How to Succeed at God's Work

Vince Massi said:
Revelations 21:8 gives us another list by which to identify tares: "But the cowardly, unbelieving, abominable, murderers, sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death."

But many Christians object that King David committed both adultery and murder, and yet he was saved. We should, therefor, reject this verse.

The list includes "all liars," so I want to focus on that. Whom does God consider to be a liar? If an honest person, under fear, tells a lie one time, is he a liar? Or do you have to tell a lot of lies? If so, how many? How serious do the lies have to be?

The answer is given in Revelations 22:15: "But outside are dogs and sorcerers and sexually immoral and murderers and idolaters, and whoever loves and practices a lie." God explains that a person who loves and practices lying is a liar.

Now, there are problems here:
1) God's definition of a liar is someone who loves and practices lying, but God doesn't state that His definition extends no farther.
2) God never extends that definition to murderers, immoral people, etc. On the other hand, God never changes.
3) King David did not love and practice adultery and murder.
4) God brought very heavy public judgement on King David. We're not talking about someone who casually abides in serious sin and professes to be saved.

Yes, you can accept Revelations 21:8 as true, despite what King David did. "But the cowardly, unbelieving, abominable, murderers, sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death."
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Are you trying to justify your lies?
 
The Meisner Effect

Grace Independent Baptist Church had been founded in the early years of WW2 as an IFB church. Its founding members were loyal--many wee still there in the 1970s when I attended as a new Christian. A new pastor had doubled the size of the building for the growing congregation, but then he had left and things fell apart.

With about 70 people left in the debt-ridden church, the made Meisner, the head deacon, the acting pastor and put him in charge of finding a new pastor. And Meisner seized the church. He would allow no search for a pastor, put his name on the bulletins and the sign out front, and refused to leave.

Two of the men who had helped me as a new Christian finally led a fight to oust Meisner. Meisner demanded that deacons not loyal to him resign, and about 35 people were left when they had their annual business meeting. The church constitution stated that the pastor would conduct the business meetings, and Meisner refused to resign or to call a vote to fire him. About 15 people, some crying, walked out.

With 20 people left, Meisner was forced to call a pastor. And the guy turned everything around. People from other churches flocked in, and many of the old members returned.

And then: The Meisner Effect.

The people who had gone out fighting weren't welcome back. People who had served and sacrificed for four decades were regarded as fighters and trouble-makers. New people held the leadership positions, and they weren't in a hurry to see old leaders return. The new pastor made it plain that things were going well, and he did not want people returning to re-open old fights.

Brethren, if you need to leave a church, it is usually better to leave quietly.

I talked to my two grief-stricken friends, and advised them to serve God faithfully were they were at (which they were already doing).
 
Gossip is now a definition of succeeding at God's work?  ???
 
Couldn't have been much of an "effect" if Vince can't even remember Meisner's first name.
 
Romans 15:16-17 tells us "Now I urge you, brethren, note those who cause divisions and offenses, contrary to the doctrine which you learned, and avoid them. For those who are such do not serve our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly, and by smooth words and flattering speech deceive the hearts of the simple."

Remember that the idea is how to succeed in God's work. Under that is how to deal with tares.

The Greek word translated "mark" refers to aiming at an enemy or at a hunted animal. It refers to spying and watching. But then Paul merely says to avoid them. He goes on to explain that the people who cause these divisions and offenses are not serving Christ, but themselves.

Fighting is an evidence of self-service, not of doing God's work. We have already seen from Scripture that almost none of God's promises of blessing refer to scorners--WHILE NOT PLAINLY STATING THAT THEY ARE TARES, PAUL DOES WARN THAT THEY AREN'T SERVING CHRIST.

They can't be serving Christ--God has rejected them as recipients of His blessings in doing His work.
 
Vince Massi said:
Romans 15:16-17 tells us "Now I urge you, brethren, note those who cause divisions and offenses, contrary to the doctrine which you learned, and avoid them. For those who are such do not serve our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly, and by smooth words and flattering speech deceive the hearts of the simple."

Remember that the idea is how to succeed in God's work. Under that is how to deal with tares.

The Greek word translated "mark" refers to aiming at an enemy or at a hunted animal. It refers to spying and watching. But then Paul merely says to avoid them. He goes on to explain that the people who cause these divisions and offenses are not serving Christ, but themselves.

Fighting is an evidence of self-service, not of doing God's work. We have already seen from Scripture that almost none of God's promises of blessing refer to scorners--WHILE NOT PLAINLY STATING THAT THEY ARE TARES, PAUL DOES WARN THAT THEY AREN'T SERVING CHRIST.

They can't be serving Christ--God has rejected them as recipients of His blessings in doing His work.
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Okay...we thus "Mark" you!  Satisfied?
 
Vince Massi said:
Fighting is an evidence of self-service, not of doing God's work.
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You spend more time on this thread lashing out at people who disagree with you, than actually teaching the Bible.

What does that say about you, Vince? Hint: It stars with H, and rhymes with "hypocrite."
 
Shortly after I posted an explanation of Scripture, Ransom posts "You spend more time on this thread lashing out at people who disagree with you, than actually teaching the Bible."

Readers, that's as fine an example of "You who judge do the same things."

After describing himself in his false accusation, Ransom posts "What does that say about you, Vince? Hint: It stars with H, and rhymes with "hypocrite.""

Now, Ransom, in future posts, when I state that "Ransom has publicly identified himself as a hypocrite" remember that you're the who provided me with that information.
 
Vince Massi said:
Romans 2:1 tells us that Ransom is describing himself when he posts "You spend more time on this thread lashing out at people who disagree with you, than actually teaching the Bible.

What does that say about you, Vince? Hint: It stars with H, and rhymes with "hypocrite."

Note to T-Bone: Your lies are your own, and they originated with you. All I did was quote Romans 2:1 to show that you are describing yourself.
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Once again I will ask you to post one lie I have stated.  The last time you accused me of this you either could not or would not back up your false accusation. So I will wait for it this time...but I certainly won't hold my breath.  Balls in your court oh son of your father the false accuser & liar!
 
Vince Massi said:
Shortly after I posted an explanation of Scripture, Ransom posts "You spend more time on this thread lashing out at people who disagree with you, than actually teaching the Bible."

Readers, that's as fine an example of "You who judge do the same things."

After describing himself in his false accusation, Ransom posts "What does that say about you, Vince? Hint: It stars with H, and rhymes with "hypocrite.""

Now, Ransom, in future posts, when I state that "Ransom has publicly identified himself as a hypocrite" remember that you're the who provided me with that information.
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Translation: "I know you are, but what am I?"

By the way, Vince has provided a great example of the propaganda technique of "turnspeak": going on the attack against your opponent while claiming to be the victim. Over the years I've seen this countless times from psycho-fundies. They'll attack you six ways from Sunday, but when you dare call them clowns, suddenly they're all "Oh my goodness! I can't believe you said that. Are you even saved?"
 
Another way to spot tares is by their rejection of the authority of God's Word.

John 8:47 "He who is of God hears God's words; therefore you do not hear, because you are not of God."

A surprising thing about this verse is the context. Immediately before the verse, Jesus is talking to Jews who believed on Him. However, the crowd was mixed with saved and unsaved listening together. The unsaved were joined with the saved, and being religious, the tares claimed to believe God's Word.

Looking carefully at the verse itself, Jesus did not identify tares by their rejection of God's Word--He identified them by their refusal to submit to God's Word. When you show from Scripture that something is wrong, and a person defends that sin with scorn and accusations, that person is a tare.
 
Vince Massi said:
Another way to spot tares is by their rejection of the authority of God's Word.

John 8:47 "He who is of God hears God's words; therefore you do not hear, because you are not of God."

A surprising thing about this verse is the context. Immediately before the verse, Jesus is talking to Jews who believed on Him. However, the crowd was mixed with saved and unsaved listening together. The unsaved were joined with the saved, and being religious, the tares claimed to believe God's Word.

Looking carefully at the verse itself, Jesus did not identify tares by their rejection of God's Word--He identified them by their refusal to submit to God's Word. When you show from Scripture that something is wrong, and a person defends that sin with scorn and accusations, that person is a tare.
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Then you better quit lying.
 
"Surely He scorns the scornful, But gives grace to the humble." Proverbs 3:34

The last part of this series on how to succeed in God's work is: Don't be a scorner.

For those who came in late, I had noticed over the years that scorners would sometimes attack someone who posted. A few posters stood up to them, and several scorners would quickly jump in to defend their sins. And the poster always gave up. Always. I had wondered what would happen if someone stood up to the scorners and refused to back down.

When I started a series on How to Succeed in God's work, scorners quickly attacked, and I decided to stand up to them. I expected an outpouring of hatred, because that's what the scorners always did. But I honestly didn't know what would happen next.

It goes without saying that with over 100 hits per day, the scorners failed miserably to stop me from teaching God's Word. But I am surprised at what I learned, and I'll be closing out with a list of what I did learn.
 
Vince Massi said:
When I started a series on How to Succeed in God's work, scorners quickly attacked, and I decided to stand up to them. I expected an outpouring of hatred, because that's what the scorners always did. But I honestly didn't know what would happen next.
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actually Vince , you have done the opposite. you have been confronted and questioned and you have not answered, so in essence, you are lying.
 
Vince Massi said:
"Surely He scorns the scornful, But gives grace to the humble." Proverbs 3:34

The last part of this series on how to succeed in God's work is: Don't be a scorner.

For those who came in late, I had noticed over the years that scorners would sometimes attack someone who posted. A few posters stood up to them, and several scorners would quickly jump in to defend their sins. And the poster always gave up. Always. I had wondered what would happen if someone stood up to the scorners and refused to back down.

When I started a series on How to Succeed in God's work, scorners quickly attacked, and I decided to stand up to them. I expected an outpouring of hatred, because that's what the scorners always did. But I honestly didn't know what would happen next.

It goes without saying that with over 100 hits per day, the scorners failed miserably to stop me from teaching God's Word. But I am surprised at what I learned, and I'll be closing out with a list of what I did learn.
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You learned how to accuse someone of supposedly slandering you without providing any proof. Or did you already know how to do that?  ::)
 
The first thing I learned:

God has cut the scorners off from His blessings.

1) Grace gives us the ability to succeed in God’s work. Grace is produced by humility, and humility comes from submitting to God and His saints. By refusing to submit to God’s commands not to scorn, scorners fail to gain humility, fail to obtain grace, and fail to have God’s blessing for his work.

2) Because scorners have failed to obtain humility, God resists them. “God resists the proud, But gives grace to the humble." James 4:6

3) God will not permit a scorner to possess wisdom. “A scoffer seeks wisdom and does not find it,” Proverbs 14:6 Wisdom opens the way to other vitures, such as understanding and discretion. If scorners had these virtues, they would be more successful in harming the saints, but God does not permit it.

4) Proverbs 9:10 tells us ""The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom," Since scorners do not have wisdom, they do not fear the Lord. “The fear of the Lord is to hate evil,” and “By the fear of the Lord, men depart from evil” are two verses describing the spiritual state of scorners.

5) By rejecting the Word of God in favor of scorn, scorners have cut themselves off from the success God promises to those who cling to His Word.
Joshua 1:8 tells us that our mouths are to be filled with God's Word. People who fill their mouths with scorn, judging, speaking evil of the brethren, etc., are not eligible for the blessings that come from taking a strong stand for God's Word. And the second half of the verse tells us to meditate on His Word day and night.

Psalm1:1-3 tells us "Blessed is the man Who walks not in the counsel of the ungodly, Nor stands in the path of sinners, Nor sits in the seat of the scornful; But his delight is in the law of the LORD, And in His law he meditates day and night. He shall be like a tree planted by the rivers of water, That brings forth its fruit in its season, Whose leaf also shall not wither; And whatever he does shall prosper."

6) The scorners’ disobedience to God’s commands to seek peace with the brethren gives them the ability to produce harm. Hebrews 12:14-15 tells us "Pursue peace with all people, and holiness, without which no one will see the Lord: looking carefully lest anyone fall short of the grace of God; lest any root of bitterness springing up cause trouble, and by this many become defiled;"

7) Jesus does not manifest Himself to scorners who disobey His commands to love the brethren. Obedience also produces success in God's work. John 14:21 tells us "He who has My commandments and keeps them, it is he who loves Me. And he who loves Me will be loved by My Father, and I will love him and manifest Myself to him."

8) God does not answer the prayers of scorners. Psalm 66:18 tells us "If I regard iniquity in my heart, the Lord will not hear me."
 
Ask one of his "100" dear readers. ;)
 
Vince Massi said:
The first thing I learned:

God has cut the scorners off from His blessings.

1) Grace gives us the ability to succeed in God’s work. Grace is produced by humility, and humility comes from submitting to God and His saints. By refusing to submit to God’s commands not to scorn, scorners fail to gain humility, fail to obtain grace, and fail to have God’s blessing for his work.

2) Because scorners have failed to obtain humility, God resists them. “God resists the proud, But gives grace to the humble." James 4:6

3) God will not permit a scorner to possess wisdom. “A scoffer seeks wisdom and does not find it,” Proverbs 14:6 Wisdom opens the way to other vitures, such as understanding and discretion. If scorners had these virtues, they would be more successful in harming the saints, but God does not permit it.

4) Proverbs 9:10 tells us ""The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom," Since scorners do not have wisdom, they do not fear the Lord. “The fear of the Lord is to hate evil,” and “By the fear of the Lord, men depart from evil” are two verses describing the spiritual state of scorners.

5) By rejecting the Word of God in favor of scorn, scorners have cut themselves off from the success God promises to those who cling to His Word.
Joshua 1:8 tells us that our mouths are to be filled with God's Word. People who fill their mouths with scorn, judging, speaking evil of the brethren, etc., are not eligible for the blessings that come from taking a strong stand for God's Word. And the second half of the verse tells us to meditate on His Word day and night.

Psalm1:1-3 tells us "Blessed is the man Who walks not in the counsel of the ungodly, Nor stands in the path of sinners, Nor sits in the seat of the scornful; But his delight is in the law of the LORD, And in His law he meditates day and night. He shall be like a tree planted by the rivers of water, That brings forth its fruit in its season, Whose leaf also shall not wither; And whatever he does shall prosper."

6) The scorners’ disobedience to God’s commands to seek peace with the brethren gives them the ability to produce harm. Hebrews 12:14-15 tells us "Pursue peace with all people, and holiness, without which no one will see the Lord: looking carefully lest anyone fall short of the grace of God; lest any root of bitterness springing up cause trouble, and by this many become defiled;"

7) Jesus does not manifest Himself to scorners who disobey His commands to love the brethren. Obedience also produces success in God's work. John 14:21 tells us "He who has My commandments and keeps them, it is he who loves Me. And he who loves Me will be loved by My Father, and I will love him and manifest Myself to him."

8) God does not answer the prayers of scorners. Psalm 66:18 tells us "If I regard iniquity in my heart, the Lord will not hear me."
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And Vince doesn't answer any questions posed to him. He's nothing but a coward. Oh, and Vince, that's not slander. That's the truth!!
 
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