your life to face God with.

Ok. You take that to include disputes on Scripture if you like. But since the verses are not concerning themselves with that there is no guidance on how to handle those disputes. Again the verses are dealing with letting the secular system handle a dispute between Christians.
All matters is all matters. Angels are Spiritual beings and are judged by Spiritual things. The appeal is clear. You're just refusing to admit it.


Ok. What's your point on Acts? I was only dealing with the Scripture that you were taking out of context. What's do you think Acts 15 is saying?
No. You've been ignoring it. Now you act as if it doesn't say anything relative.

Go read it for yourself. I'm not feeding your delusion anymore. Maybe you haven't read it and have no idea what it says. After all, you're a novice and it shows terribly on you.
 
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tmjbog

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Well. You certain know how to read a newspaper. Scriptures... not so much.

If you go all the way back into Chapter 5. You'll find that what you appeal to is just a very small section of a larger appeal Paul makes concerning "judging" properly. Which includes Spiritual matters. Just like those at Berea, they shouldn't blindly accept just anything someone says. They were to effectively address the entirety of the subject matter.

1Co 5:1 It is actually reported that there is sexual immorality among you, and of a kind that is not tolerated even among pagans, for a man has his father's wife.
1Co 5:2 And you are arrogant! Ought you not rather to mourn? Let him who has done this be removed from among you.

1Co 5:11 But now I am writing to you not to associate with anyone who bears the name of brother if he is guilty of sexual immorality or greed, or is an idolater, reviler, drunkard, or swindler—not even to eat with such a one.
1Co 5:12 For what have I to do with judging outsiders? Is it not those inside the church whom you are to judge?

Hey. Don't believe what Paul said. Your life to face God with.
Ok. That's great and we can throw some passages from all over the Bible out there it's still not going to help you make Acts 6:1-5 about anything other than not taking a brother in Christ to court. I'm not attempting to destroy some doctrine you may believe. I'm only dealing with the Scriptures presented.

All matters is all matters. Angels are Spiritual beings and are judged by Spiritual things. The appeal is clear. You're just refusing to admit it.
I'm not sure what you are trying to disagree with me on here. Yes the saints will judge angels, yes saints ought to be capable in judging all matters. However, since the verse is not about judging the angels or judging all matters we are left with only details about not taking our brothers in Christ to court and how we are to resolve these lawsuits instead of going to secular court.

Go read it for yourself. I'm not feeding your delusion anymore. Maybe you haven't read it and have no idea what it says. After all, you're a novice and it shows terribly on you.
Ok. What's your point with Acts 15?
 

Baptist City Holdout

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This conversation is FAAAAAR beyond any desire I have to follow it. All I have to say is when the preacher boy finds out he is being taken advantage of by way of free labor he should man up and find a new job, ministry or coffee shop.
 

treasure_unseen

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Ok. That's great and we can throw some passages from all over the Bible out there it's still not going to help you make Acts 6:1-5 about anything other than not taking a brother in Christ to court. I'm not attempting to destroy some doctrine you may believe. I'm only dealing with the Scriptures presented.
I hope you realize that those pesky chapter numbers and verse distinctions weren't in Paul's letter?

You have been dishonest over and over again with the information and you're use of it. You're not going to change.

I'm not sure what you are trying to disagree with me on here. Yes the saints will judge angels, yes saints ought to be capable in judging all matters. However, since the verse is not about judging the angels or judging all matters we are left with only details about not taking our brothers in Christ to court and how we are to resolve these lawsuits instead of going to secular court.
1Co 6:3 Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life?

The saints are to judge disputes concerning the Scriptures. To say anything otherwise is utterly ridiculous. IFBs, like yourself, have been hiding behind what they teach concerning the use of 1 Cor 6;3 for decades. Doing exactly what you're doing to keep others from questioning their doctrinal position.

Ok. What's your point with Acts 15?
Like you don't know. I have repeatedly appealed to it and you're ignoring it. Go read it yourself. Hint, there was a doctrinal dispute and a bunch of God's people came together to judge the dispute. Just like those at Berea. They didn't blindly accept even what the apostles said. They verified it among themselves.

I've meet dishonest people before but you're ranking right up there at the top.
 

treasure_unseen

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This conversation is FAAAAAR beyond any desire I have to follow it. All I have to say is when the preacher boy finds out he is being taken advantage of by way of free labor he should man up and find a new job, ministry or coffee shop.
Exactly.
 

tmjbog

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1Co 6:3 Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life?

The saints are to judge disputes concerning the Scriptures. To say anything otherwise is utterly ridiculous. IFBs, like yourself, have been hiding behind what they teach concerning the use of 1 Cor 6;3 for decades. Doing exactly what you're doing to keep others from questioning their doctrinal position.
I don't really disagree with you regarding the saints judging disputes on Scripture. But I Cor 6:1-5 do not give you any clue as to how, since it is not what those verses (words if you want to throw out verse numbers) are giving direction on.

Like you don't know. I have repeatedly appealed to it and you're ignoring it. Go read it yourself. Hint, there was a doctrinal dispute and a bunch of God's people came together to judge the dispute. Just like those at Berea. They didn't blindly accept even what the apostles said. They verified it among themselves.
Yes, However, it wasn't every Christian that came and had a say at this council either. It was the apostles and the elders that gathered and debated the issue. You mentioned the Bereans. I think that should be the gold standard. I know you want to believe that myself and every other person who attends an IFB is blindly following-but it is not the case.
 

treasure_unseen

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I don't really disagree with you regarding the saints judging disputes on Scripture. But I Cor 6:1-5 do not give you any clue as to how, since it is not what those verses (words if you want to throw out verse numbers) are giving direction on.
Double minded over and over again.

Yes, However, it wasn't every Christian that came and had a say at this council either. It was the apostles and the elders that gathered and debated the issue.
Whether you recognize this or not, Paul deals with this in the very verses you say don't mean the same thing.
1Co 6:4 If then ye have judgments of things pertaining to this life, set them to judge who are least esteemed in the church.

I've argued this long enough. I'm going to leave you with this...

You mentioned the Bereans. I think that should be the gold standard. I know you want to believe that myself and every other person who attends an IFB is blindly following-but it is not the case.
Obviously you don't like it when someone butchers your "golden calf". Doesn't matter who it is. It doesn't matter if its someone trying to appeal to the sincerity and integrity of the Scriptures or not.
 

tmjbog

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Double minded over and over again.



Whether you recognize this or not, Paul deals with this in the very verses you say don't mean the same thing.
1Co 6:4 If then ye have judgments of things pertaining to this life, set them to judge who are least esteemed in the church.

I've argued this long enough. I'm going to leave you with this...



Obviously you don't like it when someone butchers your "golden calf". Doesn't matter who it is. It doesn't matter if its someone trying to appeal to the sincerity and integrity of the Scriptures or not.
Don't even know what this golden calf that you speak of is.
 

Tarheel Baptist

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At the very least, you can call me names and make fun of the sincerity of my appeal. That will make you feel better about yourself.

Okay. You can call me that too. You're being a little cowardly.

What does that mean?
You are a source of entertainment...which does make me feel ‘entertained’.
Proud, arrogant, ignorant Pharisee was merely descriptive.
You are a caricature of ‘proud, arrogant, ignorant Pharisee‘.

Haymaaan.....
 

treasure_unseen

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You are a source of entertainment...which does make me feel ‘entertained’.
Proud, arrogant, ignorant Pharisee was merely descriptive.
You are a caricature of ‘proud, arrogant, ignorant Pharisee‘.

Haymaaan.....
God judge between us.
 
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