The Old FFF

[Biker]

I started out on the original forum (JackHyles.net) and have at least lurked on every iteration.  I was still in Bible college when it started.  Those were the days.  I probably learned more theology and formulated more theological arguments on some of those threads than a few entire classes in college.  A few other posters I enjoyed reading - tachbuloth, all of Phil Johnson's sock puppets, Doc Cassidy.  There are a few more, but I cannot remember them at the moment.  The original was always my favorite forum, as the discussions were a lot more sustained and less vitriolic (most of the time).

That's probably a common name ^^^ but just to set the record straight, I know someone whose a Pastor with that name who is heavily involved in a non denominational church here in California. Our Mother church I call it, since many of our members were members of his church. Mother church, they correct me when I call it that. His church leaders would never allow him to be a member here, they wouldn't find it acceptable. I'd bet my house on it.

He gives our church a killer deal on Study Bibles for our Jail Ministry (which I head). Truly a great guy from what I've known..but they are probably not one in the same anyhow.

 

[Biker]

New... saving the FFF from the spammed ash heap, where the owner is no where to be found, or known.

Yes you do an excellent job! 
thanks so much for your effort to get this website up.
Hopefully it's not costing you money, if you wanted to do a donation drive, I'd donate.
Andrew T. booted me off the FFF for 2 days due to a misunderstanding with my donation. My wife saw the amount via Paypal and had the money reversed. It was ran through under his business name, some internet company or something I'd never heard of. Not the FFF, or anything close to it. So when she asked me if I knew about it, I said No. So she had it reversed saying we never agreed to it. I sent him an apology for the misunderstanding and re-sent the funds then he re-instated me into the FFF again.

I am watching Senate Bill S.1575 definition of Indian just sits there so no new news regarding Indians and Healthcare.
So far, non federal tribe members do not get the luxury of a totally free health plan but they still get free healthcare via the Indian Health Service.
So if you wanted to forego a health plan for your wife, you could attempt to verify her as Indian and she would qualify for one level of free healthcare.

 

[FundamentalDan]

That's probably a common name ^^^ but just to set the record straight, I know someone whose a Pastor with that name who is heavily involved in a non denominational church here in California. Our Mother church I call it, since many of our members were members of his church. Mother church, they correct me when I call it that. His church leaders would never allow him to be a member here, they wouldn't find it acceptable. I'd bet my house on it.

He gives our church a killer deal on Study Bibles for our Jail Ministry (which I head). Truly a great guy from what I've known..but they are probably not one in the same anyhow.

Biker,

If you are talking of the Phil Johnson who works with John MacArthur, I will take your house keys any time you are ready.  You can just inbox me and I will tell you where to send them.  However, this was a long time ago (13 or 14 years ago).  I met up with him once and he graciously showed me around the church and Hollywood.  He is a very nice guy.

 

[Biker]

That's probably a common name ^^^ but just to set the record straight, I know someone whose a Pastor with that name who is heavily involved in a non denominational church here in California. His church leaders would never allow him to be a member here, they wouldn't find it acceptable. I'd bet my house on it.

He gives our church a killer deal on Study Bibles for our Jail Ministry (which I head). Truly a great guy from what I've known..but they are probably not one in the same anyhow.

Biker,

If you are talking of the Phil Johnson who works with John MacArthur, I will take your house keys any time you are ready.  You can just inbox me and I will tell you where to send them.  However, this was a long time ago (13 or 14 years ago).  I met up with him once and he graciously showed me around the church and Hollywood.  He is a very nice guy.

Sounds like a  Troll, an imposter..
Remember a bunch of freaks were on these boards for eeeons.. I can't remember the past boards too well but this is the tamest FFF so far.
Hacking others accounts, stealing passwords then boasting about it that was odd. Phil would not have had the time, he just wouldn't. That's the true problem.

If you truly know who he is and what he does, even back then.
Maybe we'll have to agree to disagree.

I think I might remember you, did you have a black guy with no teeth as an Avatar? and it read below it, "I am FREE!"

 

[Biker]

Does anyone know what happened to Sean P.? He used to wear a sandwich board and protest gay events.

 

[FundamentalDan]

No, I do not believe that I ever had that avatar.  On every forum, I have always had the same name.  I did have the quote from Martin Luther King Jr. as my tag line for a while - "Free at last, free at last, Thank God Almighty, I am free at last." 

As far as it being an impostor, you are incorrect.  I met the real Phil, and I cannot agree to disagree with you regarding my memory.  His sock puppets were not spamming, they were entertaining personas that presented other sides of an argument.  Ask your good friend and he will tell you about it. 

 

[Biker]

That's too funny. My friend won't tell me about it, cause even if it occurred, Phil would've NOT admitted it to him.
He's the last person you'd say that to. My friend is not fond of christian message boards, staunch against them. I asked once some years ago.

And...that certainly wasn't you I thought of. That member had some Avatar Name that made you think he was en ex -slave.

 

[Sherryh]

Welcome Dan, Give us an update on how you're doing? 

 

[FundamentalDan]

Sherryh,

I am doing fine.  I stay busy between pastoring a small church, running a small business, and chasing two little girls around the house to get them to quit fighting.  Sometimes I even spend some time with my wife, so she will stick around for another eight years.  The church website is http://heritagehs.org.  Come visit if you are ever in Hot Springs.

 

[Sherryh]

I'm so happy for you!!! God bless you my friend!!

 

[Just John]

Is Hreb Evans still kickin'?

That typo became epic!  LOL!!!!

 

[Just John]

I stumbled across Don's FFF in 2000 or 2001 and was immediately hooked by Tales from the Temple. Coyote was a great storyteller.  Probably didn't missed 10 or 15 days for the next 10 years or so. Ransom has always been a consistently favorite poster. I always like a good argument with Tabucloth (though I still can't spell his name or know what it means) or Crazy Lou Martuniac. I do miss all of the drama with the kooks....very cheap entertainment.

What was the name of the X'er guy who was supposedly black and could hardly spell his own name. I think one of his daughters became ill or something and many gave money but he would still be rude. Had a pet phrase too but can't remember what it was. He was funny.

 

[Just John]

I stumbled across Don's FFF in 2000 or 2001 and was immediately hooked by Tales from the Temple. Coyote was a great storyteller.  Probably didn't missed 10 or 15 days for the next 10 years or so. Ransom has always been a consistently favorite poster. I always like a good argument with Tabucloth (though I still can't spell his name or know what it means) or Crazy Lou Martuniac. I do miss all of the drama with the kooks....very cheap entertainment.

What was the name of the X'er guy who was supposedly black and could hardly spell his own name. I think one of his daughters became ill or something and many gave money but he would still be rude. Had a pet phrase too but can't remember what it was. He was funny.

ewfisher

he use to tell everybody they must be gay.......  :

LOL. That's right. We never could tell if he was a sock or if multiple people logged in under that account. 

 

[aleshanee]

...because they both left their forums unmoderated.. for the most part .. and also unintimidated..... at least by either of them as a webby or admin...... ...neither don or andrew came onto their forums posting under the name of admin... then went about using their title and forum.. with a sarcastic moderator in tow.... as a bully pulpit to insult and harass other forum members.... or try and force their personal views onto other members..... or tell them..."you are on the wrong forum".. if they didn;t agree....
[/color]

An unfair post seeing that I came to your aid and performed the heaviest moderation to date.

Why is an admin, who was heavily involved in the FFF before taking ownership supposed to quit posting, hold his opinion secretly and not speak out when others misrepresent his words? What level of control do you seek?

how fair was it for you to call me and others here "biblically illiterate" over a disagreement that had nothing to do with scripture?

you had no problem with my biblical literacy in the past, when we were on the same side of an issue arguing against others with a different viewpoint........

and what "heavy moderation" is it you are talking about?......... the biggest thing i remember was a very vulgar and suggestive post made by one of your friends.... that i begged you repeatedly to remove ...... you did nothing until i finally appealed to your sensibilities as a father.. by private message... and told you i did not want my own father logging in here and seeing that remark..........

a forum admin can do whatever he likes with his own forum.....  but in all the other past versions of the fff there was a very large group of christian ladies that took an active part ........ they don;t seem to want anything to do with this forum... and in fact most deliberately avoid it..... have you ever thought to ask yourself why?..........

 

[aleshanee]

...how fair was it for you to call me and others here "biblically illiterate" over a disagreement that had nothing to do with scripture?

... your failure to admit that speaking life and hope to others is a biblical concept, sung by a well known Christian musician gives the perception that you are willing to say anything to just argue. Those who are unwilling to admit that "speaking life and hope" is biblical truth are, in my book, opening themselves up to the charge that they are not familiar with the Bible's teaching on the subject.

we get it..... it;s very obvious you are a huge toby mac fan.... .. but you are starting to come off like one of his salesmen or a business agent..... do you have some kind of personal interest or investment made in this particular musician that is causing you to push his music so hard?...... you have practically compared his lyrics to scripture and accused traditionalists who can;t appreciate his artistry of being biblically illiterate ....and in a previous post in this thread you imply they are unsaved.....

no one said there wasn;t biblical truth in that song.... but the truths are universal.... and many undeniable truths ... even though they clearly originate with God... tend to be that way.... other cultures latch onto them because they cannot be denied.... if you knew as much about other cultures as you claim to you would know this...... .  what i said about the song was the lyrics were not unique enough to one religion or culture to be clearly recognized by all as strictly christian.... and i saw no reason to use it in worship.... i didn;t say anything about it being wrong for others to use it in worship........ but you took offense and ran away with this thing like a man obsessed.......  i;m not the only one who sees this.....

.... and now unintentionally admit that I am not a bully in my moderation of this forum.

and i find it very interesting how you fail to acknowledge what else i wrote in my post..... about how much it took for me to convince you to delete that very vulgar and suggestive post made by one of your friends.. ... and how many time i had to literally beg you... while you continued to say you saw nothing wrong with it......even after other forum members saw it and said the same thing i did... ......

any other christian forum admin i know... dedicated to the truth and the word..... but especially one who had daughters of his own.... and knowing both the history and nature of the person who made the comment.... would have deleted that comment without even being asked...... but what you showed me in that incident was that your dedication to your friends..... regardless of how vile or nasty they were.... outweighed your dedication to christian principle.... not to mention fairness....... yes you acted like a bully, in that you enabled another bully... and then even defended him.. for well over a week... until the possibility arose that others.. (my own father)... would see it and get involved and the whole thing could blow up even further. ...... only then did you take the action that was requested...... the bible tells of a similar story and calls the person in your position.. acting like you did ...an "unjust judge"..... but take your pick.... whether its a "bully" or "unjust judge".... their actions and results of their actions are often the same....... as is often their motivation........

but that is not the only reason i said what i did about your moderation of the forum...... remember when you were about to ban papabear for disagreeing with you?..... i remember another forum member had to intervene then too and convince you it would be a mistake......and earlier in the ccm thread you stated flat out if that if some of us couldn;t agree with you about the value of toby macs music then we didn;t belong on this forum...... what was that all about if not a bullish attempt to intimidate us into agreement?........

Posters are androgynous, mostly. I have no idea what the woman:man ratio is on this forum. Do you have any figures to back up your statement that "most deliberately avoid" this forum? Or are you hoping, once again, that one of your wildly flung accusations sticks?

i have what some of them have told me.....that they don;t want to have anything to do with this place.... some of them were here in the beginning but no longer take part..... and if you will remember.. a few months ago.. jr church brought up the very same point in the thread called "uneasy".... which you locked down in order to once again protect your friends from scrutiny and criticism ..........

you can accuse me of whatever you want....do all the mocking you want..... i guess that;s your privilege as forum admin......  but the one that began making wildly flung accusations here was you... all because we couldn;t agree with you that toby macs lyrics were worthy of being compared to scripture........ and like i told you before....... God will be the judge between us on this and all other issues we have both brought up here.......... i have peace to that end about it........... do you?

 

[Ransom]

.... and now unintentionally admit that I am not a bully in my moderation of this forum.

I must keep aleshanee's point in mind, the next time some malicious tool comes along and posts 300+ pornographic images on this forum.

Clearly, sitting in front of my computer for 2 hours straight doing nothing but hitting refresh and deleting images of transsexuals performing oral sex, as they are posted, is heavy-handed and bullying.  What did he ever do to deserve that kind of treatment?

Oh dear. I just realized I put on the "sarcastic moderator" hat again. I'm a horrible, horrible person.

 

[aleshanee]

... all because we couldn;t agree with you that toby macs lyrics were worthy of being compared to scripture.....

This is an excellent illustration of how you twist what I said.... so, again? as in numerous times, quote me where I compare his lyrics to scripture.

He includes biblical truths in his song. THAT is what I said. Truths you STILL deny are present.

tobyMac is my brother

it;s a better example of what an accomplished word twister you are......... show me where i said the song "speak life" is pagan....... you have accused me of calling it pagan 3 times now.... yet that has been your words.... not mine........

and i have never denied his song has truths in it that are biblical.... i even said the truths are undeniable and all truth originates with God......  you are still trying to twist what i said to try and justify your own over reaction to the fact some of us didn;t fall over and play dead when you played your favorite musicians song........ your efforts to keep twisting this are starting to look silly.......

btw.... you never answered what i asked you about having peace about this and allowing God to judge between us..... because if you then there is no reason to even continue.... we can agree to disagree and part ways on this issue........ but as long as you continue to accuse me and others of being biblically illiterate over this disagreement you do both yourself and your favorite musician a disservice..... ...... there is still a large segment of christianity that views toby mac that as in your face artist you is doing more harm than good by trying to break down walls between christian traditions and the rest of the world that many christians have a strong conviction should remain intact.............. your arguments are proving their points.....

 

[aleshanee]

.... and now unintentionally admit that I am not a bully in my moderation of this forum.

I must keep aleshanee's point in mind, the next time some malicious tool comes along and posts 300+ pornographic images on this forum.

Clearly, sitting in front of my computer for 2 hours straight doing nothing but hitting refresh and deleting images of transsexuals performing oral sex, as they are posted, is heavy-handed and bullying.  What did he ever do to deserve that kind of treatment?

Oh dear. I just realized I put on the "sarcastic moderator" hat again. I'm a horrible, horrible person.

and i appreciate you doing that...... but then.... wait a minute..... :-\ ...... . admin said the heaviest moderation to date was done on my behalf when he deleted comments made by another forum member.......  ??? ......... so which is it?.........

 

[aleshanee]

tobyMac is my brother

actual brother?..... or are you saying that meaning he is your brother in Christ?................. if he is only a brother in Christ then why all the favoritism...... we are all supposed to be your brothers and sisters in Christ....

but if he is your actual maternal or paternal brother either one...or both.... then again there is no reason to continue...... the reason for both your bias and passion for this issue has now been revealed..... and your ire is understandable..... but if you will allow someone you consider biblically illiterate to direct you to a scripture..... consider james 1-20... .... for the wrath of man worketh not the righteousness of God...

you have come off as very angry from the moment arguments on this issue started....... months ago.........maybe it;s time to step back and reconsider your approach to both promoting and defending it.....

 

[aleshanee]

actual brother?..... or are you saying that meaning he is your brother in Christ?................. if he is only a brother in Christ then why all the favoritism...... we are all supposed to be your brothers and sisters in Christ....

All of the accusations made about him ("doesn't use the name of God or Jesus" "secular" "pagan hip hop artist" "in it for only the money") are untrue. I only  used tobyMac because he ignites the traditionalist. I figured that highlighting my point by using someone so misunderstood and despised would be a perfect starting point. It has! The traditionalists have run to everything EXCEPT the Bible in telling us why his song is wrong.

...you have come off as very angry from the moment arguments on this issue started....... months ago.........maybe it;s time to step back and reconsider your approach to both promoting and defending it.....

Angry? Once again, you imagine too much. If I were angry, then it would be obvious by "reds," "warnings" and heavy moderation.

I am just stating my opinions and defending a brother from wrong accusations. I could use a smiley face a bit more often, but I figure I will just let the sound reasoning stand on its own merits.

I am not the one who said I would walk out of a church if they played tobyMac. I would even stay if they had a pump organ. I can worship in any context as long as it is biblical. Perhaps you need to look a bit more introspectively.

so you admit you are just trying to ignite an argument with those you call "traditionalists" over a disagreement in choices of music........  that;s what i said in the first place when you insisted you were merely defending the use of ccm in a church others were trying to remove it from..... and i also asked you why you chose a toby mac song with no reference to God or Jesus if your intent was really to defend his music as christian?... but now you admit it was all just a game..... just a way of inflaming the "traditionalists" and doing nothing more than attempting to replace their tradition with one your own...... ..

that;s right.... you are no less a traditionalist than they are.... you are just following a different tradition.... but they are both traditions of men........ and neither is worth splitting churches or coming between christian brethren over......... you have no more scripture to offer proving their way is wrong than they do proving yours is wrong.... nor any to prove either is right either..... except that scripture states we are to do all to the glory of God.... and in my view that;s hard to achieve using any kind of prerecorded music... of any genre..... ... but if you can.... then do it...... but don;t force it on me....

and as far as accusations here go.... you are the one who made most of them .... and why should it bother you if other people walk out of a church that plays toby mac?.... if it;s not your church in the first place why would you even bring it there?....... and if it is your church then why do you care?....... do you want people to sit there and be miserable?...... are you so intent on pushing a genre of music that you feel you have a right to force it on people who don;t want to listen to it?......

maybe you really can worship in any context as long as it;s biblical... and then again maybe you just haven;t seen the context yet that would run you off .....  but either way... does your ability to tolerate something give you the right to force all things you can tolerate onto others who might not be able to?........ that;s an insistence that will come back to haunt you one day...... and that;s not something that works the righteousness of God either..... because even though you might be jovial and not filled with wrath you none the less stir up.......

and thanks for the warning about what we can expect to see when you do get angry..... i guess we can take that comment you made the other day about which ones of us were on the wrong forum as an indication you were angry at that time.... ok.... duly noted.......