Criminalizing Bus Ministries?

[AverageJoe]

OK. I guess I hit a raw nerve.

I sincerely doubt you hit a raw nerve with her. And she is a HER! Wow! I just love the way newbies come in spouting off, giving platitudes and attitudes that they shouldn't have. I mean, look, we're sorry about what happened to your wife, but, that doesn't give you an excuse to come in her acting like a jackass.

 

[AverageJoe]

This is about me and my world from my perspective. That's how I view reality. I don't live in a Baptist make believe world where everyone pretends to be nice and they wear a fake Colgate smile.

You're sounding more and more like a sock puppet or troll. Most Baptists don't live in a make-believe world, but, it sounds like you do...or possibly a drug-induced state of idiocy. Jesus must have been a fool for being kind to others.

 

[subllibrm]

<snip> acting like a jackass.

Only Hugh Jass was allowed that leeway!

 

[AverageJoe]

Only Hugh Jass was allowed that leeway!

Miss ole HJ...

 

[coverbd]

I agree. You need to tell that to the 'fake' Christians

 

[AverageJoe]

I agree. You need to tell that to the 'fake' Christians

What do I need to tell them? You've got to actually post what you're responding to for people to know who, what, and why you're responding. I think you know this already...anarchist! LOL

 

[ALAYMAN]

Here's some sincere questions for you coverbd....

How often do you find yourself quarreling with other people? Do you enjoy getting under people's skin? Does it make you feel proud to stick it to 'em?

 

[ALAYMAN]

This is about me and my world from my perspective. That's how I view reality. I don't live in a Baptist make believe world where everyone pretends to be nice and they wear a fake Colgate smile.

You have presumed, again. I have had to fight hard to not be so harsh to other people who I disagree with as I've grown in my walk with Jesus. In days gone by I would have treated you much more harshly, but grace is a life-changing thing. We need to issue more of it, as it appears you do too.

 

[sword]

i know what you are saying is true..... there are many out there going about the bus ministry in the wrong way and for the wrong reasons..... .. but it;s that way in any organized ministry..... there will always be those who abuse it for their own gain.... ...there are many out there who abuse the ministries i have been personally involved with too.... ...but in my view the best way to adress those problems is not to abandon the ministry altogether but to make a better effort to do it right and show how it can be done right..... ... but i also know in many cases that is easier said than done.... .and in many cases there really is a better way.....

though you may not be aware of them i have no doubt there are many out there you had a positive influence on during your years in the bus ministry..... you may never learn who they are in this life time..... but i have no doubt they all remember you... and remain very thankful you were put into their lives.....

You say many churchs have bus ministries for their own purposes, what possible selfish purpose would a church have other than to brag about numbers in having a bus.

Most pastors have a bus ministry as a outreach ministry and as a place for their members to reach the community for Christ. Most bus ministries are a drain on a church in the following ways, but those that have them must feel it's worth it.

Cost of buses which have to be rotated ever 4 to 5 years unless you buy new or nearly new.
Cost of insurance which has doubled in past 6 years.
Damage to buildings from bus kids (and regular members kids).
Cost and time needed to keep buses running properly and safely.
Time consumed by members to visit routes and pick up and drop off every Sunday.
Additional protocals to assure the safety and well being of each and every rider.
Risk of unhappy parents or possible lawsuits.

It seems no church would have a bus ministry unless they were called to it and had a Godly love for the riders and their families.

 

[sword]

i deleted it.... ... i get into phases where i say too much sometimes... .not sure that was one of them... but it felt like it for a moment.... ..we really miss that old truck though.... .we can;t take my sisters suburban into places we took that thing... and the other old jeep we have can;t carry as much... plus it;s getting to be a pain to keep fixing too.... even with lots of spare parts available.....

I don't mean to speak for the whole Forum, but we all love you and love your exotic island stories.

Your life experiences good and bad are important to us.

 

[AverageJoe]

You have presumed, again. I have had to fight hard to not be so harsh to other people who I disagree with as I've grown in my walk with Jesus. In days gone by I would have treated you much more harshly, but grace is a life-changing thing. We need to issue more of it, as it appears you do too.

Same here, Brother... and you know that's a fact.

 

[aleshanee]

I'm not here to impress anyone.
When I left NY 25 years ago to go to work for Caterpillar in Illinois I thought I was starting a new job.
Adonai had other plans I was actually going to Illinois to meet my future wife starting a new job was a by product. Adonai knew I would be the only person that could help and meet her needs. When I met my wife she was taking her meals through a straw. Her abusive mother jammed a broom handle way up her rectum and put her cigarettes out on her legs and arms. Her father did the unthinkable to her with other men. I'm not using this as a comparison to what happened to you. Adonai used me as a tool to put her back together physically, emotionally and spiritually. My wife has had numerous surgeries. She hasn't eaten a steak since she was a girl until I took her to St Vincent hospital in Indianapolis for a difficult abdominal surgery. She can now eat regular food. She takes stool softeners for the rest of her life because of her rectal abuse damage.
She has had 2 rotator cuff surgeries,
One upper and one lower back surgeries to replace degenerated discs. She has fibromayalgia. She recently had a procedure for Afib. She has had a hysterectomy.
She also has wet macular degeneration where she gets eye injections every 4 weeks in both eyes for the rest of her life. Those injections are $3,000 per injection. Both of her parents are dead and in hell where they belong.
My wife is financially secure for the rest of her life on this planet. I am her legal advocate and her physical advocate. She told me she would have been dead if I had not come into her life when I did. My wife loves cats. I bought her a Maine coon kitten last summer from a breeder.
I would literally move heaven and hell for her. There is a special bond between two people that has suffered abuse from another person.
Her girlfriend who was also abused passed away about 5 years ago. They had a special bond. They did about everything together. You would think someone that has suffered severe abuse would be angry at the world and other people. My wife is the opposite. She has a real sweet spirit and demeanor about her. She is a gracious person that always makes people feel welcome and appreciated. She doesn't have a victim mentality. I retired from Caterpillar to be a full time caregiver for her.
I really don't care what people think about me. The only opinion that counts is Yeshua's
I'm not perfect. Now that I have all the facts. I do owe you my sincere and heartfelt apology for the things I said about you.
Whether or not you forgive me that will be up to you. If you chose not to forgive me I will understand, but I always will treat you with courtesy and respect from now on. You will be in my morning prayers tomorrow.
Y'varechecha Adonai v'yishmerecha
May God Bless you and keep you.
Shalom

thank you.... and yes i do forgive you.... i hope you will also forgive the unkind things i said about you.... .and i will pray for you and your wife as well..... ..

 

[coverbd]

thank you.... and yes i do forgive you.... i hope you will also forgive the unkind things i said about you.... .and i will pray for you and your wife as well..... ..

Toda raba (Thank you) my sister. You were in my prayers this morning. You have unconditional forgiveness from me. I behaved like a jerk. I deserved the criticism. I wish we could have met under more ideal conditions.
Blessings in Yeshua/Jesus

 

[aleshanee]

You say many churchs have bus ministries for their own purposes, what possible selfish purpose would a church have other than to brag about numbers in having a bus.

Most pastors have a bus ministry as a outreach ministry and as a place for their members to reach the community for Christ. Most bus ministries are a drain on a church in the following ways, but those that have them must feel it's worth it.

Cost of buses which have to be rotated ever 4 to 5 years unless you buy new or nearly new.
Cost of insurance which has doubled in past 6 years.
Damage to buildings from bus kids (and regular members kids).
Cost and time needed to keep buses running properly and safely.
Time consumed by members to visit routes and pick up and drop off every Sunday.
Additional protocals to assure the safety and well being of each and every rider.
Risk of unhappy parents or possible lawsuits.

It seems no church would have a bus ministry unless they were called to it and had a Godly love for the riders and their families.

that was the only selfish purpose i know of..... for increasing attendance numbers without taking any real interest in the children or other riders.... .... and i have never actually seen a ministry like that myself - but only read about them described here.... plus also heard my dad talk about them.... (he was actually in the bus ministry in college the year he went to hyles anderson)... ....in hawaii there are a few churches of different faiths that run something like a bus ministry..... but it;s more of a small van ministry... ...running a full size bus here would require a city and county size budget... ... not to mention trying to find a place to park the thing when you were not using it.... ..but in general and on prinicple i am a huge fan of bus ministries... .i know from personal experience what the value of them is.. ....to me it;s sad that they are becoming rare....

the ministries i have been involved were all with homeless people and homeless fmailies with children.... no busses involved other than the regular city bus... ..we were able to get quite a few of them into church and some remain faithful even now continuing the ministry to other street people like themselves... ...but it all started with being out there on the street on foot saturday mornings and taking them food.... .then going back sunday morning and walking with them to church if they agree to go or riding the city bus with them... ..that usually took a lot of saturday morning visits..... ...but i also tried to get them into doctor appointments or the clinic if they needed it and were just reluctant to go.. ..plus made certain they had their medications and were taking it if they had been prescribed meds.... some of them will sell their meds on the street the moment they get prescription filled and that;s a big problem.... very hard to deal with...

i went into a pharmacy downtown once to refil a medication for a homeless guy who told me the pharmacy had called police and tresspassed him from the premesis the last time he had been there.... but the pharmacy said he had to be there himself and that nobody could pick it up for him..... i ask them how he was supposed to do that when security would not let him in.... ...they tried to brush me off saying it was not their problem so i got very irritated with them.... they threatened to call police on me and i almost got myself tresspassed from the premesis.... ....in a way it kinda put me in his shoes for a moment.... and i understood a little better why he was always non-compliant with his meds.......

 

[aleshanee]

This is a Caterpillar V12 diesel engine. I was the chief manufacturing programming engineer on this product line.

i;ve only seen big caterpillar engines once.... and as it turned out... by coincidence.... i was wearing steel toed work shoes with the name caterpillar emblazoned on the side.... ...i had a job for a while on a commercial charter fishing boat.... (my dad and the owner are good friends)..... it was a 53 ft hatteras sport fisher that made daily trips out to fish for the big 4 here.... .(tuna marlin mahimahi and ono)... my job was basically an on board cook - barista - first aid provider - cigar lighter - snack maker - dramamine dispenser and whatever else the customers might need while out at sea... .

but on one occasion while the captain was starting the boat one of the prop shaft seals blew out.... so they had to pull it out of the water into dry dock and do repairs.... .most of the crew had to find work on other boats during that time but since i wasn;t a deck hand i was temporarily out of a job... so they told me i could help out in the engine room while the owner and a mechanic/boatwright made repairs ... basically just be a gopher fetchit for tools they needed and to bring in food and snacks for them.... ...

they said they decided that because i was small enough to fit into the space where the stuffing boxes and prop shaft seals were without getting in their way...... but also told me i would need a pair of steel toed shoes.... .so i went to good will and by chance they just happened to have a pair of caterpillar alaska style work boots that were my size.... the sales lady said they had been there for years...... ..so the first day i wore them into the engine compartment i was pleasantly surprised to see the same name on the engines as was on my shoes...

that was a pretty good job.... worked mostly for tips - but i had a lot of fun out there too.... ..then when the owner/captain decided to retire and turn over driving the boat to someone else the new captain wanted to make changes and that included changes to my job... (provided i wanted to keep it).... in truth he didn;t see my job as being necessary.... ..so i quit.... ..but it was fun while it lasted

 

[coverbd]

i;ve only seen big caterpillar engines once.... and as it turned out... by coincidence.... i was wearing steel toed work shoes with the name caterpillar emblazoned on the side.... ...i had a job for a while on a commercial charter fishing boat.... (my dad and the owner are good friends)..... it was a 53 ft hatteras sport fisher that made daily trips out to fish for the big 4 here.... .(tuna marlin mahimahi and ono)... my job was basically an on board cook - barista - first aid provider - cigar lighter - snack maker - dramamine dispenser and whatever else the customers might need while out at sea... .

but on one occasion while the captain was starting the boat one of the prop shaft seals blew out.... so they had to pull it out of the water into dry dock and do repairs.... .most of the crew had to find work on other boats during that time but since i wasn;t a deck hand i was temporarily out of a job... so they told me i could help out in the engine room while the owner and a mechanic/boatwright made repairs ... basically just be a gopher fetchit for tools they needed and to bring in food and snacks for them.... ...

they said they decided that because i was small enough to fit into the space where the stuffing boxes and prop shaft seals were without getting in their way...... but also told me i would need a pair of steel toed shoes.... .so i went to good will and by chance they just happened to have a pair of caterpillar alaska style work boots that were my size.... the sales lady said they had been there for years...... ..so the first day i wore them into the engine compartment i was pleasantly surprised to see the same name on the engines as was on my shoes...

that was a pretty good job.... worked mostly for tips - but i had a lot of fun out there too.... ..then when the owner/captain decided to retire and turn over driving the boat to someone else the new captain wanted to make changes and that included changes to my job... (provided i wanted to keep it).... in truth he didn;t see my job as being necessary.... ..so i quit.... ..but it was fun while it lasted

Good for you. Caterpillar has been good to me. I took a golden parachute retirement from them about 4 years ago. I worked for them in Indiana and North Carolina. I loved my time working there. I went to Europe a couple of times for them on business.

 

[aleshanee]

Good for you. Caterpillar has been good to me. I took a golden parachute retirement from them about 4 years ago. I worked for them in Indiana and North Carolina. I loved my time working there. I went to Europe a couple of times for them on business.

my dad is completely retired now too..... .he retired from commercial diving around 2007.... then gave up going into the ship rigging a few years later.... (that was mostly volunteer work for the maritime center anyway).... .then retired from EMS about 8 years now.... ..but knowing how sudden inactivity can affect someones long term health i got him more involved in helping me teach traditonal archery.... plus we began doing more bowhunting in the mountains for a time - until his old injuries caught up with him.... .... he took care of me for many years and now it;s beginning to turn around and i am taking care of him more and more.... his wife still has many years before sha can retire and works up to 80+ hours a week sometimes in an emergency room..... but he sometimes goes with me and my friends when we snorkel spear fish for octopus... ..on those trips he takes care of all us.... whatever disablity he has developed walking around on land has no effect on him in the water..... he is as capable in the ocean as he ever was.... ...but we still don;t let him don extra scuba tanks and go deep anymore.... ....60 feet is the limit... ...

 

[coverbd]

You have fabulous parents. Enjoy every precious moments with them.
You never know when Adonai will call them to heaven. Life is so short and fleeting. My mother is 94 years old and is in relatively good health. I call her everyday just to talk and see how she is doing. Archery and scuba diving sounds interesting and something I would like to try. My youngest brothers wife goes scuba diving. I like being near the ocean. It's so relaxing to view God's handiwork.
I was a first responder at the Cat plant here in North Carolina. My mother's side of the family were physician's back in the day. I have an antique S style roll top desk that he filled medicine bottles for patients during the early 1900s. He also gave the Gospel to patients when he made house calls on horseback.
You have an extraordinary evening.
Shalom

 

[AverageJoe]

Wow...all this talk about Caterpillar and Illinois almost makes me want to move back to the Peoria Illinois area. Nearly everyone I grew up with had family working for Cat!

 

[coverbd]

Because of blue state stupidity Caterpillar moved their corporate office from Peoria to red state Dallas, Texas